Regularly Travelling At 60 In A 30. No Remorse
Discussion
yonex said:
Pan Pan said:
And you sound like a low mileage, low skill Sunday driver, who doesn't care about driving safely, or to a decent standard, and doesn't care about how many other drivers journeys you disrupt, who just uses the roads to play with your Sunday toy. the problem is that sometimes you probably do this on a week day.
Any idiot with a hole in his backside can do a few thousand miles a year, and manage to avoid accidents, doing the same at anything above 30 thousand miles per year takes a bit more. This is not about my driving, but about what roads are `actually' for. They are not a playground, for a few low mileage drivers who want to play at being drivers. They are literally the arteries of the country which allow it to survive. Those who only play at being drivers, are the equivalent of a thrombosis. If a persons driving skill is not sufficient to allow them to drive at the low set posted limits, or best speed allowed by road conditions, they should consider whether they are actually suited to operating a motor vehicle on public roads. Some might `want' to be a brain surgeon, or a company director or fighter pilot, but if they do not have the attitude, or aptitude to carry out such activities to a suitable standard, there is no way they should be allowed to engage in them. If people cannot achieve, and maintain at least the low set standards of the driving test, they have no real right to be on the road, as the operator of a motor vehicle.
Actually it is about your driving and self inflated opinion of your skill levels. I would say that if we graded driver mentality yours would have several traits that are not desirable on the public road. Anyway, don't let me stop you, keep digging it is providing much entertainment. Any idiot with a hole in his backside can do a few thousand miles a year, and manage to avoid accidents, doing the same at anything above 30 thousand miles per year takes a bit more. This is not about my driving, but about what roads are `actually' for. They are not a playground, for a few low mileage drivers who want to play at being drivers. They are literally the arteries of the country which allow it to survive. Those who only play at being drivers, are the equivalent of a thrombosis. If a persons driving skill is not sufficient to allow them to drive at the low set posted limits, or best speed allowed by road conditions, they should consider whether they are actually suited to operating a motor vehicle on public roads. Some might `want' to be a brain surgeon, or a company director or fighter pilot, but if they do not have the attitude, or aptitude to carry out such activities to a suitable standard, there is no way they should be allowed to engage in them. If people cannot achieve, and maintain at least the low set standards of the driving test, they have no real right to be on the road, as the operator of a motor vehicle.
Chimune said:
Pan Pan said:
If people cannot achieve, and maintain at least the low set standards of the driving test, they have no real right to be on the road, as the operator of a motor vehicle.
I think we can all agree on this. Getting frustrated at vehicles traveling slower than your calculated 'safe speed' during the driving test, would be a massive failure to reach even those low standards.....
Pan Pan said:
If you believe being able to drive at the posted limit represents an inflated view of a persons driving skill, then your level of driving skill must be Devastatingly low. It might help road users around you, if you could aspire to being able to drive at the posted limit someday!
No I believe you are a bit odd and have a very grand view of yourself and your abilities, which I am questioning. What are you basing your elitist skills on, what exactly are your credentials, motor sport, instructor grading, ex forces, photocopier salesman?Pan Pan said:
Chimune said:
Pan Pan said:
If people cannot achieve, and maintain at least the low set standards of the driving test, they have no real right to be on the road, as the operator of a motor vehicle.
I think we can all agree on this. Getting frustrated at vehicles traveling slower than your calculated 'safe speed' during the driving test, would be a massive failure to reach even those low standards.....
yonex said:
Pan Pan said:
If you believe being able to drive at the posted limit represents an inflated view of a persons driving skill, then your level of driving skill must be Devastatingly low. It might help road users around you, if you could aspire to being able to drive at the posted limit someday!
No I believe you are a bit odd and have a very grand view of yourself and your abilities, which I am questioning. What are you basing your elitist skills on, what exactly are your credentials, motor sport, instructor grading, ex forces, photocopier salesman?Do you ever go above 20 mph on the roads, or is even that just too much for you?
Chimune said:
Pan Pan said:
If people cannot achieve, and maintain at least the low set standards of the driving test, they have no real right to be on the road, as the operator of a motor vehicle.
I think we can all agree on this. Getting frustrated at vehicles traveling slower than your calculated 'safe speed' during the driving test, would be a massive failure to reach even those low standards.....
Pan Pan said:
Since when was driving at the posted limit demonstrating `elitist skills' what an odd thing to say?
Do you ever go above 20 mph on the roads, or is even that just too much for you?
