Tuesday 18th November 2014

The Unusual Suspects: PH Blog

We all love our hot hatch icons; Matt thinks its time celebrate some of the also-rans as well

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It's now six months since I sold Shed Civic, the 1998 five-door VTI with three electric windows, rust, some worrying stains on the driver's seat and rust. It's not currently MoT'd or insured though, which makes me rather sad.

See, weird six-cylinder BMW hatches aren't new

It wasn't a brilliant car, I'm not sure it would have been superb when new, but it was different. That's why I liked it. It was a car that looked like a Rover 400 but revved to 8,500rpm and had a proper limited-slip diff to transmit all 122lb ft (!) to the tarmac. It would make a great track project.

But anyway, my point here is to celebrate the oddities of hot hatch history. I love a great hot hatch but I also love a curio. If you have driven one then I would love to know. If you have owned one then even better. If you have one for sale then... actually, best not go there. It's just a few paragraphs on those that have slipped under the radar and that I want to celebrate. Some of them are even quite good.

Best of all, not all are old timers. The Leon Cupra 265 we had in recently was a perfect case in point. Nobody will buy it because in this spec you can't have five doors, you can't have a DSG and you can't have the Performance Pack. But that's enough reason to like it, if you see what I'm getting at. That it's a very talented three-door manual turbo hot hatch is even better.

Fast Xsaras have to be this colour

How on earth the BMW E46 325ti Compact wasn't discussed more when the M135i was launched I'll never know. Yes, the performance differential is significant, but the same fundamentals of straight-six power, rear-wheel drive and slightly gawky yet restrained looks remain. Really nice cars seems to be around £3K. I like them.

And it gets weirder. The Rover 25 GTI is a car I have a huge soft spot for. It was the very antithesis of the MG ZR but still used the revvy VVC 1.8 and once upon a time would do 130mph. The juxtaposition of that performance with the leather and wood and Werthers image is something that really intrigues me too. It was the successor to the 200 vi which was even more staid to look at. And who can forget the 200 BRM?

Anyone who says looks aren't a priority when buying a hot hatch is lying. Want proof? The Peugeot 309 GTI. Blessed with 205's legendary underpinnings but not its pretty good looks it has never been coveted as highly as the smaller car. I love them. There's a Cherry Red three-door model on my desk (alongside a Talbot Sunbeam Lotus in fact) and I would love to drive one. It's probably the underdog Brit spirit; I want to see something disregarded do well, especially when it deserves to.

Odd? Certainly. Fast? Sort of. Cool? Oh yes

And as we're on uglier relatives, how about the Citroen Xsara VTS? Alright, so it lacked a gear and some of the 306 GTI-6's magnificent handling as well as the looks but all reports suggests it's still damn good. I want a pre-facelift car in that yellowy gold.

A final one to ponder as I did in fact see one for sale recently: the Toyota Corolla T-Sport Compressor. Now here is an odd one. Despite a VVTI engine that revved to nearly 9,000rpm, the standard Corolla T-Sport of the early 2000s was a fairly unremarkable car. For the last 250 Toyota supercharged the Corolla flagship to 218hp and 158lb ft. It still wasn't the last word in dynamics (and it cost as much as a Golf GTI) but that what a cool thing to do as a run out special. Most of the way to an Exige engine as well.

There's a whole long list that could go here but I'm waffling now. Stuff like the Proton Satria GTI, Alfa 145 Cloverleaf and Fiat Bravo HGT. Anyway, I'd love to hear about other oddball hot hatches as I'm sure there are plenty to about. Just don't send any Xsara VTS links as it could result in my family going another Christmas without gifts!

Matt

 

 

[Ryvita]

You're going to get people telling you to put down the rose tinted spectacles and step away from the keyboard I suspect.

I can see your point though. I would also value rarity or unusualness, but only as a single factor in the total decision making for a choice. Sometimes the reason the popular choice is popular is because it's the best.

The trick comes in finding the unusual, rare, unappreciated gem which is also CHEAPER. Then you have the making of a great deal and a value proposition that works.

Other examples, and here it's probably my turn to get shot down:

VW Scirocco GTII instead of Mk. 2 Golf GTI
Vauxhall VX220 Turbo instead of Lotus Elise
Fiat Barchetta instead of Mk. 1 MX-5

Edited by Ryvita on Tuesday 18th November 10:02

[Johnners]

I was working at a Peugeot dealer at the time the 205 and 309 were new. As I recall even though everyone raved about the 205 gti 1.9, it was generally regarded that the 309 handled better on the limit and the chassis had won awards for it capability.

I had a soft spot for the Fiat Tipo Sedici Valvole. Rare now and generally considered to handle as well as the equivalent Golf at the time

[HorneyMX5]

The 309 was a better car than the 205, I also thought it looked better.

I NEED to own a Rover 200 BRM at somepoint. I've driven a couple and witht he VVT lump and the LSD they really are a cracking drive and I love the colour scheme and interior. They're going up in price for good ones now though.

[ChasW]

Johnners said:

I was working at a Peugeot dealer at the time the 205 and 309 were new. As I recall even though everyone raved about the 205 gti 1.9, it was generally regarded that the 309 handled better on the limit and the chassis had won awards for it capability.

