RE: Enough exhaust noise already: Tell Me I'm Wrong
Discussion
anonymous said:
[redacted]
The 320i was always considered the best sounding E36 (M3 excepted).FWIW, one of the best things about my E30 was how it sounded. Old skool (relatively) straight six, no cat - lovely stuff with the roof down in a tunnel.
For me, the Porsche in question seems a bit 'try hard'. But then again, I probably wouldn't be using the 'Sport' map in town. The other thing to cinsider is 3rd party perception. Heaven forbid you have an incident with a pedestrian or another car, witnesses will almost certainly say you were speeding owing to the sound of the exhaust.
I was driving the other day, when I half noticed a Porsche Panamera sat in front of me. I paid little attention, as I was mid conversation and don't really like their bulk. Anyway after a while, when I paid more notice it dawned on me it was actually the new Boxster. Damn! They are huge and clumsy looking from the rear aren't they! What a major step backwards that was.
Haven't had a chance to read the article yet, but I can already say you're not wrong. I think the genesis of this was in the first DSG GTI Golf where the exhaust would make a little noise between shifts; although not unpleasant, it seemed so fake in that it was exactly the same each time.
I think customers of Ferrari and Jag have made their feelings heard. I know that Jag have been working at making the F type a little less loud- the earlier V6s in particular seem almost illegal in terms of noise.
I think customers of Ferrari and Jag have made their feelings heard. I know that Jag have been working at making the F type a little less loud- the earlier V6s in particular seem almost illegal in terms of noise.
k-ink said:
I was driving the other day, when I half noticed a Porsche Panamera sat in front of me. I paid little attention, as I was mid conversation and don't really like their bulk. Anyway after a while, when I paid more notice it dawned on me it was actually the new Boxster. Damn! They are huge and clumsy looking from the rear aren't they! What a major step backwards that was.
Each to their own. I've always thought the first two generations of Boxster looked rather apologetic and deserved of its 'hairdressers car' accusations, and it's only this latest generation that actually looks good.
The old cars also looked a bit pushme/pullme (or is it pushme/pullyou?)
They just need to tune exhausts with a three-way approach.
Quiet, normal, and loud.
You can then pick what you want.
Anything beyond letting the engine breathe normally and sound the way it sounds through such pre-sets is just silly really.
Well, I'm all for active exhausts, but I'm assuming what happens on these fancy systems is a fully dynamic situation rather than a consistent one. Ie, open valves at 6000rpm+ and let all hell break loose.
But at 30% load in X gear, with it in sport extra plus with tt mode selected on the gearbox speed and stiff dampers, THEN make it crackle at 60% crackliness. That is just completely wk, and yet I bet engineers get paid to calibrate such st!
Dave
Quiet, normal, and loud.
You can then pick what you want.
Anything beyond letting the engine breathe normally and sound the way it sounds through such pre-sets is just silly really.
Well, I'm all for active exhausts, but I'm assuming what happens on these fancy systems is a fully dynamic situation rather than a consistent one. Ie, open valves at 6000rpm+ and let all hell break loose.
But at 30% load in X gear, with it in sport extra plus with tt mode selected on the gearbox speed and stiff dampers, THEN make it crackle at 60% crackliness. That is just completely wk, and yet I bet engineers get paid to calibrate such st!
Dave
At the end of the day a Porsche is mainly for blasting about PH style but because they are trying to make them more refined and everyday user friendly the "Sport Modes" get put in so when you've got passed the commuting bit and fancy a b-road blast you put it in Sport and it pops and bangs. That way it pleases every buyer. Having the car pop and bang whilst in "Commute" mode seems a bit daft.
My daily is a RX8, which only pops when you really give it some, my mini on the other hand is the sunny day/track day hooligan which makes all sorts of noises, but thats why I look forward to driving it from time to time. I couldn't drive it everywhere, I'd get bored/annoyed of the noises. This links back to the Porsche, I'd get bored of the pops and bangs so, having spent ££££ buying one, would like a seperate button that makes it more noisey and interesting. My parents new S4 does it perfectly plus it's fuel burning not electronic witchcraft.
Another example, you're surround sound in the house. When watching the news you wouldn't have it on but put Fast & Furious on and you'd want the full wack, get my drift?
Kieran
My daily is a RX8, which only pops when you really give it some, my mini on the other hand is the sunny day/track day hooligan which makes all sorts of noises, but thats why I look forward to driving it from time to time. I couldn't drive it everywhere, I'd get bored/annoyed of the noises. This links back to the Porsche, I'd get bored of the pops and bangs so, having spent ££££ buying one, would like a seperate button that makes it more noisey and interesting. My parents new S4 does it perfectly plus it's fuel burning not electronic witchcraft.
Another example, you're surround sound in the house. When watching the news you wouldn't have it on but put Fast & Furious on and you'd want the full wack, get my drift?
Kieran
Discussing with a friend yesterday about this exact issue on the GTS and the CLA45 AMG cars. AND the F type.
Its wrong. No need for it what so ever. Let it do it every now and again as a treat but not all the time. Its tiring and intrusive to both the driver and people around you.
The E92 335i did this every now and again and that was a nice treat when it happened. This is just a nuisance.
Its wrong. No need for it what so ever. Let it do it every now and again as a treat but not all the time. Its tiring and intrusive to both the driver and people around you.
The E92 335i did this every now and again and that was a nice treat when it happened. This is just a nuisance.
yonex said:
vz-r_dave said:
dern said:
Having a map that specifically makes an engine pop and bang is the most poxy and cringe worthy thing I've ever heard of. I like a car that is purposeful and happens to make these noises when driven utterly flat out on a track. My stylus kicks out flames and bangs every now and again if you're absolutely flooring on track but to make a car do it at 30mph through town or through a tunnel... uber bent.
