Trafford Centre ****wittery.
Discussion
I'd planned to go to this on Sunday. I thought it would be a handful of nice cars on display. So before I set off I thought I'll just check out if there's anything on youtube about last years. I watched about a minute of last years and thought, its full of chavs, with beatboxes doing stupid stuff that will likely kill someone and so I didn't go.
Luckily this post has proven it was a good idea to stay home. I hope no one was injured.
Luckily this post has proven it was a good idea to stay home. I hope no one was injured.
hora said:
I'd be gobsmacked if it was 10k. I was flapping about a £600 Enterprise one.
Shirley you can take out an additional significant damage waiver?
Theres no chance I'd spend the high £ to hire a car and then have that hanging over the day too.
You can take out a waiver yes but if you are the sort of bloke to rip the numberplate off straight away I doubt that it was the case...Shirley you can take out an additional significant damage waiver?
Theres no chance I'd spend the high £ to hire a car and then have that hanging over the day too.
greggy50 said:
hora said:
I'd be gobsmacked if it was 10k. I was flapping about a £600 Enterprise one.
Shirley you can take out an additional significant damage waiver?
Theres no chance I'd spend the high £ to hire a car and then have that hanging over the day too.
You can take out a waiver yes but if you are the sort of bloke to rip the numberplate off straight away I doubt that it was the case...Shirley you can take out an additional significant damage waiver?
Theres no chance I'd spend the high £ to hire a car and then have that hanging over the day too.
greggy50 said:
hora said:
I'd be gobsmacked if it was 10k. I was flapping about a £600 Enterprise one.
Shirley you can take out an additional significant damage waiver?
Theres no chance I'd spend the high £ to hire a car and then have that hanging over the day too.
You can take out a waiver yes but if you are the sort of bloke to rip the numberplate off straight away I doubt that it was the case...Shirley you can take out an additional significant damage waiver?
Theres no chance I'd spend the high £ to hire a car and then have that hanging over the day too.
Edited by burwoodman on Monday 29th September 14:40
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Re the insurance, it could well be that after a couple of years they have made a lot of money from the premiums anyway and sure, maybe they have a 10k excess. I think you would be surprised or not as to how many hire companies levy heavy fees for tyre wear etc.
I'm no saint but I don't understand why the police are not really clamping down on this sort of behaviour.
Loon R1 may comment on insurers of privately owned cars crashing and having this sort of video evidence. I'm surprised by from what I have read, insurers will still pay out because it is hard to prove. It used to be that you didn't have to be legally over the limit for an insurer to decline a claim. 'back in the day' if you consumed a few beers and were legal, you were still not getting a pay out. That appears to have changed. Same with travel insurance. It would appear you have to be pretty well trolleyed to avoid a pay out
J4CKO said:
Are cars like that difficult to handle or is that just a lack of experience of RWD and 500 plus bhp on bone dry tarmac ? both seemed to snap back the other way.
Ok, the correct answer is don't do it in the first place but assuming that you are doing that same thing, in the same circumstance, how would he have avoided that, less throttle, keeping his foot down ?
It seemed to change gear, would that have been a manual shift or the box doing it itself ? am guessing he would have turned the ESP off ? would have thought the Merc, even with it on would allow a bit of slip ?
Lift off oversteer. Once you're at a sufficient angle & speed no electronics are going to save you. Only remedy I think is experience (or not doing it in the first place).Ok, the correct answer is don't do it in the first place but assuming that you are doing that same thing, in the same circumstance, how would he have avoided that, less throttle, keeping his foot down ?
It seemed to change gear, would that have been a manual shift or the box doing it itself ? am guessing he would have turned the ESP off ? would have thought the Merc, even with it on would allow a bit of slip ?
I'm quite willing to be told otherwise but I don't think the traction control or whatever in these sorts of cars is so severe that it would stop you doing something like this if you put your mind to it. Obviously if it's switched off all bets are off.
Durzel said:
J4CKO said:
Are cars like that difficult to handle or is that just a lack of experience of RWD and 500 plus bhp on bone dry tarmac ? both seemed to snap back the other way.
Ok, the correct answer is don't do it in the first place but assuming that you are doing that same thing, in the same circumstance, how would he have avoided that, less throttle, keeping his foot down ?
It seemed to change gear, would that have been a manual shift or the box doing it itself ? am guessing he would have turned the ESP off ? would have thought the Merc, even with it on would allow a bit of slip ?
Lift off oversteer. Once you're at a sufficient angle & speed no electronics are going to save you. Only remedy I think is experience (or not doing it in the first place).Ok, the correct answer is don't do it in the first place but assuming that you are doing that same thing, in the same circumstance, how would he have avoided that, less throttle, keeping his foot down ?
It seemed to change gear, would that have been a manual shift or the box doing it itself ? am guessing he would have turned the ESP off ? would have thought the Merc, even with it on would allow a bit of slip ?
I'm quite willing to be told otherwise but I don't think the traction control or whatever in these sorts of cars is so severe that it would stop you doing something like this if you put your mind to it. Obviously if it's switched off all bets are off.
There appears to be quite a few changes in road contours off those roundabouts having watched several of the videos. The Jag is a pussycat to drive at 9/10s. My wife loves ours and does enjoy the power. We've overtaken people off roundabouts with a bit of unintentional wheelspin and a degree or two of yaw until corrected when in the wet. I've had the back step out smartly once, when admittedly showing off a bit to my dad, and it stepped out faster than I expected/had experienced to date but I was accelerating harder than I felt I had any right to in the pissing rain through around 50mph round a tightish bend so in truth I was seriously provoking it. In the dry it's a pussy cat. I've never driven it with DSC off though. It has normal which allows enough yaw angle on the road to frighten if caught unaware. DSC TRAC lets you hang the tail out pretty much as far as the steering lock will allow and it can be switched completely off for reasons which remain a mystery to me.
