RE: Delivery miles: LaFerrari, P1 and 918 Spyder
Discussion
robsouthern said:
^^ this. Plus according to Evo its superior on road drive would leave me in the 918 camp
Taking out the investment factor I would go for the Porsche every time and I am a Ferrari man too.
The laF and P1 have gone for function over form, but surely that's the number 1 point of a ROAD hypercar? If I had the money and wanted to go fast on track, I would buy a p1 gtr or likely laFXX?
The 918 is the most pretty and that wins it for me.
Totally agree with you.Taking out the investment factor I would go for the Porsche every time and I am a Ferrari man too.
The laF and P1 have gone for function over form, but surely that's the number 1 point of a ROAD hypercar? If I had the money and wanted to go fast on track, I would buy a p1 gtr or likely laFXX?
The 918 is the most pretty and that wins it for me.
Goofnik said:
Agoogy said:
Autocar website has a nice piece on the Porsche. Up to 130mph it has the P1 nailed, but then seems to stop in comparison, where the P1 continues to bend physics.
The electric motors in the 918 top out at ~146mph. So it effectively lost 280HP all of a sudden, which is why it seemed as if it "hit a wall".My understanding of the final version of the 918 is this:
The front electric motor disconnects at 165mph, and the loss of that is 94kw (~129bhp).
The rear electric motor keeps pushing until 214mph, or until the battery SoC gets low enough for it to not be available any more. It is rated at 115kw (~156bhp).
The combustion engine is rated at 608bhp@8700rpm.
Edited by CraigyMc on Thursday 30th October 14:05
Gorbyrev said:
GroundEffect said:
Oh and none offered in RHD? You pay ~£1M for a car and its on the wrong drive?
I am quite sure Woking's best will happily part you from some folding and rectify that for you!British Beef said:
Porche Carrera GT for me please. V10 and manual, to me it is a more attractive driving and ownership proposition than all of these, regardless of price point.
If I want the electric thing to ease my environmental conscience I will get a Tesla for every day pooteling about in.
Alternatively same with the 730bhp V12 Ferrari F12 ... If I want the electric thing to ease my environmental conscience I will get a Tesla for every day pooteling about in.
Bullett said:
The Ferrari does nothing at all for me. (I'd not turn down a free one though).
If the big lottery win comes in it's the Porsche for me, I even like the Martini one - who wants subtle in a hypercar.
Good choice, and me too.If the big lottery win comes in it's the Porsche for me, I even like the Martini one - who wants subtle in a hypercar.
It's the most interesting implementation for this kinda hypercar I think. And no doubt on the actual road doing road driving it'll make the other two look a bit silly too.
Ie, hybrid type range, awd performance etc.
Just a shame it'll be in wrong hand drive in the UK.
Ah the logical perfection of the McLaren F1 for a performance road car with central seating.
Dave
wtdoom said:
Goofnik said:
The electric motors in the 918 top out at ~146mph. So it effectively lost 280HP all of a sudden, which is why it seemed as if it "hit a wall".
165 from engine only .Again more rubbish . Reporters need firing
A friend and I wrote most of the code for a simulation of the 918 hybrid system.
At 150-160mph or so it will be over-speeding the front e-motor so at high speeds it's accelerating only on the IC motor.
Up to 150mph though it's like a rocket.
In the end it's a road car, it's an awd uber-hybrid road car.
0-150mph is gonna be just as fast as anything else on the road, if it's even practical 99% of the time to accelerate that hard.
150mph+ is rare except perfect autobahn conditions, so I'm not sure why that matters either.
I can see why they all float people's boats in different ways. Personally I think the P1 is the most boring in engineering terms, visually, audibly, but love the 918 and LaFerrari.
For me the 918 would be the one I'd actually own and use on an average UK road.
Dave
wtdoom said:
Goofnik said:
The electric motors in the 918 top out at ~146mph. So it effectively lost 280HP all of a sudden, which is why it seemed as if it "hit a wall".
165 from engine only .Again more rubbish . Reporters need firing
Assuming roughly a 2:1 capability for field weakening, that means peak power at the front wheels occurs only at roughly 80mph, and at all other speeds the front motor cannot deliver it's peak output.
