Haggling on Price

Author
Discussion

tiberium2014

2 posts

112 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
Usually I can haggle down 5-10% of the price of a used car.
But I've had a very interesting haggling experience today.
I've been talking to a dealer(actually the business owner) and I was very polite and all that and at the same time I always have hard facts at hand (like better deals at other dealership, general knowledge about cars and in this particular case I knew he is been trying to sell the car for ages due to some particular property of the car what makes it unattractive to the large majority of other buyers).

So I was expecting some deal to be made.
To my surprise after a brief chat about the car as soon as I mentioned now I'm going to make a cash offer for the car he immediately turned from interested to disinterested and flatly stated that the price will not go down.

Excuse me? Since when dealers are not even interested in offers?!
By the way it was a car in the £3000 range.
What if I only offered £100-£300 less the display price?
He could still listen and reject my offer (or trying to persuade me to pay full display price offering some other treats like a tank of petrol, a service, a valet, whatever.)
I think he would have a chance with me to work something out to our mutual satisfaction.
But I've never heard a person being so disinterested in selling a car.
And all that at the end of the month...

Needless to say they have lost my business forever.

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
tiberium2014 said:
Usually I can haggle down 5-10% of the price of a used car.
But I've had a very interesting haggling experience today.
I've been talking to a dealer(actually the business owner) and I was very polite and all that and at the same time I always have hard facts at hand (like better deals at other dealership, general knowledge about cars and in this particular case I knew he is been trying to sell the car for ages due to some particular property of the car what makes it unattractive to the large majority of other buyers).

So I was expecting some deal to be made.
To my surprise after a brief chat about the car as soon as I mentioned now I'm going to make a cash offer for the car he immediately turned from interested to disinterested and flatly stated that the price will not go down.

Excuse me? Since when dealers are not even interested in offers?!
By the way it was a car in the £3000 range.
What if I only offered £100-£300 less the display price?
He could still listen and reject my offer (or trying to persuade me to pay full display price offering some other treats like a tank of petrol, a service, a valet, whatever.)
I think he would have a chance with me to work something out to our mutual satisfaction.
But I've never heard a person being so disinterested in selling a car.
And all that at the end of the month...

Needless to say they have lost my business forever.
Therein lies the problem these days. People tend to only look at the lowest 10% of prices for the car their interested in, then expect a further discount when they get there, when the price has been cut to the bone in the first place.

IF you could genuinely get the car significantly cheaper elsewhere :-

(a) why were you there in the first place?
(b) simply go and buy the other car, as you know this one isnt going to be go cheaper.

If you were talking to the business owner of presumably a small dealership then it wont matter a jot to him what time of the month it is.

And in a market where good cars are harder for dealers to find than good customers, maybe hes quite happy to "have lost you forever" if you have no intentions of paying him what he needs for the car?

PositronicRay

26,957 posts

182 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
DonkeyApple said:
The absolute best way to teach yourself to haggle is to firstly remember we have done it throughout our childhood when extracting things from out parents, so we are more experienced than we think.

Secondly, go and haggle over a car that you don't really want. The simple fact is that almost everyone tries to haggle on something that they've already decided they are going to buy at list price, people screw themselves over right in front of the salesman when it comes to cars.

If you go and haggle over a car that you don't really want then it becomes really easy as you are only battling against the salesman instead of the salesman and yourself. Set a price in your mind where you would actually feel you'd had a result and be happy to buy because of the saving and go and buy it.

Worst that can happen is that you get a phenominal deal on a car(that you don't really want) or you get told to jog on and you walk away having passed your first big hurdle.

It is simply a skill that comes with time and patience and standing your ground. Most people aren't prepared to walk away and that is where they lose.

TA14

12,722 posts

257 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
daemon said:
tiberium2014 said:
Usually I can haggle down 5-10% of the price of a used car.
But I've had a very interesting haggling experience today.
I've been talking to a dealer(actually the business owner) and I was very polite and all that and at the same time I always have hard facts at hand (like better deals at other dealership, general knowledge about cars and in this particular case I knew he is been trying to sell the car for ages due to some particular property of the car what makes it unattractive to the large majority of other buyers).

So I was expecting some deal to be made.
To my surprise after a brief chat about the car as soon as I mentioned now I'm going to make a cash offer for the car he immediately turned from interested to disinterested and flatly stated that the price will not go down.