I had a soft spot for the Fiat Tipo Sedici Valvole. Rare now and generally considered to handle as well as the equivalent Golf at the time

I had a 309 Gti as a pool car in 1989. At the time I was doing an 80 mile commute mostly motorway and fast A roads. This car made me seek out an alternative cross country route, particularly for the journey home on summer evenings with the sunroof open. It was my first real taste of decent handling. The bad news is that the OH was 7 months pregnant and could not bear the firm ride. Replaced it after a month with a 3 series BMW.

[Gorbyrev]

309 GTi Goodwood for me with the wooden steering wheel and that lovely metallic green (forest green I think). Only 309 I actually drove was a 1.1 XE and that was awful (it had lived a hard life as a back street garage courtesy car). Very much enjoyed having a blast in a fresh MG Maestro Turbo which even managed to look slightly menacing in black and made good use of the rubber band turbo boost after it had told you to put your seat belt on. Xsara definitely has to be gold but what about its predecessor, the ZX Volcane - fabulous and underated steer. Mate had a TD version that might rate as the first viable diesel hot hatch though the petrol version was a worthwhile PSA effort too, sharing its mechanicals with the more fondly remembered Pugs. Back another generation would take us to Visa GTi's (try finding one of them). Time to stop!

[mooseracer]

I preferred my 309gti to either the 1.6 or 1.9 205 gti's that I owned. I had some truly memorable drives across the Mendips in the 309. Great car.

[mooseracer]

Gorbyrev said:

309 GTi Goodwood for me with the wooden steering wheel and that lovely metallic green (forest green I think). Only 309 I actually drove was a 1.1 XE and that was awful (it had lived a hard life as a back street garage courtesy car). Very much enjoyed having a blast in a fresh MG Maestro Turbo which even managed to look slightly menacing in black and made good use of the rubber band turbo boost after it had told you to put your seat belt on. Xsara definitely has to be gold but what about its predecessor, the ZX Volcane - fabulous and underated steer. Mate had a TD version that might rate as the first viable diesel hot hatch though the petrol version was a worthwhile PSA effort too, sharing its mechanicals with the more fondly remembered Pugs. Back another generation would take us to Visa GTi's (try finding one of them). Time to stop!

I owned a Visa GTI - the later model with the 115bhp 1.6 engine in it. Certainly was a leftfield choice, even at the time!

[Frimley111R]

Be careful, its way too easy to look at these cars with rose tinted glasses when the reality is that they are very old and very crude (by today's standards) cars. In their heyday they were the best but that was long time go. A very long time ago.

I've got a Clio Williams and so i know.. Nowhere near as great as people make it out to be.

[Bit of a Unit]

Another vote for the Tipo here, had one and loved it. Also the nissan sunny GTI-R was hilarious and the Almera GTI was a decent hot hatch.

[rohrl]

The 309 may well have been a better drive but it was pig-ugly compared with the 205 and people tend to buy cars they like the look of.

[McFarnsworth]

How come the 145 Cloverleaf gets a mention, while in an article about weird hot hatches the even stranger 146ti gets left out?

Does the Peugeot 206 RC count, or did that actually sell well? It never got terribly good reviews, but wasn't actually any slower/faster than a contemporary Clio 172/182.

Also, this thing:

[homologeo]

That Charade reminds me... I have always fancied a Nissan March Superturbo.

[homologeo]

Could be perfect timing for someone...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Peugeot-309-Goodwood-GTI...

[JaguarsportXJR]

I know I'm going to get abused for this but I'd really like a BRM. Had I not found the Mini to use as a daily, I'd probably have had one, regardless of the missus' protestations.

[Gorbyrev]

homologeo said:

Could be perfect timing for someone...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Peugeot-309-Goodwood-GTI...

Great spot and not a million miles away! That has got to be absolute top dollar for a 309 though even though it looks in lovely knick.

[Leins]

There are a few PH-ers who really rate their current/previous 325ti. Great cars in so many ways

And if you don't believe us, ask Marc Gene...

[dbhenshall]

I can see why you did a history degree! great alternative choices, although still hard to beat a MR2 at these price points

[The Donster]

Roomier, a little bit comfier and far far cheaper than its R5 GTT little sister - the Renault 11 Turbo.

Not the prettiest car in the world, but I loved my Phase 2. Max Power even ran one (with a dodgy 90s Renault touring car colour scheme!).

[opieoilman]

I had the 309SRi (1.6gti engine) as a cheap stop gap between other cars. Really good fun, but massively annoying at times too. Usually took about 10 minutes of swearing at it and trying various things to get it started. It had one electric window, in fact I think pretty much everything electrical didn't work properly. I think it had been owned by someone dodgy before me as it seemed every cop car I saw pulled me over (I was behaving, before you ask, but I was quite young at the time).

One friend had a Charade Turbo then another got the GTti. Perhaps not fast in todays terms, but they really felt it. Also, they were both very reliable.

Edited by opieoilman on Tuesday 18th November 14:16

[Lowtimer]

The 309 GTI was absolutely great on a B-road, and if I recall correctly they all had a particularly nice power steering rack in an era when most 205 GTIs didn't.

Admittedly it was a car one admired and respected rather than loved because the 205 with the same engine was quicker (being lighter) and looked absolutely adorable.