RE: Lotus boss Jean-Marc Gales: PH Meets
Discussion
I honestly cannot understand why JLR have not bought this company!!!?
It must be bargain basement price right now and JLR is flying high - British heritage, semi-prestige brand, no obvious internal competition, engineerng expertise to benefit the wider range.
It's a massive no-brainer and I cannot fathom why it isn't already a done deal. Does anyone know?
It must be bargain basement price right now and JLR is flying high - British heritage, semi-prestige brand, no obvious internal competition, engineerng expertise to benefit the wider range.
It's a massive no-brainer and I cannot fathom why it isn't already a done deal. Does anyone know?
Mrdemon, this and other interviews/press releases have clearly stated that -
- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
Marwood79 said:
I honestly cannot understand why JLR have not bought this company!!!?
It must be bargain basement price right now and JLR is flying high - British heritage, semi-prestige brand, no obvious internal competition, engineerng expertise to benefit the wider range.
It's a massive no-brainer and I cannot fathom why it isn't already a done deal. Does anyone know?
probably because they are not even servicing their debt It must be bargain basement price right now and JLR is flying high - British heritage, semi-prestige brand, no obvious internal competition, engineerng expertise to benefit the wider range.
It's a massive no-brainer and I cannot fathom why it isn't already a done deal. Does anyone know?
Hedgerley said:
Mrdemon, this and other interviews/press releases have clearly stated that -
- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
Yes sales up 110%, but let's not forget 2 is an increase of 100% over 1 so I wouldnt get carried away with that particular stat puffed out by the PR team- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
Increasing dealers is not the answer- you will just end up with more costs- good cars will sell
The fact is that under Bahar they were at least developing new models- the current plan to keep developing the existing models is what they have been doing already and where has it got them?
The sad fact is that I just see this going the way of MG Rover- no new investment and people buying ( or not!) for purely nostalgic reasons when the more logical ones dont add up
A real shame
mrdemon said:
"The three are still the dynamic benchmark in their segments "
he is dreaming.
Is he? Nothing you said in your post argues against it. The current Lotus line-up may have its problems, but lack of dynamic qualities is not one of them. Arguably the latter come into sharper focus as the competition is drifting towards faster, but less involving and more 'digital' feeling cars...he is dreaming.
The cars are too expensive. I appreciate that inflation has a huge effect on these things, but to be paying £35k for an Elise seems bonkers. You're going to have to REALLY want one to choose it over something like a Cayman, which is comfortable, has a boot and can easily be used every day. An Elise takes commitment and at that kind of price you need to be pulling in a few quid to have one as a second car.
Hedgerley said:
Mrdemon, this and other interviews/press releases have clearly stated that -
- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
costs have gone up the Sports racer is £67k !! and they give you it for 50% interest free and still no sales.- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
they don't need a restyle or even higher quality or dare I say it more BHP
they need a new engine , to lose 100kg and to drop the price 15k to £52k ish
as for the V6 Exige, again very low UK sales, I do like the V6 Exige but not at the price they want for it as a summer toy.
they need a main stream car which is better than a Cayman/Boxster. not enough Exige buyers to make the money.
This decision makes Lotus seem rather unreliable, rudderless. At least they had stated Bahar's strategy was contingent on additional investment, so it's understandable that the cars would never actually come out.
Predictably, when the new owners took control, the range got canned except the Esprit because their development were not advanced enough - which, again, is understandable. Though the Elan simply seemed to be a reskin of the Evora, but whatever, let's take them at their word.
But now, they go and cancel a car that they kept insisting was coming out, that development was proceeding as expected. So far, Lotus has reneged on promises of M250 and Esprit which I believe will make customers reluctant to commit to future models, put down deposits, etc.
Lotus should pick a course and stick to it. They were claiming VVA made it affordable to develop 5 models and now they are saying even 1 is a stretch. It's hard to take their future plans seriously when they keep changing and when customers don't commit, it's hard to gauge the market and see the Project through. It's a vicious cycle and Lotus seems to be repeatedly shooting themselves in the foot.
Predictably, when the new owners took control, the range got canned except the Esprit because their development were not advanced enough - which, again, is understandable. Though the Elan simply seemed to be a reskin of the Evora, but whatever, let's take them at their word.
But now, they go and cancel a car that they kept insisting was coming out, that development was proceeding as expected. So far, Lotus has reneged on promises of M250 and Esprit which I believe will make customers reluctant to commit to future models, put down deposits, etc.
Lotus should pick a course and stick to it. They were claiming VVA made it affordable to develop 5 models and now they are saying even 1 is a stretch. It's hard to take their future plans seriously when they keep changing and when customers don't commit, it's hard to gauge the market and see the Project through. It's a vicious cycle and Lotus seems to be repeatedly shooting themselves in the foot.
OK, I am an eternal optimist ad Lotus owner so I guess I am biased. I also accept that there are problems with the current range and price points when compared to the competition. But the fact is people are buying the cars again. Production is up to about 40 units a week and there is a waiting list of several months for the Exige V6 at the moment.
The stats aren't just 'puffed out' out by PR. They are actual sales volumes reported by SMMT and their international equivalents. Granted the numbers aren't huge, but from where they were these are decent improvements. If they hit 2,400 this year as predicted, that will be double what they sold last year.
So lets at least be glad Lotus is heading in the right direction and hope that increased sales and hopefully new investment soon will eventually fund new models.