Calm down dear, it's ok, no need to get sniffy. Yes I have just about managed 20mph then just a little more at Donington, Pembrey, Oulton, Mallory, Silverstone...... Now. Why don't we get to the bottom of your anger issues? Do you ever go above 20 mph on the roads, or is even that just too much for you?
pan pan said:
The main point about using a vehicle (any vehicle) must surely be to get from one point on the Earths surface to another as quickly and easily as possible
pan pan said:
since the dawn of time, humans have been trying to go faster, and faster. This seems to be an inbuilt trait for `most' humans.
pan pan said:
But to not travel at the best speed that is possible, given the above limitations, seems remove the point of using any kind of motorised transport in the first place.
pan pan said:
i'm at my most alert when travelling faster
pan pan said:
those who drive really badly do need taking off the roads completely, My criticism is the ease at which the majority of relatively safe road users can become fined and criminalized, for a moments indiscretion.
I'll ask again. What makes you think that the law doesn't apply to you and why is it that you are incapable of controlling your speed, yet claim that 'everyone else' has the issue. Speed Awareness Course, that is what you need.
Pan Pan said:
Chimune said:
Pan Pan said:
If people cannot achieve, and maintain at least the low set standards of the driving test, they have no real right to be on the road, as the operator of a motor vehicle.
I think we can all agree on this. Getting frustrated at vehicles traveling slower than your calculated 'safe speed' during the driving test, would be a massive failure to reach even those low standards.....
What 'adequate progress' means, is an opinion. The opinion of the person doing 10 mph less than you want to, is as valid as yours. Its their 'adequate progress'.
You seem unable to understand this but news flash for panpan:
its never ever, ever, ever going to be any other way. You will have to share the roads with other people until you stop traveling by car. You may as well resolve this bizarre attitude you have (as demonstrated in the selected quotes above) asap.
yonex said:
Pan Pan said:
Since when was driving at the posted limit demonstrating `elitist skills' what an odd thing to say?
Do you ever go above 20 mph on the roads, or is even that just too much for you?
Calm down dear, it's ok, no need to get sniffy. Yes I have just about managed 20mph then just a little more at Donington, Pembrey, Oulton, Mallory, Silverstone...... Now. Why don't we get to the bottom of your anger issues? Do you ever go above 20 mph on the roads, or is even that just too much for you?
pan pan said:
The main point about using a vehicle (any vehicle) must surely be to get from one point on the Earths surface to another as quickly and easily as possible
pan pan said:
since the dawn of time, humans have been trying to go faster, and faster. This seems to be an inbuilt trait for `most' humans.
pan pan said:
But to not travel at the best speed that is possible, given the above limitations, seems remove the point of using any kind of motorised transport in the first place.
pan pan said:
i'm at my most alert when travelling faster
pan pan said:
those who drive really badly do need taking off the roads completely, My criticism is the ease at which the majority of relatively safe road users can become fined and criminalized, for a moments indiscretion.
I'll ask again. What makes you think that the law doesn't apply to you and why is it that you are incapable of controlling your speed, yet claim that 'everyone else' has the issue. Speed Awareness Course, that is what you need.
As for a speed awareness course, these seem to be aimed at those who have transgressed the law in the area of vehicle speed. Since you appear to have attended one, have you been done for travelling at an inappropriate speed on public roads? Are you a low mileage driver?
Pan Pan said:
This is the whole point, I do realize the law applies to me, which is why I take notice of the posted limits and try to travel at the best speed possible at, or within them, and for that matter recognize that there are other road users (including those behind me / around me. It is the ones who do not do this, who are likely to fall foul of the law.
As for a speed awareness course, these seem to be aimed at those who have transgressed the law in the area of vehicle speed. Since you appear to have attended one, have you been done for travelling at an inappropriate speed on public roads? Are you a low mileage driver?
Low mileage, compared to a travelling salesman probably, compared to the average I would say no. Let's work on 12-15K per year. I have quoted what you have said, and keep repeating. You have issues with slower traffic even going as far as to say your driving instructor encouraged speeding? Stating that anyone travelling below 30 is going to 'fall foul of the law' is nonsense. In fact I prefer to reduce the speed in urban areas as the journey time barely suffers and in the event of a collision the impact is greatly reduced by even a few mph, this is not opinion, it is fact. The OP and original point was 60 in a 30, nobody can condone that in any shape or form. I see now you have switched your focus to my mileage rather than attacking my skill? You never did say where you competed, did I miss that?As for a speed awareness course, these seem to be aimed at those who have transgressed the law in the area of vehicle speed. Since you appear to have attended one, have you been done for travelling at an inappropriate speed on public roads? Are you a low mileage driver?