I'm 11 years older than the pilot in these videos though and have been driving rear wheel drive cars for most of it so have been building up to high performance for a while and take a lot of things a 22 year old needs to know for granted. Above all though - a shopping centre carpark and a crowd of smartphone armed kids goading me would not be where I decided to switch the DSC off for the first time and welly the loud pedal with nowhere to run off if/when it goes wrong.
ETA - I doubt that Jag will be a Cat D. The front bumper isn't too bad. The back one may need replaced and the sideskirt may have gone too. The rear suspension is alloy control arms with a cotter pin at the bottom for the hub carrier, a balljoint at the top for the hub carrier and there's a toe control arm with a pinned joint either end. Looks like he's just broken the top balljoint and bent the toe control arm. The forged alloys aren't cheap though, but I really can't see the repair adding up to Cat D territory.
Edited by jamieduff1981 on Monday 29th September 15:16
Shnozz said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Ironic that jealousy and the age-old small appendage insinuation are referenced in the same post.I thought that was just the opinion of people who could not and never will in a million years be able to afford such a car?
EDIT - It appears you and your wife are not this kind of cock - you replied before I finished writing this.. sorry, haha.... plenty exist though.
And as for comments about money laundering being the only way people from 'poor areas' can afford nice metal - what an utter load of jibberish! I am sure there are the minority drug dealers doing this but the rest will have jobs and pay for it this way, however hard it is of you to believe - Not everybody ploughs all of their wages into renting a boxroom bedsit in London you know!
Edited by Rick1.8t on Monday 29th September 15:15
Edited by Rick1.8t on Monday 29th September 15:17
Lost soul said:
Shnozz said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Ironic that jealousy and the age-old small appendage insinuation are referenced in the same post.However, to make reference to a sensibly driven but loud coloured supercar as someone making up in the trouser department is akin to something my grauniad-reading acquaintances might say.
ESP systems aren't totally infallible, but they are pretty good and will deal with a fair old mess better than most people can imagine, they aren't however immune to physics, I have only had mine step out once with any alarm, and that was in the wet coming off a roundabout that has a bit of a bump that unloads the rear tyres, without it on/available you are super careful and on it, with it on it is easy to lean on it, dont, as sometimes it runs out of ideas, the bloke in the 458 that was showing me how much faster a 458 is than a 350Z had a similar, potentially much more expensive moment, this made him decide he didnt need to make his point as we both already knew the outcome to that one.
J4CKO said:
ESP systems aren't totally infallible, but they are pretty good and will deal with a fair old mess better than most people can imagine, they aren't however immune to physics, I have only had mine step out once with any alarm, and that was in the wet coming off a roundabout that has a bit of a bump that unloads the rear tyres, without it on/available you are super careful and on it, with it on it is easy to lean on it, dont, as sometimes it runs out of ideas, the bloke in the 458 that was showing me how much faster a 458 is than a 350Z had a similar, potentially much more expensive moment, this made him decide he didnt need to make his point as we both already knew the outcome to that one.
Hehe. When I had not long had my Cerbera I took it out to visit my older friend who has a few nice cars. I gave him a drive and all was fine. He offered me a drive of his California but it was low on fuel so we set off to fill it up before I had a drive. He promptly lost the back end of it leaving his own house - cold tyres, funny road cambers and most of all, inattention!Rick1.8t said:
And as for comments about money laundering being the only way people from 'poor areas' can afford nice metal - what an utter load of jibberish! I am sure there are the minority drug dealers doing this but the rest will have jobs and pay for it this way, however hard it is of you to believe - Not everybody ploughs all of their wages into renting a boxroom bedsit in London you know!
Amazing how profitable those Bratfut takeaways are.Rick1.8t said:
Shnozz said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Ironic that jealousy and the age-old small appendage insinuation are referenced in the same post.I thought that was just the opinion of people who could not and never will in a million years be able to afford such a car?
EDIT - It appears you and your wife are not this kind of cock - you replied before I finished writing this.. sorry, haha.... plenty exist though.
And as for comments about money laundering being the only way people from 'poor areas' can afford nice metal - what an utter load of jibberish! I am sure there are the minority drug dealers doing this but the rest will have jobs and pay for it this way, however hard it is of you to believe - Not everybody ploughs all of their wages into renting a boxroom bedsit in London you know!
Edited by Rick1.8t on Monday 29th September 15:15
Edited by Rick1.8t on Monday 29th September 15:17
Carousel scams, Counterfeiting, Crash for Cash, Tax Evasion, Drugs, Duty Evasion, Card Fraud etc etc.
It isn't always confined to dodgy areas either, some very shady characters here in the leafy lanes of Cheshire.
Rick1.8t said:
And as for comments about money laundering being the only way people from 'poor areas' can afford nice metal - what an utter load of jibberish! I am sure there are the minority drug dealers doing this but the rest will have jobs and pay for it this way, however hard it is of you to believe - Not everybody ploughs all of their wages into renting a boxroom bedsit in London you know!
I was at the show and said to a friend "Everyone here seems to be walking around like they're a drug dealer. The reality will be they'll own a bed factory and make a tidy legal profit then try and act like a gangster 
"Ironic.
With regards to ESP, in that sort of car, I'd be fairly stunned if you were capable of getting that much yaw in the dry in a normal setting, and even if it was in a 'loose' setting it'd take a fair lack of talent to actually lose control like that.
Having said that if it was something a bit more fruity like a 458 or something I'd say it was clumsy but forgivable.
To me it looked like it was ESP off completely.
Having said that if it was something a bit more fruity like a 458 or something I'd say it was clumsy but forgivable.
To me it looked like it was ESP off completely.
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