French cars.Hmmm...

[CooperD]

Had my DS3 Diesel for just under 2 years. Bought it with 12000 miles on the clock and now done 57,000. Only thing that's gone wrong is a headlamp bulb needed replacing. It's a lot more reliable than my Mini Diesel which I bought from new and had numerous issues with.

[gtidriver]

I'm in a Belgian hired Renault Clio, this car is rubbish. It's done 6000miles, don't know engine size but I'm thinking very small, the panels have a biscuit tin feel to them,the paint is very easily marked, the seats are the worse I've ever sat in, the fuel consumption is terrible, the ride is shocking, it struggles to get to 80mph the road noise is terrible, this isn't helped as its still on winter tyres. Hateful pile of st.

[TooMany2cvs]

skyrover said:

TooMany2cvs said:

Digby said:

Sooo, my count this week of broken down French-mobiles currently stands at 9 out of a total of 10 spotted

108 Pug

You do realise that's a Czech-built Toyota, right?

Erm no... the Toyota is a badge engineered PSA product and is generally poorly regarded.

The factory is a joint venture. The 1.0 is a Toyota engine, the 1.2 is a PSA engine. The development was a joint venture, but AIUI Toyota led.

[Alex_225]

Digby said:

Alex_225 said:

I've owned 8 Renaults in my time and I can honestly say that none of them have been problematic.

I'll put my hands up and say they're not built like the Germans but they're not the same price range as them either.

I've also owned five RenaultSport models and one thing the French can do is fun!!! So no my Twingo 133 isn't built as well as my mum's A1 but it's a shed load more fun to drive, cheaper to buy and full of character than many better built cars.

Have to agree with all of that. The A1 we have, despite having adjustable suspension 'stuff' and voice controls etc is no more interesting than any new Astra, Ford...pretty much anything. They just throw stuff at it you don't need, cover it in chrome and charge 20k (mind you, most manufacturers do the same)

It's utterly soulless.

Don't get me wrong the A1 is a great car but it is just that a car. It suites my mum, everything functions well, it's solid enough and the 1.4 turbo makes decent power and torque. But for the money where's the smiles? It was probably around £20k new and yet a Renaultsport may not feel as premium but it'll put a smile on your face.

My personal opinion is that a fast Frenchy can put a big grin on your face for not mega money, it takes a lot more cash to get the same fun factor from a German beast.

[Muddle238]

My DS5 has a plethora of electronic gadgetry which I'm pleased to say, all functions 100% correctly. I have no electrical gremlins and nor has the DS5 ever left me stranded at the side of the road. My previous Pug never stranded me nor the Pug before that. Therefore I've got a 100% success rate with French automobiles. I had a Polo TDI rental breakdown on me abroad though, just as well as it was an utterly hateful thing.

Of course there will always be haters, but they usually drive VAG so I don't bother listening to them.

[lostkiwi]

I've had a Citroen BX in the past - only electrical issue was a failed central locking motor on the rear door.
Most reliable car ever was a Fiat Punto Mk2 Sporting. Did 36000 miles with absolutely nothing needing doing aside from basic servicing.
Two worst cars ever were both Saabs. First was a 900 Turbo SE which had more rattles than Toys-R-Us and was forever needing something sorted (usually minor admittedly). Other was a 9-3 05 plate. You name it it went wrong. Boot lock, rear seat rests, intercooler, turbo, aircon, waterpump, thermostat, head gasket, rear suspension arms and the list just went on and on and on.
I've had a number of German cars and they were better than some, worse than most (but all were better than the single Toyota I had). Mercs in my experience are better over all than Audis but there isn't much in it.
I've had two Volvos - the S40 (04 MK2 diesel) was as bad as the S70 T5 was good and the S70 was very good (probably only pipped by the Punto or the two Mazdas I've had but then the S70 covered more miles in my ownership).
Mazda Xedos 6 - excellent car - only issues were with crappy EBC discs I fitted. Mazda 323F-GT - also excellent. Only issues outside servicing were a CV joint and a set of plug leads. Pretty good for 80k miles.