You don't see why drivers should be fined for 'a moments indiscretion', is that on your terms or is there an arbitrary set of rules that you have depending upon the situation? You don't like being held up, it annoys you and you don't understand why people don't understand. These are the signs of someone who needs educating.
Finally, yes. I did attend a SAC a few years ago, changed a few opinions and definitely made me a more considerate driver. On that course there was one, there always is, that just argued and moaned. Unfortunately he was stuck in our group for the workshop type thing and all he wanted to do was talk about how many miles he did and how he was probably more experienced the bloke leading the course.
Go back and read all your quotes, they have a similar theme.
pan pan said:
I do have a problem with those who arrogantly and willfully choose to drive at a speed that they know will cause problems for those behind, who legally wish to travel at the posted limit.
As for your daughter being ill in the car, the best option would be to stop the car, and find out what is wrong with her, rather than trying diagnose the problem whilst also driving a car.
That was in answer to what if the car in front was taking it easy due to poorly child. Get a grip, seriously your schedule is just not that important to anyone else. As for your daughter being ill in the car, the best option would be to stop the car, and find out what is wrong with her, rather than trying diagnose the problem whilst also driving a car.
Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 7th October 14:20
speedking31 said:
This is now a 40, and steps up to 50 before the next set of junctions 
I am a conscientious objector.
I was saddened and disappointed to discover this when I travelled along it recently. I may have behaved in a similar way. I am a conscientious objector.Fwiw, When I did my bike IAM test, on this road, the examiner overtook me and took the left bend approaching the Lymm truck stop at the then limit of 60mph -I'd slowed for the purposes of looking sensible.... He was a traffic policeman and instructor and wasn't a fan of the reducing limits either.
What a load of nonsense the ratcheting down is. Who exactly are the people who usher these "something must be done!" limit reductions through councils?
Edited by MC Bodge on Tuesday 7th October 14:26
This could a brave first(ish) post, but I once got clocked doing 58 in a 30..
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.9630944,-1.63729...
Lifted off at the thirty sign but didn't brake .. can't remember exactly the the next set of lights or two were red but the road was emptpy. Copper's gun got me just into the zone.
Fully my fault with no argument, not entirely sure on remorse but 6 points I'm still carrying with me for another 6 months or so!
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.9630944,-1.63729...
Lifted off at the thirty sign but didn't brake .. can't remember exactly the the next set of lights or two were red but the road was emptpy. Copper's gun got me just into the zone.
Fully my fault with no argument, not entirely sure on remorse but 6 points I'm still carrying with me for another 6 months or so!
yonex said:
Pan Pan said:
This is the whole point, I do realize the law applies to me, which is why I take notice of the posted limits and try to travel at the best speed possible at, or within them, and for that matter recognize that there are other road users (including those behind me / around me. It is the ones who do not do this, who are likely to fall foul of the law.
As for a speed awareness course, these seem to be aimed at those who have transgressed the law in the area of vehicle speed. Since you appear to have attended one, have you been done for travelling at an inappropriate speed on public roads? Are you a low mileage driver?
Low mileage, compared to a travelling salesman probably, compared to the average I would say no. Let's work on 12-15K per year. I have quoted what you have said, and keep repeating. You have issues with slower traffic even going as far as to say your driving instructor encouraged speeding? Stating that anyone travelling below 30 is going to 'fall foul of the law' is nonsense. In fact I prefer to reduce the speed in urban areas as the journey time barely suffers and in the event of a collision the impact is greatly reduced by even a few mph, this is not opinion, it is fact. The OP and original point was 60 in a 30, nobody can condone that in any shape or form. I see now you have switched your focus to my mileage rather than attacking my skill? You never did say where you competed, did I miss that?As for a speed awareness course, these seem to be aimed at those who have transgressed the law in the area of vehicle speed. Since you appear to have attended one, have you been done for travelling at an inappropriate speed on public roads? Are you a low mileage driver?
You don't see why drivers should be fined for 'a moments indiscretion', is that on your terms or is there an arbitrary set of rules that you have depending upon the situation? You don't like being held up, it annoys you and you don't understand why people don't understand. These are the signs of someone who needs educating.
Finally, yes. I did attend a SAC a few years ago, changed a few opinions and definitely made me a more considerate driver. On that course there was one, there always is, that just argued and moaned. Unfortunately he was stuck in our group for the workshop type thing and all he wanted to do was talk about how many miles he did and how he was probably more experienced the bloke leading the course.
