Fooking diesel engine faliures !
Discussion
Borrowed my old mans diesel espace to take my daughter to uni on Sunday. Derby to Sheffield. Broke down on the M1, 50 mph section with nowhere to pull off. I now have much more grey hair and a renewed contempt for the things. Dumped it in Sheff and took the train home so have another day to waste retrieving it next week.
As it goes I could probably have fitted everything in my C55 estate so net saving about minus £200 and that's if the engine's not a gonner.
P.O.S
As it goes I could probably have fitted everything in my C55 estate so net saving about minus £200 and that's if the engine's not a gonner.
P.O.SYep it's not just diesels guys, have spent many a penny fixing petrols before! Although my diesel, after 2 years of owner ship has had a new gearbox, clutch and flywheel. To be fair to it, it did the first 100,000 miles faultlessly. And it's quicker than a type r whilst returning 50+ mpg 
My first car was a Focus TDDi. Covered 60k miles nothing broke.
Second a 320d. Covered 60k miles nothing broke (aside from a £12 exhaust bracket)
Current car is a Z4 35i and so far has had in excess of £2k worth of warranty work carried out.
I still prefer the petrol but only because it's fast and makes a nice noise. If I were faced with the choice of a 4pot petrol or diesel I would take the diesel every time. Both sound s
t and have no character but the diesels cost less to run.
Second a 320d. Covered 60k miles nothing broke (aside from a £12 exhaust bracket)
Current car is a Z4 35i and so far has had in excess of £2k worth of warranty work carried out.
I still prefer the petrol but only because it's fast and makes a nice noise. If I were faced with the choice of a 4pot petrol or diesel I would take the diesel every time. Both sound s
t and have no character but the diesels cost less to run.It's just bad luck.
I owned a 1.9 TDI Golf which I had fettled and taken from 105bhp to 221bhp and 365lbft of torque.
I drove it hard but ALWAYS let it warm up fully and cool down properly.
It was serviced every 8k without fail with genuine filters and high quality oil.
I bought it at 99k, was mapped to 149bhp at 103k, 40,000 miles later the stock (factory fitted!!!) turbo was still going strong... big turbo fitted, sold it 6 months later but it was then sold by the new owner with 175k and no major issues to report.
Then again I know someone who's Golf R blew a conrod at 300 miles new.
I was behind a Honda Civic 1.6 LS from the mid 90's that was burning so much oil it was spraying onto my windscreen.
You can't just tar all diesels because you've had some bad fortune
And I don't know where you get a price of £2k from because you can buy the engines for around £500 on Ebay and it's easily a one day job to swap the engine (It's not hard) so you may be able to get the repair price way down by finding another garage or even doing it yourself with a Haynes manual.
I owned a 1.9 TDI Golf which I had fettled and taken from 105bhp to 221bhp and 365lbft of torque.
I drove it hard but ALWAYS let it warm up fully and cool down properly.
It was serviced every 8k without fail with genuine filters and high quality oil.
I bought it at 99k, was mapped to 149bhp at 103k, 40,000 miles later the stock (factory fitted!!!) turbo was still going strong... big turbo fitted, sold it 6 months later but it was then sold by the new owner with 175k and no major issues to report.
Then again I know someone who's Golf R blew a conrod at 300 miles new.
I was behind a Honda Civic 1.6 LS from the mid 90's that was burning so much oil it was spraying onto my windscreen.
You can't just tar all diesels because you've had some bad fortune
And I don't know where you get a price of £2k from because you can buy the engines for around £500 on Ebay and it's easily a one day job to swap the engine (It's not hard) so you may be able to get the repair price way down by finding another garage or even doing it yourself with a Haynes manual.
I was thinking about the wailing and howling about DPF failures in particular that you hear, but I think in 100% of the cases I've heard about it was due to inappropriate use of a DPF equipped vehicle. Some said the dealer hadn't told them about this, which is a communication issue, but as a technology the DPF filters seem to be very reliable if used correctly. I certainly know of nobody personally who has had DPF problems and practically everyone I know and every company car we have must have a DPF.
I'd have to agree with the other posters that diesels are not less reliable than petrols, but they do seem to have nastier bills when they do have problems. I'm sure this is no longer the case with modern direct injection petrols with turbos integrated into their water cooled exhaust manifolds. Most petrols in service now are much lower tech than a modern diesel.
I'd have to agree with the other posters that diesels are not less reliable than petrols, but they do seem to have nastier bills when they do have problems. I'm sure this is no longer the case with modern direct injection petrols with turbos integrated into their water cooled exhaust manifolds. Most petrols in service now are much lower tech than a modern diesel.