For the P1, we were quite adamant that output of the Emachine must be referenced via a multispeed gearbox in order that it could be leveraged in the most effective manner, with the speed matching vs the ICE just being a matter of maximising the shape of the torque curve. (2:1 geared to crank, Emachine:ICE respectively)
Max_Torque said:
wtdoom said:
Goofnik said:
The electric motors in the 918 top out at ~146mph. So it effectively lost 280HP all of a sudden, which is why it seemed as if it "hit a wall".
165 from engine only .Again more rubbish . Reporters need firing
Because the e-motor runs independently of a gearbox the overlaps are all over the place.
But if you back extrapolate out the total torques per gear (as per the graph data available), the effective peak power is around quoted at the appropriate speeds in the appropriate gears.
In the end though, what you get is some terrific low-down eco-grunt in 7th gear at say 40mph. 50:50 torque split and searing performance.
Drop a few gears and you get a sportier rear-biased delivery for very very good mid-range performance.
Drop even more gears and you get a smaller front-end torque delivery vs the engine torque at that point, but still a fairly reasonable power boost.
It's complex to describe the way it works with simple stats (like the media always do, badly, like comparing peak torque values irrespective of rpms and gears etc)... but in practice I don't think the 918 is lacking.
As noted, in the simulation version I've driven, just doing straight-line acceleration tests in various gears and the like, or using front e-motor power to trim/adjust under/oversteer states, it's fapping rapid.
I'm not really sure what more you want on a fast road car except just stripping out the gearbox/diff altogether and just running e-motors at each wheel and having the IC generate electricity.
Dave
love the wild look of the mcclaren would imagine the porche with its 4 wheel drive would be better on uk wet roads for the track mcclaren for me, the Ferrari is just for looking at so I'll put that 3rd ,would like to see a litchfield gtb 700bhp spec against any one of these to see what the differance would be , I just think it would be interesting to see if a modified reasonable priced car with some tuning money could get close to these super cars, around a race track not drag strip which gtr s are already blowing them away..
I found it surprising that the Porsche beat the Mac around the Autocar circuit by a second over a short lap, it really is an amazing feat of engineering...however it may be that in the hands of professional racing drivers, the Mac closes the gap, I suspect it takes more skill to eek out a lap time from the Mac than the 4 x 4 Porsche. Anyway, any of these cars would be wonderful to own.
Mr Whippy said:
Hmmm.
A friend and I wrote most of the code for a simulation of the 918 hybrid system.
At 150-160mph or so it will be over-speeding the front e-motor so at high speeds it's accelerating only on the IC motor.
Up to 150mph though it's like a rocket.
In the end it's a road car, it's an awd uber-hybrid road car.
0-150mph is gonna be just as fast as anything else on the road, if it's even practical 99% of the time to accelerate that hard.
150mph+ is rare except perfect autobahn conditions, so I'm not sure why that matters either.
I can see why they all float people's boats in different ways. Personally I think the P1 is the most boring in engineering terms, visually, audibly, but love the 918 and LaFerrari.
For me the 918 would be the one I'd actually own and use on an average UK road.
Dave
I'm an owner have spent hours with wallliser and the development team over two years . Originally I was unconvinced until I drove one . I drove one it blew me away . I have spent hours in friends p1 side by side with his Veyron supersport on closed off roads and I called it from day 1 the 918 would be faster on the road and probably on most tracks ( as proven by tg mag , evo and now autocar ). The front engine disconnect was reviewed and the speed changed after the third round of optimisations fyi ( other revisions were made at this time regarding a short period oveboost , better optimisations of systems , recharging and brake feel .A friend and I wrote most of the code for a simulation of the 918 hybrid system.
At 150-160mph or so it will be over-speeding the front e-motor so at high speeds it's accelerating only on the IC motor.
Up to 150mph though it's like a rocket.
In the end it's a road car, it's an awd uber-hybrid road car.
0-150mph is gonna be just as fast as anything else on the road, if it's even practical 99% of the time to accelerate that hard.
150mph+ is rare except perfect autobahn conditions, so I'm not sure why that matters either.
I can see why they all float people's boats in different ways. Personally I think the P1 is the most boring in engineering terms, visually, audibly, but love the 918 and LaFerrari.
For me the 918 would be the one I'd actually own and use on an average UK road.
Dave
Congratulations to you and your friend you are a genius , I salute you
Edited by wtdoom on Thursday 30th October 16:51
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff