Utilising the power on a VERY powerful car...

[jamieduff1981]

XJ Flyer said:

Djtemeka said:

sp what do you guys do when traction is lost.
I go to "neutral throttle" not decelerating. then gas on again

A well timed up shift can also be a good way of turning tyre smoke into more forward speed.

I don't mean to, but this is almost always what I end up doing. It's almost subconscious but if I spin wheels in my Cerbera my instincts are to dip the clutch which corrects it immediately - but my left hand involuntarily changes up a gear too.

On the plus side, I haven't crashed it so far. On the other hand, I kinda wish I had other techniques too.

I have a length of private road now where I've tried buggering about in 1st gear to do something other than change up to 2nd. Breaking traction in 2nd gear in a straight line usually happens at around 50mph which is getting on for a reasonable chance of f##k-up, and breaking traction in 3rd gear is usually something that happens when roads are cold or damp, and at mid-revs so you're doing a scary lick if/when it goes then - which is probably why I fall back immediately on what I know works and just dip the clutch.

Ultimately I'd rather lack courage than hit a tree.

[bennyboysvuk]

Djtemeka said:

sp what do you guys do when traction is lost.
I go to "neutral throttle" not decelerating. then gas on again

It depends on the circumstance. In the car, sometimes I just stay on the power and ride it out. If I really need the traction then backing off the throttle a touch works.

If I'm on the bike then it will only spin up in the wet, but backing off the throttle pretty damn fast usually works since when it spins up, it really flares and can have the back stepping out by a foot, very, very quickly, which isn't necessarily what you want when getting up to speed after joining a dual carriageway.

[Zod]

cerb4.5lee said:

Hungrymc said:

On the M3 comments above, I think the V8 is a little underwhelming due to its size and weight. Wonderful engine and a lively chassis. But just too heavy and I don't like the way the stability intervenes.

Absolutely spot on and that is exactly how I would describe it pretty much word for word.

in my M5, I found that MDM was the solution to that (the M traction mode).

[MC Bodge]

bennyboysvuk said:

If I'm on the bike then it will only spin up in the wet, but backing off the throttle pretty damn fast usually works since when it spins up, it really flares and can have the back stepping out by a foot, very, very quickly, which isn't necessarily what you want when getting up to speed after joining a dual carriageway.

-Do you mean shutting-off the throttle quickly?

Yes, it all happens quite quickly, but holding the gas or easing it off more gently is usually the preferred option.


...and PR3 tyres.

[9mm]

Anyone who says that they would choose something like a Passat diesel over an M5/M6/F-type/SLS if money was no object or there wasn't a specific need (like going to the tip) is either lying or not remotely interested in cars. Other than the most outrageous hypercars or road legal track specials, any 'VERY powerful cars' can be used for going to the shops just as easily as a Nissan Micra. As for this tortoise and hare bks about having to stop for fuel too many times, I'd like to know where these 1000 mile non-stop heroes get their bladder control or ability to concentrate for eight hours straight without a break. Plus the little matter of how often you need to drive 1000, or even 200 miles in a day. To the reps who shout "me", you're a liar if you say you'd stick to your TDi even if an M5 was available and affordable.

[xRIEx]

9mm said:

or even 200 miles in a day. To the reps who shout "me", you're a liar if you say you'd stick to your TDi even if an M5 was ... affordable.

And if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle.

[cerb4.5lee]

Zod said:

n my M5, I found that MDM was the solution to that (the M traction mode).

I thought MDM was good too, traction on full is pretty restrictive, although in the dry I mostly switched it all off if I was having fun as that just suited me better.

[E65Ross]

xRIEx said:

9mm said:

or even 200 miles in a day. To the reps who shout "me", you're a liar if you say you'd stick to your TDi even if an M5 was ... affordable.

And if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle.

He does make a point though

[xRIEx]

E65Ross said:

xRIEx said:

9mm said:

or even 200 miles in a day. To the reps who shout "me", you're a liar if you say you'd stick to your TDi even if an M5 was ... affordable.

And if my aunt had balls she'd be my uncle.

He does make a point though

It's a point that comes from fantasy land - the primary benefit of diesel to consumers and much of its current popularity is due to its (perhaps perceived) cost benefits. If a Hummer H1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if a LaF or P1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if an S63 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one - we can go on and on and it adds absolutely zero to the discussion.


If alcohol didn't cause intoxication, we'd all drink and drive.
If cancer wasn't painful and fatal, we wouldn't be scared of it.
Etc. etc.

Take away the prime characteristic of a thing and it ceases to be, it becomes something else.