Sir Fergie said:
Theres a thread somewhere on here about one of the new 1 litre ecoboost PETROL Focuses that had TWO engines in 62,000 miles.
I know someone who works in our local Ford dealer and they are changing bits all the time on these Ecoboost engines. Even he is shocked at how weak the engines are.However, I am definitely on the Petrol side of the fence working in a Auto electrical / Diesel repair garage, the price of parts is shocking for the new diesel tech. As someone above said, the more tech on the engine there is to pass emissions, they more there is to go wrong.
I'm an electrician so don't get involved too much in the Diesel side of things, but the fitters were looking at an engine the other day (I think it was a VW) with injectors that cost £800 each and it needed four due to dirty/dodgy fuel!
xjay1337 said:
It's just bad luck.
I owned a 1.9 TDI Golf which I had fettled and taken from 105bhp to 221bhp and 365lbft of torque.
I drove it hard but ALWAYS let it warm up fully and cool down properly.
It was serviced every 8k without fail with genuine filters and high quality oil.
I bought it at 99k, was mapped to 149bhp at 103k, 40,000 miles later the stock (factory fitted!!!) turbo was still going strong... big turbo fitted, sold it 6 months later but it was then sold by the new owner with 175k and no major issues to report.
The 1.9PD was the last truly dependable diesel. You've got to be very unlucky to have serious trouble with one this side of 200k.I owned a 1.9 TDI Golf which I had fettled and taken from 105bhp to 221bhp and 365lbft of torque.
I drove it hard but ALWAYS let it warm up fully and cool down properly.
It was serviced every 8k without fail with genuine filters and high quality oil.
I bought it at 99k, was mapped to 149bhp at 103k, 40,000 miles later the stock (factory fitted!!!) turbo was still going strong... big turbo fitted, sold it 6 months later but it was then sold by the new owner with 175k and no major issues to report.
Our 130 is standard, and serviced annually (usually somewhere between 9000 and 12000 miles) with Longlife oil and a genuine VW filter element. Uses about 500ml of oil between services, and still capable of troubling the traction control in 2nd on damp or uneven surfaces.
The only issue we had was an intermittent overboost / limp mode condition. Driving it harder, and stopping use of supermarket diesel seems to have cured it.
I think I've been quite lucky, in that my 2 diesel E46's ran without a hitch (save a snapped alternator belt on the 330d, but it had done 146k at the time). However my sister was less lucky - she had a 136 bhp 320d that munched a turbo, which then took out 2 injectors and the clutch/flywheel resulting in a 3k bill (and the car being flogged for a 118d), then their 150bhp 320d ate a swirl flap and destroyed the engine - £1500 bill.
Only difference I can see is that I used to rev mine out quite frequently, and basically drive them like a petrol. My sister refused to change up above 2500 rpm, and never used full throttle.
I've gone back to petrol now, as they are just better and there is bugger all difference in cost for me. Sadly my sister has decided to get rid of the BMW as it was too unreliable. It's been replaced by a Peugeot. Bless.
Only difference I can see is that I used to rev mine out quite frequently, and basically drive them like a petrol. My sister refused to change up above 2500 rpm, and never used full throttle.
I've gone back to petrol now, as they are just better and there is bugger all difference in cost for me. Sadly my sister has decided to get rid of the BMW as it was too unreliable. It's been replaced by a Peugeot. Bless.
bodhi said:
I think I've been quite lucky, in that my 2 diesel E46's ran without a hitch (save a snapped alternator belt on the 330d, but it had done 146k at the time). However my sister was less lucky - she had a 136 bhp 320d that munched a turbo, which then took out 2 injectors and the clutch/flywheel resulting in a 3k bill (and the car being flogged for a 118d), then their 150bhp 320d ate a swirl flap and destroyed the engine - £1500 bill.
Only difference I can see is that I used to rev mine out quite frequently, and basically drive them like a petrol. My sister refused to change up above 2500 rpm, and never used full throttle.
I've gone back to petrol now, as they are just better and there is bugger all difference in cost for me. Sadly my sister has decided to get rid of the BMW as it was too unreliable. It's been replaced by a Peugeot. Bless.
Which by removing the swirl flaps would have avoided the issue???Only difference I can see is that I used to rev mine out quite frequently, and basically drive them like a petrol. My sister refused to change up above 2500 rpm, and never used full throttle.
I've gone back to petrol now, as they are just better and there is bugger all difference in cost for me. Sadly my sister has decided to get rid of the BMW as it was too unreliable. It's been replaced by a Peugeot. Bless.
Lol
diesel 2 litre quashqi. Wife has had this for three years, at the same time I've been running a big five litred engined BMW.
I get 20mpg she gets 48mpg.