Completely agree, if it is not mechanical and driven purposely by trickery what is the point? Fits in well on PH though I would say. kambites said:
zeb said:
Aston, ferrari, lambo etc all spend squillions on the acoustic aspect of how the vehicle sounds
They do, and for me that significantly detracts from the appeal of their cars. you only have to look how people are complaining about F1 now being 'souless' due to the reduction in sound
Ian_UK1 said:
That Boxster sounds absolutely sh*te!
There's only one thing sounds worse than no exhaust noise and that's bad-sounding exhaust noise. The Boxster is a perfect example of the latter; a manufacturer trying waaaaay too hard and ending-up creating a droning, farting, embarrassment. More 'bl**dy great big hole in the silencer' than purposeful, powerful and controlled.
Compare it to how good (admittedly much older) Porsche flat-6s can sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6C3TEjWYXM
Thanks to that link I just lost an hour of my day watching this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7GruLWVagw I say lost...There's only one thing sounds worse than no exhaust noise and that's bad-sounding exhaust noise. The Boxster is a perfect example of the latter; a manufacturer trying waaaaay too hard and ending-up creating a droning, farting, embarrassment. More 'bl**dy great big hole in the silencer' than purposeful, powerful and controlled.
Compare it to how good (admittedly much older) Porsche flat-6s can sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6C3TEjWYXM
You are wrong-
if not for the sound we should/could all drive teslas...
All my cars had /have sports exhausts and were purchased with sound in mind - I however agree that pops/and bangs seem more of an achievement when happening randomly (lifting off in second at certain rev levels) -worked for than automatically and my Cerbera was probably my best sounding car ever (fernhrust sports exhaust - no cats - I will never forget it setting off the car alarm of a bmw parked next to it when I reversed - and was still over 1 yard away this is what I call acoustic parking aid... ) but the C63 is a close second- despite the modern box and enginered sound....
i just feel an engine which does not vocally make a statement is not worth having
Rulse for owners of loud cars
Be in time - otherwise everyone will now you are late
drive in high gear through built up areas
give it all you can when overtaking sleepers who block the roda in front of you
if not for the sound we should/could all drive teslas...
All my cars had /have sports exhausts and were purchased with sound in mind - I however agree that pops/and bangs seem more of an achievement when happening randomly (lifting off in second at certain rev levels) -worked for than automatically and my Cerbera was probably my best sounding car ever (fernhrust sports exhaust - no cats - I will never forget it setting off the car alarm of a bmw parked next to it when I reversed - and was still over 1 yard away this is what I call acoustic parking aid... ) but the C63 is a close second- despite the modern box and enginered sound....
i just feel an engine which does not vocally make a statement is not worth having
Rulse for owners of loud cars
Be in time - otherwise everyone will now you are late
drive in high gear through built up areas
give it all you can when overtaking sleepers who block the roda in front of you
ck76 said:
Ian_UK1 said:
That Boxster sounds absolutely sh*te!
There's only one thing sounds worse than no exhaust noise and that's bad-sounding exhaust noise. The Boxster is a perfect example of the latter; a manufacturer trying waaaaay too hard and ending-up creating a droning, farting, embarrassment. More 'bl**dy great big hole in the silencer' than purposeful, powerful and controlled.
Compare it to how good (admittedly much older) Porsche flat-6s can sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6C3TEjWYXM
Thanks to that link I just lost an hour of my day watching this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7GruLWVagw I say lost...There's only one thing sounds worse than no exhaust noise and that's bad-sounding exhaust noise. The Boxster is a perfect example of the latter; a manufacturer trying waaaaay too hard and ending-up creating a droning, farting, embarrassment. More 'bl**dy great big hole in the silencer' than purposeful, powerful and controlled.
Compare it to how good (admittedly much older) Porsche flat-6s can sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p6C3TEjWYXM
The most evident I saw this was at the Cholmondley pageant of power earlier in the year. Some of the old race cars and exotica going up the hill sounded drastically inspirational, proper hairs on the back of your neck standing up noise, with each nuance of the majesty happening under the bonnet getting expressed out the back or sides completely unadulterated. Then, there was the Aventador revving in the club car park. Of course it sounded nice being a 6 litre Italian V12, but every rev was 'whhhhhimmmm!cracklypop. Whhhhhimmmm!cracklypop. Whhhhhimmmm!cracklypop.' the same identical 4-phrase staccato bang out the back. Technically impressive, aurally pleasasnt, but completely uninspiring.
The current C63 gets it right I think. No electronic flaps or anything like that but ECU programming that maybe allows for the occasional pop and bang when not in "C" mode. It's got a nice mellow burble at low engine speeds, it doesn't boom when cruising and it has a nice hard crackle at high RPM.
My N52 engined Z4 sounded great too. Probably the last BMW engine that sounds good.
My N52 engined Z4 sounded great too. Probably the last BMW engine that sounds good.
Harry3099 said:
I love cars that sound like this, however I only like it when I think the car is worthy of a sound like that. For example, the Boxster is a sportscar - not a supercar, it almost seems like its trying to 'play with the big kids'. I won't lie, pretty much the whole way through that video, I had goosebumps - but when I remembered that it was a Boxster, it just didn't seem cool. Another example is cars like the BMW M3 and Merc C63 AMG have huge engines, and sound great - but they aren't supercars, look at them, they are executive saloon cars! It really bugs me when people think that this entitles them to take their Audi RS6 Avant to a supercar meet, I'm sorry, its just not in the same league as a Ferrari or Lamborghini. Same with the Boxster, again, it rivals Audi TTs and Mercedes SLKs, not supercars. I think its time some of these car brands focused on their market rather than trying to make the car make pops and bangs, and leave that to the true rebels like TVRs and Lamborghinis. It just doesn't suit them.
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