[E65Ross]

xRIEx said:

It's a point that comes from fantasy land - the primary benefit of diesel to consumers and much of its current popularity is due to its (perhaps perceived) cost benefits. If a Hummer H1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if a LaF or P1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if an S63 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one - we can go on and on and it adds absolutely zero to the discussion.


If alcohol didn't cause intoxication, we'd all drink and drive.
If cancer wasn't painful and fatal, we wouldn't be scared of it.
Etc. etc.

Take away the prime characteristic of a thing and it ceases to be, it becomes something else.

The point being made was that all those saying that high performance cars are "pointless" etc are saying that for reasons which largely relate to cost, not because they are actually pointless.

I'll hold my hands up and say I'd love an M5 but I can't afford one. Because I can't afford one, it doesn't make the car pointless.

[DeltaTango]

E65Ross said:

The point being made was that all those saying that high performance cars are "pointless" etc are saying that for reasons which largely relate to cost, not because they are actually pointless.

I'll hold my hands up and say I'd love an M5 but I can't afford one. Because I can't afford one, it doesn't make the car pointless.

Precisely. I wanted an M5 but could only stretch to an M135i. You pay more for better things in all parts of life, as a rule, it's up to you what you prioritise.

[9mm]

E65Ross said:

xRIEx said:

It's a point that comes from fantasy land - the primary benefit of diesel to consumers and much of its current popularity is due to its (perhaps perceived) cost benefits. If a Hummer H1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if a LaF or P1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if an S63 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one - we can go on and on and it adds absolutely zero to the discussion.


If alcohol didn't cause intoxication, we'd all drink and drive.
If cancer wasn't painful and fatal, we wouldn't be scared of it.
Etc. etc.

Take away the prime characteristic of a thing and it ceases to be, it becomes something else.

The point being made was that all those saying that high performance cars are "pointless" etc are saying that for reasons which largely relate to cost, not because they are actually pointless.

I'll hold my hands up and say I'd love an M5 but I can't afford one. Because I can't afford one, it doesn't make the car pointless.

Exactly that and I'm in the same position. What I wouldn't say is that I prefer my TDi regardless, and use any reason to justify that, anything but admit I can't actually have that very powerful car. How many lottery winners keep the old TDi after their win?

[xRIEx]

E65Ross said:

xRIEx said:

It's a point that comes from fantasy land - the primary benefit of diesel to consumers and much of its current popularity is due to its (perhaps perceived) cost benefits. If a Hummer H1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if a LaF or P1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if an S63 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one - we can go on and on and it adds absolutely zero to the discussion.


If alcohol didn't cause intoxication, we'd all drink and drive.
If cancer wasn't painful and fatal, we wouldn't be scared of it.
Etc. etc.

Take away the prime characteristic of a thing and it ceases to be, it becomes something else.

The point being made was that all those saying that high performance cars are "pointless" etc are saying that for reasons which largely relate to cost, not because they are actually pointless.

I'll hold my hands up and say I'd love an M5 but I can't afford one. Because I can't afford one, it doesn't make the car pointless.

I'm not saying the cars in question are pointless, I'm saying that particular argument is pointless.

Person A: "I chose my current car because it's cheap to run."
Person B: "Don't tell me you wouldn't have bought <insert expensive car to run> if it was cheap to run?"
Person A: "Well, duh."

It's begging the question.

Edited by xRIEx on Friday 28th November 12:20

[9mm]

xRIEx said:

E65Ross said:

xRIEx said:

It's a point that comes from fantasy land - the primary benefit of diesel to consumers and much of its current popularity is due to its (perhaps perceived) cost benefits. If a Hummer H1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if a LaF or P1 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one; if an S63 was the most affordable vehicle, all the cost-conscious purchasers would have one - we can go on and on and it adds absolutely zero to the discussion.


If alcohol didn't cause intoxication, we'd all drink and drive.
If cancer wasn't painful and fatal, we wouldn't be scared of it.
Etc. etc.

Take away the prime characteristic of a thing and it ceases to be, it becomes something else.

The point being made was that all those saying that high performance cars are "pointless" etc are saying that for reasons which largely relate to cost, not because they are actually pointless.

I'll hold my hands up and say I'd love an M5 but I can't afford one. Because I can't afford one, it doesn't make the car pointless.

I'm not saying the cars in question are pointless, I'm saying that particular argument is pointless.

Person A: "I chose my current car because it's cheap to run."
Person B: "Don't tell me you wouldn't have bought <insert expensive car to run> if it was cheap to run?"
Person A: "Well, duh."

It's begging the question.