Any car is a lottery. Some are good, some are bad. There's only one brand would make me question my sanity if I were to buy another and thats the Saabs.

[feef]

Been driving a Citroen C6 for the last few years, and is now at 90,000 miles, and is a daily driver as well as being driven to the alps a couple of times a year, and the Charente in France in the summer.

Nothing has gone wrong that wouldn't be considered normal wear and tear (suspension bushes were replaced last year)

The only thing that needs looking in the near future at is the turbo which is noisy (quite an audible whistle which, I suspect, is related to an oil seal) and a sticking EGR valve, but bear in mind it's a Dagenham built Ford Duratorq engine, so the potentially expensive work is from the non-French parts.

[tedman]

I've had four Mazdas over the years. All petrol. Not had any issues apart from the odd consumable and dodgy HT leads on a Xedos 6.

[Lester H]

PositronicRay said:

My family has had loads of Peugeots and I.ve had a couple no problems. My MIL had a 206 used abused and serviced occasionally had to have a new battery @ 9yrs old, disgusting. My MB on the other hand has had many many electrical niggles.

My family too. Peugeots excellent value used, will work hard for you if they are serviced, especially Hdis. Yes, they tend to shed bits of plastic trim, inside and out, can have electrical niggles, but are basically strong and rot proof.

[ORD]

All the people that I know who buy French cars have no interest at all in cars and are very easily pleased. French cars are mostly terrible and have been for as long as I can remember.

Hot Renaults are an exception to the rule, but I can't think of many others.

[Ciid]

French brands, PSA and Renault, are nowadays some of the most reliable car brands on the market, they make great cars for the price.

France has a lot of small car manufacturers that most people don't know because they only make motorsports cars, so not street legal. They have a great know-how in car industry, people just don't know it because the typical French Bashing and because they don't launch legal road sports cars, they should launch a bunch of sports vehicles licensed for road use to help improve the image of the French vehicles.

Edited by Ciid on Saturday 30th April 22:58

[feef]

ORD said:

All the people that I know who buy French cars have no interest at all in cars and are very easily pleased. French cars are mostly terrible and have been for as long as I can remember.

Hot Renaults are an exception to the rule, but I can't think of many others.

There's definitely an oxymoron in there, in that being PH I'm pretty sure the majority DO have an interest in cars and are probably less easily pleased than the masses

What is it about French cars that folk say are terrible?

The engines (that are shared with many other companies)?
The build quality (from factories that are shared with other companies, sometimes even making the same vehicle with a different badge on)?

[Stickyfinger]

ORD said:

All the people that I know who buy French cars have no interest at all in cars and are very easily pleased. French cars are mostly terrible and have been for as long as I can remember.

Hot Renaults are an exception to the rule, but I can't think of many others.

Sorry, but that is bks

Most of the BMW/Audi/Porsche/Merc owners I know cannot drive and just use them as a fashion like shoes.

Edited by Stickyfinger on Saturday 30th April 22:40

[ORD]

Stickyfinger said:

Sorry, but that is bks

Most of the BMW/Audi/Porsche/Merc owners I know cannot drive and just use them as a fashion like shoes.

Edited by Stickyfinger on Saturday 30th April 22:40

Typical PH response. It's my observation. Nobody that I know who driver a French car has any interest in cars whatsoever. That's a simple fact. Getting upset about the facts that somebody has observed is a little strange.

It's not a very big sample of the population, obviously, but it's a strange coincidence unless there is something in it. I expect it's that most people's sole interest in cars is to get a badge for the school run or whatever, which rules out French cars and rules in some horrid diesel BMW or Audi. The people I know who buy French cars aren't even interested in cars for badge snobbery and social anxiety reasons - they just want a vehicle to get them places. Nothing wrong with that!