What she saves in fuel she pays straight back to the garage every year to have the DPF filter cleaned, because the DPF filter has no only the ability to block up, but also a software counter on it to remind teh car that its dpf filter light needs to come on once a year and have a reset costing £400.
She's been told that when the light comes on again she will need to buy a new dpf filter costing £2k. Can't be fitted by me as it requires the software from the garage to reset the software counter. Can't pass an MOT with the DPF light on. Can't remove the DPF anymore because it'll fail the MOT.
I have spent less in real terms on my five litre car than she has on hers.
I get 20mpg she gets 48mpg.
What she saves in fuel she pays straight back to the garage every year to have the DPF filter cleaned, because the DPF filter has no only the ability to block up, but also a software counter on it to remind teh car that its dpf filter light needs to come on once a year and have a reset costing £400.
She's been told that when the light comes on again she will need to buy a new dpf filter costing £2k. Can't be fitted by me as it requires the software from the garage to reset the software counter. Can't pass an MOT with the DPF light on. Can't remove the DPF anymore because it'll fail the MOT.
I have spent less in real terms on my five litre car than she has on hers.
I've had diesel's for years, some to big mileages and have never had any expensive 'diesel' related failure. In fact the only failures I can think of have been two injectors that have been refurbished at a cost of about £120 each - probably cheaper than a petrol injector.
I see some stupid examples like the Espace, where the 1.9 engines have a habit of lunching their Turbo's to go on to destroy themselves running on Oil. It's a bad design. Cashqui above sounds like good design if your a dealer.....
It might just be my usage which is mainly long haul so suits the engines well.
I see some stupid examples like the Espace, where the 1.9 engines have a habit of lunching their Turbo's to go on to destroy themselves running on Oil. It's a bad design. Cashqui above sounds like good design if your a dealer.....
It might just be my usage which is mainly long haul so suits the engines well.
julian64 said:
diesel 2 litre quashqi. Wife has had this for three years, at the same time I've been running a big five litred engined BMW.
I get 20mpg she gets 48mpg.
What she saves in fuel she pays straight back to the garage every year to have the DPF filter cleaned, because the DPF filter has no only the ability to block up, but also a software counter on it to remind teh car that its dpf filter light needs to come on once a year and have a reset costing £400.
She's been told that when the light comes on again she will need to buy a new dpf filter costing £2k. Can't be fitted by me as it requires the software from the garage to reset the software counter. Can't pass an MOT with the DPF light on. Can't remove the DPF anymore because it'll fail the MOT.
I have spent less in real terms on my five litre car than she has on hers.
Really? No man maths going on there?I get 20mpg she gets 48mpg.
What she saves in fuel she pays straight back to the garage every year to have the DPF filter cleaned, because the DPF filter has no only the ability to block up, but also a software counter on it to remind teh car that its dpf filter light needs to come on once a year and have a reset costing £400.
She's been told that when the light comes on again she will need to buy a new dpf filter costing £2k. Can't be fitted by me as it requires the software from the garage to reset the software counter. Can't pass an MOT with the DPF light on. Can't remove the DPF anymore because it'll fail the MOT.
I have spent less in real terms on my five litre car than she has on hers.
Even if you both only do 5000 miles per year she's saving more than 400 a year on fuel compared to you.
£2000 to do the DPF? I suggest you go to a decent independant garage. I know people who've had to replace the DPF on cars before but I don't know anyone who has had to pay £2000. One guy on his Alfa GT Diesel who was doing a daily commute of 4 miles each way had his block up once in 7 years of ownership. It cost about 1000 to replace it at a main dealer.
So you can't fit the DPF and take the car to the dealer to get the software bit done? £400 every year as well? Does your wife actually do the right kind of driving for a diesel or is she just using the car for short trips? It sounds like your real problem is more to do with the main dealer treating you like a couple of fools and/or your wife owning the wrong car for the kind of driving she does.
Devil2575 said:
julian64 said:
diesel 2 litre quashqi. Wife has had this for three years, at the same time I've been running a big five litred engined BMW.
I get 20mpg she gets 48mpg.
What she saves in fuel she pays straight back to the garage every year to have the DPF filter cleaned, because the DPF filter has no only the ability to block up, but also a software counter on it to remind teh car that its dpf filter light needs to come on once a year and have a reset costing £400.
She's been told that when the light comes on again she will need to buy a new dpf filter costing £2k. Can't be fitted by me as it requires the software from the garage to reset the software counter. Can't pass an MOT with the DPF light on. Can't remove the DPF anymore because it'll fail the MOT.
I have spent less in real terms on my five litre car than she has on hers.