Excuse me? Since when dealers are not even interested in offers?!
By the way it was a car in the £3000 range.
What if I only offered £100-£300 less the display price?
He could still listen and reject my offer (or trying to persuade me to pay full display price offering some other treats like a tank of petrol, a service, a valet, whatever.)
I think he would have a chance with me to work something out to our mutual satisfaction.
But I've never heard a person being so disinterested in selling a car.
And all that at the end of the month...

Needless to say they have lost my business forever.
Therein lies the problem these days. People tend to only look at the lowest 10% of prices for the car their interested in, then expect a further discount when they get there, when the price has been cut to the bone in the first place.

IF you could genuinely get the car significantly cheaper elsewhere :-

(a) why were you there in the first place?
(b) simply go and buy the other car, as you know this one isnt going to be go cheaper.

If you were talking to the business owner of presumably a small dealership then it wont matter a jot to him what time of the month it is.

And in a market where good cars are harder for dealers to find than good customers, maybe hes quite happy to "have lost you forever" if you have no intentions of paying him what he needs for the car?
Oh great, so for the sake of £100 he is left with a car that "he has been trying to sell the car for ages due to some particular property of the car that makes it unattractive to the large majority of other buyers"

SMcP114

2,916 posts

191 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
PositronicRay said:
DonkeyApple said:
The absolute best way to teach yourself to haggle is to firstly remember we have done it throughout our childhood when extracting things from out parents, so we are more experienced than we think.

Secondly, go and haggle over a car that you don't really want. The simple fact is that almost everyone tries to haggle on something that they've already decided they are going to buy at list price, people screw themselves over right in front of the salesman when it comes to cars.

If you go and haggle over a car that you don't really want then it becomes really easy as you are only battling against the salesman instead of the salesman and yourself. Set a price in your mind where you would actually feel you'd had a result and be happy to buy because of the saving and go and buy it.

Worst that can happen is that you get a phenominal deal on a car(that you don't really want) or you get told to jog on and you walk away having passed your first big hurdle.

It is simply a skill that comes with time and patience and standing your ground. Most people aren't prepared to walk away and that is where they lose.
Try and buy a car you don't want. Quite bizarre advice alright.

PositronicRay

26,957 posts

182 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
SMcP114 said:
PositronicRay said:
DonkeyApple said:
The absolute best way to teach yourself to haggle is to firstly remember we have done it throughout our childhood when extracting things from out parents, so we are more experienced than we think.

Secondly, go and haggle over a car that you don't really want. The simple fact is that almost everyone tries to haggle on something that they've already decided they are going to buy at list price, people screw themselves over right in front of the salesman when it comes to cars.

If you go and haggle over a car that you don't really want then it becomes really easy as you are only battling against the salesman instead of the salesman and yourself. Set a price in your mind where you would actually feel you'd had a result and be happy to buy because of the saving and go and buy it.

Worst that can happen is that you get a phenominal deal on a car(that you don't really want) or you get told to jog on and you walk away having passed your first big hurdle.

It is simply a skill that comes with time and patience and standing your ground. Most people aren't prepared to walk away and that is where they lose.
Try and buy a car you don't want. Quite bizarre advice alright.
As a salesman I used to hate this. Overnight "buyers remorse" would lead to a cancellation or after a few weeks with the car they would be back wanting to change it.

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
TA14 said:
Oh great, so for the sake of £100 he is left with a car that "he has been trying to sell the car for ages due to some particular property of the car that makes it unattractive to the large majority of other buyers"
Maybe hes cut the price to the bone and hes not prepared to take a loss on it?

Its his business. He doesnt "have" to do every deal.

tiberium2014

2 posts

112 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
daemon said:
Maybe hes cut the price to the bone and hes not prepared to take a loss on it?

Its his business. He doesnt "have" to do every deal.
That's an acceptable point.
Although in the other hand sometimes they need to take a loss in order to prevent an even bigger loss.
(Let's see in a month time if I'm right and the car will still be sitting there ranting )


daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
tiberium2014 said:
That's an acceptable point.
Although in the other hand sometimes they need to take a loss in order to prevent an even bigger loss.
(Let's see in a month time if I'm right and the car will still be sitting there ranting )
Yes. You could well be right. He could be happy letting it sit there OR he could just be too stubborn!

fridaypassion

8,503 posts

227 months

Saturday 6th December 2014
quotequote all
There will be a reason they aren't budging. I've just sold one today I knocked a few £100 off which is unusual but I'd had it a while and was sick of the sight of it. But equally I have 2/3 cars in at the moment I'm not looking for offers on because they are very good and hard to find cars. They will sell when someone shares my view on what they are worth.

rambo19

2,737 posts

136 months

Sunday 7th December 2014
quotequote all
I don't see how you can haggle on a price over things that need doing if the car is priced accordingly.