The stats aren't just 'puffed out' out by PR. They are actual sales volumes reported by SMMT and their international equivalents. Granted the numbers aren't huge, but from where they were these are decent improvements. If they hit 2,400 this year as predicted, that will be double what they sold last year.
So lets at least be glad Lotus is heading in the right direction and hope that increased sales and hopefully new investment soon will eventually fund new models.
mrdemon said:
as for the V6 Exige, again very low UK sales, I do like the V6 Exige but not at the price they want for it as a summer toy
I don't think that price is the problem there. A 170mph Lotus for the price of a 4C sounds great initially. The current Ex is about 50% heavier than the original and the V6 engine probably puts it too close to the Evora market so buyers take the tuned Elise for a toy or an Ev for everyday use leaving the Ex left in the middle with no buyers.whether or not it's the Exige or the Evora that's the best seller is almost irrelevant. If their policy is to improve the existing line up, for me the Evora is the key car that if developed correctly could reap the most rewards.
In light of the TVR situation and putting Porsche to one side for a minute, there isn't actually too much completion in that sector, which only serves to highlight how far off the pace they are at the moment.
The problem in my opinion started with the 2 + 2 concept and the decision to push the engine so far back and effectively set their stall out that the competition was/is a 911. The main thing it has in common with a 911 is the rear biased weight distribution!!
Lotus need to accept the Evora is up against the Cayman and is around 8k too expensive for each of the two models.
I would argue it's around 50kg - 75kg too heavy, but it's still a great car and (IMO) still a good looker. With a price and weight drop, along with another 20bhp and a slightly better spec as standard, it could well give potential sports car buyers a real dilemma!!
In light of the TVR situation and putting Porsche to one side for a minute, there isn't actually too much completion in that sector, which only serves to highlight how far off the pace they are at the moment.
The problem in my opinion started with the 2 + 2 concept and the decision to push the engine so far back and effectively set their stall out that the competition was/is a 911. The main thing it has in common with a 911 is the rear biased weight distribution!!
Lotus need to accept the Evora is up against the Cayman and is around 8k too expensive for each of the two models.
I would argue it's around 50kg - 75kg too heavy, but it's still a great car and (IMO) still a good looker. With a price and weight drop, along with another 20bhp and a slightly better spec as standard, it could well give potential sports car buyers a real dilemma!!
Ryvita said:
Sell more cars.
Cut costs.
Better dealer network.
Convertible Evora.
Maintain DNA of lightness and simplicity.
Well it's certainly everything that everyone's been saying for ages..
Yes that all sounds great and i agree Bahaha had his heads in the clouds, but for me i think this new strategy is missing a "halo" car and i fear that the new esprit could have been that vehicle for them..Cut costs.
Better dealer network.
Convertible Evora.
Maintain DNA of lightness and simplicity.
Well it's certainly everything that everyone's been saying for ages..
I am completely biased, and I wish Lotus the very best in whatever they decide, but to me there's a simple one of two choices to make. Option one is downsize and become the next 'profitable' Caterham, or option two is to upsize and try to take on the Porsche's of the world. If it were me I'd be going with the former. Trying to carry on as they are, whether under previous/current/future management is never going to return huge profits, cars are too niche, market is too narrow. I only hope Lotus continue to exist for generations to come.
mrdemon said:
Hedgerley said:
Mrdemon, this and other interviews/press releases have clearly stated that -
- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
costs have gone up the Sports racer is £67k !! and they give you it for 50% interest free and still no sales.- cost/quality have been and will continue to be addressed, as testified by current owners
- architecture is being addressed to improve access
- higher power versions of the Evora are imminent as well as a front end re-style
- have you read the print and online reviews of the Exige V6? Try this for starters - http://youtu.be/Y_X-cyhk63I
- additional dealers are needed and the recent additions to the network have significantly boosted sales
- sales are at their highest for 3 years and growing
As for the UK - sales are up 110% this year so your comment makes no sense.
http://www.lotuscars.com/gb/news/corporate/another...
they don't need a restyle or even higher quality or dare I say it more BHP
they need a new engine , to lose 100kg and to drop the price 15k to £52k ish
as for the V6 Exige, again very low UK sales, I do like the V6 Exige but not at the price they want for it as a summer toy.
they need a main stream car which is better than a Cayman/Boxster. not enough Exige buyers to make the money.
Lotus had DBs restored Esprit on the stand at the Goodwood FoS in 2011, in amongst all the then current cars and the 'new' Esprit concept. Folk were asking when the car would be available, how much was it and could they go on the waiting list. They were asking about DBs V8, below......
Perhaps he didn't get the memo.
Perhaps he didn't get the memo.
TA14 said:
I don't think that price is the problem there. A 170mph Lotus for the price of a 4C sounds great initially. The current Ex is about 50% heavier than the original and the V6 engine probably puts it too close to the Evora market so buyers take the tuned Elise for a toy or an Ev for everyday use leaving the Ex left in the middle with no buyers.
So why is the Exige the current bestseller?Dave Hedgehog said:
and what's this nonsense about V8's, why not just use the one toyota use in the RC F??? the toyota V6 is good enough after all
Anything lotus builds is going to be a second car for the majority of buyers these days and a 1.8 is just never going to feel that special, nobody cares about mpg in a weekend car anyway (everything is more or less the same when you give it some beans isn't it?).
bang in a lexus v8, make the interior feel a bit more special with a few bits of leather/alcantara and get a fantastic design team on it, the thing would be a massive sales success. Look at the current prices of 964's and 355's etc, folks are crying out for this sort of car
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