Really? No man maths going on there?I get 20mpg she gets 48mpg.
What she saves in fuel she pays straight back to the garage every year to have the DPF filter cleaned, because the DPF filter has no only the ability to block up, but also a software counter on it to remind teh car that its dpf filter light needs to come on once a year and have a reset costing £400.
She's been told that when the light comes on again she will need to buy a new dpf filter costing £2k. Can't be fitted by me as it requires the software from the garage to reset the software counter. Can't pass an MOT with the DPF light on. Can't remove the DPF anymore because it'll fail the MOT.
I have spent less in real terms on my five litre car than she has on hers.
Even if you both only do 5000 miles per year she's saving more than 400 a year on fuel compared to you.
£2000 to do the DPF? I suggest you go to a decent independant garage. I know people who've had to replace the DPF on cars before but I don't know anyone who has had to pay £2000. One guy on his Alfa GT Diesel who was doing a daily commute of 4 miles each way had his block up once in 7 years of ownership. It cost about 1000 to replace it at a main dealer.
So you can't fit the DPF and take the car to the dealer to get the software bit done? £400 every year as well? Does your wife actually do the right kind of driving for a diesel or is she just using the car for short trips? It sounds like your real problem is more to do with the main dealer treating you like a couple of fools and/or your wife owning the wrong car for the kind of driving she does.
I completely understand she can go indie and get it done for less, but again I repect her position on wanting a complete dealer service history.
I don't think its disingenuous to compare a thirsty petrol that doesn't go to main dealers because it doesn't go wrong, with a car that does.
julian64 said:
Motorways most days in what was advertised as a 'TOWN CAR', so I suspect she is probably one of the least affected. Wife likes dealer stamps in her service book, and while I don't agree with her I respect her position. In neary four years of motoring she has had to have the DPF cleaned three times. Each time they tell us that we can risk £400 for a clean but if it doesn't work we have to pay them the £400 plus the cost of the DPF replacement at £2K.
I completely understand she can go indie and get it done for less, but again I repect her position on wanting a complete dealer service history.
I don't think its disingenuous to compare a thirsty petrol that doesn't go to main dealers because it doesn't go wrong, with a car that does.
My point was that mile for mile the difference in fuel economy will more than make up for main dealer thievery. Also it's not a fair comparison if one car is doing lots of miles and another isn't.I completely understand she can go indie and get it done for less, but again I repect her position on wanting a complete dealer service history.
I don't think its disingenuous to compare a thirsty petrol that doesn't go to main dealers because it doesn't go wrong, with a car that does.
My mates triump TR6 costs him less to run than his daily drive, because it only comes out on sunny weekends and it's serviced by a mate rather than a main dealer. Is that a fair comparison?
You can respect your wifes view, that's fair enough, but I think she's being robbed. You might want to discuss with her the fact that the dealer is possibly taking her for a ride. Have you tried speaking to a different main dealer? When I priced up replacing the cam belt on my wifes Mazda 6 the prices from main dealers vaired by hundreds of pounds. Our local dealer wanted £900 but another one wanted £1200. As it was we got it done by an indy for about 600 including a service.
You can also maintain a dealer stamp for services but get work done elsewhere you know.
Defaulting to the main dealer for repairs like that without speaking to a good independent first is a bit daft really.
If the dpf needs "cleaning" every year then there's something wrong with it surely? Or the dealer is taking the piss. I was under the impression that they should regenerate on the fly and should see you well past 100k miles?
If the dpf needs "cleaning" every year then there's something wrong with it surely? Or the dealer is taking the piss. I was under the impression that they should regenerate on the fly and should see you well past 100k miles?
Interesting thread.
Note most of the 'my diesel has done x million troublefree miles' comments come from those with engine designs well over a decade old.
Landcruiser, old Berlingo, 306 diesels etc have been mentioned - they'll all last forever as there's no polar bear protection anti-emissions rubbish nailed to them. If it's basic enough to run on veg oil it'll live forever.
Same goes for the Z4 petrol fuel pump problems - that'll be the N53 engine with daft high pressure fuel injection - again, designed to improve economy and emissions 'cos EU says so, but by the time it's out of warranty it's a liability.
Note most of the 'my diesel has done x million troublefree miles' comments come from those with engine designs well over a decade old.
Landcruiser, old Berlingo, 306 diesels etc have been mentioned - they'll all last forever as there's no polar bear protection anti-emissions rubbish nailed to them. If it's basic enough to run on veg oil it'll live forever.
Same goes for the Z4 petrol fuel pump problems - that'll be the N53 engine with daft high pressure fuel injection - again, designed to improve economy and emissions 'cos EU says so, but by the time it's out of warranty it's a liability.
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