The one single thing I hate is when people start to haggle without viewing the car.

blearyeyedboy

6,252 posts

178 months

Sunday 7th December 2014
quotequote all
Pit Pony said:
With a dealer, I don't haggle on price, I haggle on

With private, I haggle on

a) It needs a service and with the cam belt it will cost me £XXX!!!
b) There is no warranty, so it will need to be 20% cheaper than the dealer
c) Every scuff and chip will cost £50 with dent devils, so lets say £200 to get it right.
d) It needs 4 tyres at £80 a side, so lets call it £200 off
e) Nah
f) It needs new brakes and pads and even if I do it myself that will be £200
g) And then I point out 4 IDENTICAL cars I'm viewing later and ask "what's the best price you can for do cash now" and then if he's priced up the faults, I'll ask for 5% off.

Much more successful with private types.
a) A service and cambelt are done on schedule and they're not yet due.
b) If you want a warranty, buy from a dealer. The going rate for a private sale is £xxx
c) d) and f), even if they need doing, are factored into the price already, and you're not making sense with e) I'm afraid.
g) I'm sorry but I know that even with the (fairly trivial stuff) you've pointed out, I have other buyers coming too and I'm confident I can get a better price for this car from them than you're offering. Would you like to offer me a higher price than you have, or otherwise I'll pop back indoors for a cup of tea and wish you luck with other cars you're seeing.

and the all important:

h) If someone comes over all Billy Big Balls in a private sale, I'm quite on my guard that something's about to go wrong and less likely to sell it to you at any price. Sorry, the car's no longer for sale and if I get too much grief, you're not worth the extra hassle/risk over just trading the thing in.

I'm sure you have some success with that negotiating tactic but it's very one-dimensional and sometimes you need a different approach. Negotiation isn't only about browbeating people. Sometimes it's about rapport building and giving ground where it helps ease the deal. I'm not there to make new friends but there's no need to be an arse about haggling.

Remember, sellers can walk away too.

cheddar

4,637 posts

173 months

Sunday 7th December 2014
quotequote all
blearyeyedboy said:
I'm not there to make new friends but there's no need to be an arse about haggling.

Remember, sellers can walk away too.
Agreed.

Had a chap call me about a faultless 5000 mile 1 year old car I'd priced to sell quickly but he just couldn't help himself or see sense, after a bazillion questions he left me his number expecting me to chase him and when I didn't call he'd call me back and ask the same questions over and over, this went on for three days and because he was the buyer he expected to be in charge and romanced into buying. I was always polite and clear and when he called for the fourth time late on day 3 I told him the car had just been sold and he went ballistic.

There are those who know the price of everything and the value of nothing, he was one of them........



Hainey

4,381 posts

199 months

Sunday 7th December 2014
quotequote all
jamesedwards said:
Pit Pony said:
With private, I haggle on

a) It needs a service and with the cam belt it will cost me £XXX!!!
b) There is no warranty, so it will need to be 20% cheaper than the dealer
c) Every scuff and chip will cost £50 with dent devils, so lets say £200 to get it right.
d) It needs 4 tyres at £80 a side, so lets call it £200 off
e) Nah
f) It needs new brakes and pads and even if I do it myself that will be £200
g) And then I point out 4 IDENTICAL cars I'm viewing later and ask "what's the best price you can for do cash now" and then if he's priced up the faults, I'll ask for 5% off.

Much more successful with private types.
I'd politely tell you ps off and couldn't give a flying what else you were going to view. Most others would too I'd have thought. But you're a top haggler... Clearly...
Well said yes

My response to PitPony would be that if he wants a new car, he needs to buy a new car.

I've actually said that to someone who showed up with the attitude above to buy my 13 year old, 120k station hack.

VorsprungDirk

429 posts

132 months

Thursday 11th December 2014
quotequote all
monkeyzinho said:
I think you're perfectly entitled to haggle, especially if you have taken time out of your day to go and see a car that ends up being not as described or that needs more work than described/than the seller realised. Alot of people try to sell rather than pay for work and they almost always price the car at more than they are willing to accept. Just go with a maximum that you will spend in mind (not an unrealistic amount) and know the price range for cars of this age, spec & condition.
And we can choose wether or not we want to haggle based on your attitude and other contributing factors.

daemon

35,724 posts

196 months

Thursday 11th December 2014
quotequote all
VorsprungDirk said:
And we can choose wether or not we want to haggle based on your attitude and other contributing factors.
Indeed. Its harder to find good cars than good customers.