Go back and read all your quotes, they have a similar theme.
pan pan said:
I do have a problem with those who arrogantly and willfully choose to drive at a speed that they know will cause problems for those behind, who legally wish to travel at the posted limit.
As for your daughter being ill in the car, the best option would be to stop the car, and find out what is wrong with her, rather than trying diagnose the problem whilst also driving a car.
That was in answer to what if the car in front was taking it easy due to poorly child. Get a grip, seriously your schedule is just not that important to anyone else. As for your daughter being ill in the car, the best option would be to stop the car, and find out what is wrong with her, rather than trying diagnose the problem whilst also driving a car.
Edited by yonex on Tuesday 7th October 14:20
You are trying to make out that low mileage, unaware, myopic dawdlers are harmless road users, when in reality they are every bit as guilty of poor driving technique, as those who massively exceed speed limit or drive too fast in poor conditions.
Pan Pan said:
I would love to see what speed you think is appropriate if you have to get a seriously ill child to hospital in an emergency, As I had to do with a mother and her premature baby, when no ambulance was available. I would love to see how well you stay behind someone dawdling at 27 mph in a 40 zone as was teh case in this situation.
You are trying to make out that low mileage, unaware, myopic dawdlers are harmless road users, when in reality they are every bit as guilty of poor driving technique, as those who massively exceed speed limit or drive too fast in poor conditions.
No, I am saying you have anger issues on the road and are unable to control your speed. Completely different. You fail to recognize the difference between your need to get somewhere and the desire of the drivers around you. An emergency situation is just that, a bit of travel sickness isn't an emergency but may require the car in front slowing a little, maybe even below your defined tolerable speed level. You are trying to make out that low mileage, unaware, myopic dawdlers are harmless road users, when in reality they are every bit as guilty of poor driving technique, as those who massively exceed speed limit or drive too fast in poor conditions.
No more to say.
yonex said:
Pan Pan said:
Since when was driving at the posted limit demonstrating `elitist skills' what an odd thing to say?
Do you ever go above 20 mph on the roads, or is even that just too much for you?
Calm down dear, it's ok, no need to get sniffy. Yes I have just about managed 20mph then just a little more at Donington, Pembrey, Oulton, Mallory, Silverstone...... Now. Why don't we get to the bottom of your anger issues? Do you ever go above 20 mph on the roads, or is even that just too much for you?
pan pan said:
The main point about using a vehicle (any vehicle) must surely be to get from one point on the Earths surface to another as quickly and easily as possible
pan pan said:
since the dawn of time, humans have been trying to go faster, and faster. This seems to be an inbuilt trait for `most' humans.
pan pan said:
But to not travel at the best speed that is possible, given the above limitations, seems remove the point of using any kind of motorised transport in the first place.
pan pan said:
i'm at my most alert when travelling faster
pan pan said:
those who drive really badly do need taking off the roads completely, My criticism is the ease at which the majority of relatively safe road users can become fined and criminalized, for a moments indiscretion.
I'll ask again. What makes you think that the law doesn't apply to you and why is it that you are incapable of controlling your speed, yet claim that 'everyone else' has the issue. Speed Awareness Course, that is what you need.
I am perfectly able to control my speed, which is why despite doing many more miles per year than you on public roads, I have not (yet) had to attend a speed awareness course, through being caught exceeding the speed limit. It seems that you, more than me are unable to control your speed on public roads either by going too slow, or too fast, perhaps another speed awareness course might do you some good???
Pan Pan said:
And you sound like a low mileage, low skill Sunday driver, who doesn't care about driving safely, or to a decent standard
I don't think anyone who advocates dangerously overtaking someone who isn't going at the speed you want is suitably placed to comment on the safety or standard of anyone else's driving.Some posters here seem to miss the rather obvious point that if you're at the front of a queue of traffic, you are forcing all of them to drive no faster than you are - they cannot force you to drive faster.
If your choice of speed is unreasonably less than that of the people you have trapped behind you, then you are being inconsiderate at least.
If your choice of speed is unreasonably less than that of the people you have trapped behind you, then you are being inconsiderate at least.
Mave said:
Pan Pan said:
And you sound like a low mileage, low skill Sunday driver, who doesn't care about driving safely, or to a decent standard
I don't think anyone who advocates dangerously overtaking someone who isn't going at the speed you want is suitably placed to comment on the safety or standard of anyone else's driving.Are you really telling me that you have NEVER overtaken another car? That is what it sounds like.
I try to stay at or within the limits. Do you?
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