Edited by xRIEx on Friday 28th November 12:20

A more likely scenario would be:

Person A: "I chose my current car because it's all the car anyone needs in the real world. You can't even use half the performance of your [insert VERY powerful car]".
Person B: "Don't tell me you wouldn't have bought a [insert VERY powerful car] if you could afford it?"
Person A: Nope, I prefer the driving characteristics of my diesel and there is more room in the back. Also I can drive 1000 miles to a campsite in southern France without having to stop for a pee. Same as why I live in a two bed terrace in stsville. Who needs more than two beds and being one minute from the motorway? Of course, I could buy two of your [insert VERY powerful car] and live in Belgravia if I wanted but it would be pointless.
Person B: Yeah, right.

[MC Bodge]

If it were me looking for the ideal one car in the UK, I would have a family estate car that was brisk enough at accelerating, handled well, ideally didn't need filling up constantly, not too wide and could be driven enthusiastically on tight, bumpy roads (with some extra lighting up front for the back roads), with sensible sized rims and tyres that cope with wet and slippery roads.

It probably wouldn't actually be an Uber-car like a modern M5/SLS/AMG.

I did once drive an Audi S6 4.2 (ok, not up to the modern Uber standards) estate. It could overtake well, but didn't feel as fast as I'd expected it to. Ride and Handling weren't to my tastes either -and it did 18mpg!

I'd have a lightweight/old sports cars too, though.

Fwiw, I currently choose to ride a good handling, usable 675cc street bike rather than a 1000cc sports bike.
-Cost wasn't a factor in the used market, all kinds of bikes were available.

Edited by MC Bodge on Friday 28th November 14:40

[StottyEvo]

sealtt said:

StottyEvo said:

A women I work with sold her M5 for this specific reason, whenever pulling out of junctions in the wet the TC was kicking in and it annoyed her greatly. Shes always had high powered cars so drives quickly, but shes 50, not exactly a yobbo... She traded the M5 in for an M3!

As in the new M5 with this same engine? I presume it has the same TC system as my M6 (2013) had, which worked really well. You didn't even notice the TC system kicking in, it just restricted the power very nicely, made the power very usable in the wet.

Like I said before though, even with it's 560bhp the car is just dull to drive, well for me anyway.

Yeh it will be the same. These are second hand comments from me, she said "I pull out of a junctions and it just spins up and doesn't go anywhere, its really pissing me off..." I had a 123D before, the TC was so invasive it bordered on dangerous, IMO anyway. Every time I started the car I turned off the stop/start and set the TCS into DTC mode

[ArnieVXR]

I ran my 1200hp Monaro on the road for a while. It pulled 10.2 on the quarter, so was literally as fast as a Veyron. Most of the time I drove round off boost and at the speed limit. Spooling the turbos on the street was daft, as you ended up breaking the speed limit by stupid amounts in no time at all and would also catch other road users out. Keeping the tail behind the car was a problem, even with drag radials. Eventually, lost the tail at the Pod and wrote it off.

I now have a 1500hp++ street legal Audi that runs 8.5 at York. Performance is f*cking mental, much faster than your average superbike. I'd never consider driving it hard on the street. It's just too fast.

You don't get use to driving at those sorts of speeds, as the car will ALWAYS be on the verge of losing it and crashing.

[RDMcG]

Years ago I was on the M5 board one evening when a young man came on with questions about a new V10 M5. We all thought it was trolling for a while, and that a teenager could not possibly own one. It was his first night posting, and his last. A very,very sobering day when we heard that he and his three passengers died that night...by page 3 of the thread the realization begins to dawn on us...


http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60-m5-e61-m5-tou...

This is one of the reasons why I would not buy a powerful car from my son as a young man, and did not et him drive my sports cars until he had become a sensible driver ( which he is now, and welcome to drive anything)

[Output Flange]

9mm said:

Anyone who says that they would choose something like a Passat diesel over an M5/M6/F-type/SLS if money was no object or there wasn't a specific need (like going to the tip) is either lying or not remotely interested in cars.

I'd chose a 530d or 535d over an M5 of the current generation. And I like cars A LOT.

[MC Bodge]

ArnieVXR said:

I ran my 1200hp Monaro on the road for a while. It pulled 10.2 on the quarter, so was literally as fast as a Veyron. Most of the time I drove round off boost and at the speed limit. Spooling the turbos on the street was daft, as you ended up breaking the speed limit by stupid amounts in no time at all and would also catch other road users out. Keeping the tail behind the car was a problem, even with drag radials. Eventually, lost the tail at the Pod and wrote it off.

I now have a 1500hp++ street legal Audi that runs 8.5 at York. Performance is f*cking mental, much faster than your average superbike. I'd never consider driving it hard on the street. It's just too fast.

You don't get use to driving at those sorts of speeds, as the car will ALWAYS be on the verge of losing it and crashing.

Good grief!