My second comment was simply that I think French cars are usually pretty bad. I can't think of any that are seen as class leading apart from the hot Megane.

[johnnnnnnyy]

ORD said:

All the people that I know who buy French cars have no interest at all in cars and are very easily pleased. French cars are mostly terrible and have been for as long as I can remember.

Hot Renaults are an exception to the rule, but I can't think of many others.

I've got a Peugeot 508. I've also got a Corvette Z06, Aston Martin Vantage, previous cars Porsche 911, Jaguar XKR, Ferrari + various other exotics.
I love the Peugeot and grab the keys for it most times. Much better build than the Audi it replaced, drives better too.

People used to take the same stance with Korean cars, look what happened. Todays French cars are very well built, and naysayers are missing out on great value cars due to their badge snobbery attitude.

[Ciid]

ORD said:

Typical PH response. It's my observation. Nobody that I know who driver a French car has any interest in cars whatsoever. That's a simple fact. Getting upset about the facts that somebody has observed is a little strange.

It's not a very big sample of the population, obviously, but it's a strange coincidence unless there is something in it. I expect it's that most people's sole interest in cars is to get a badge for the school run or whatever, which rules out French cars and rules in some horrid diesel BMW or Audi. The people I know who buy French cars aren't even interested in cars for badge snobbery and social anxiety reasons - they just want a vehicle to get them places. Nothing wrong with that!

My second comment was simply that I think French cars are usually pretty bad. I can't think of any that are seen as class leading apart from the hot Megane.

That's false. DS3, Kadjar, Clio RS, RCZ-R, 208, 308 II, C4 Picasso II, etc., etc., are all some of the best cars in their classes.

Edited by Ciid on Saturday 30th April 22:55

[ORD]

Ciid said:

That's false. DS3, Kadjar, Clio RS, RCZ-R, 308 II, C4 Picasso II, etc., etc..

None of those is class-leading, though, apart from maybe the Clio. But isn't that probably behind the Fiesta in most reviews.

I quite like the RCZ-R. I'll give you that one

[TooMany2cvs]

ORD said:

Typical PH response. It's my observation. Nobody that I know who driver a French car has any interest in cars whatsoever. That's a simple fact. Getting upset about the facts that somebody has observed is a little strange.

It's not a very big sample of the population, obviously, but it's a strange coincidence unless there is something in it.

Hmm. Well, there's me. And kitchski is about somewhere - with his AX and BXs and day job restoring TVRs.

Strangely, I'd say that most of the car people I know were into French cars. Maybe we all draw our samples from unrepresentative audiences...?

Edited by TooMany2cvs on Saturday 30th April 23:09

[feef]

TooMany2cvs said:

ORD said:

Typical PH response. It's my observation. Nobody that I know who driver a French car has any interest in cars whatsoever. That's a simple fact. Getting upset about the facts that somebody has observed is a little strange.

It's not a very big sample of the population, obviously, but it's a strange coincidence unless there is something in it.

Hmm. Well, there's me. And kitchski is about somewhere - with his AX and BXs and day job restoring TVRs.

Strangely, I'd say that most of the car people I know we're into French cars. Maybe we all draw our samples from unrepresentative audiences...?

I've got a Citroen C6 and a supercharged MX5, hardly the choice of vehicles for someone with no interest in cars whatsover

[Ciid]

ORD said:

None of those is class-leading, though, apart from maybe the Clio. But isn't that probably behind the Fiesta in most reviews.

I quite like the RCZ-R. I'll give you that one

Yes, they are. It all depends what you consider a class-leading.

The DS3 in considered by some press the best b-segment vehicle in terms of quality and refinement, the 308 II was awarded the Car of the Year in 2014, the C4 Picasso II is considered the best MPV by a lot of press and is the best-selling MPV in Europe (and the second is the Renault Scénic), the Kadjar is considered the best compact SUV in terms of value for money, etc.. France makes as good vehicles as any other large country. Open your mind.