Utilising the power on a VERY powerful car...

[braddo]

ArnieVXR said:

I ran my 1200hp Monaro on the road for a while. It pulled 10.2 on the quarter, so was literally as fast as a Veyron. Most of the time I drove round off boost and at the speed limit. Spooling the turbos on the street was daft, as you ended up breaking the speed limit by stupid amounts in no time at all and would also catch other road users out. Keeping the tail behind the car was a problem, even with drag radials. Eventually, lost the tail at the Pod and wrote it off.

I now have a 1500hp++ street legal Audi that runs 8.5 at York. Performance is f*cking mental, much faster than your average superbike. I'd never consider driving it hard on the street. It's just too fast.

You don't get use to driving at those sorts of speeds, as the car will ALWAYS be on the verge of losing it and crashing.

Thus far this appears to be the winning definition of "VERY powerful car".

Any photos of the Audi you'd like to share?

[xRIEx]

braddo said:

ArnieVXR said:

I ran my 1200hp Monaro on the road for a while. It pulled 10.2 on the quarter, so was literally as fast as a Veyron. Most of the time I drove round off boost and at the speed limit. Spooling the turbos on the street was daft, as you ended up breaking the speed limit by stupid amounts in no time at all and would also catch other road users out. Keeping the tail behind the car was a problem, even with drag radials. Eventually, lost the tail at the Pod and wrote it off.

I now have a 1500hp++ street legal Audi that runs 8.5 at York. Performance is f*cking mental, much faster than your average superbike. I'd never consider driving it hard on the street. It's just too fast.

You don't get use to driving at those sorts of speeds, as the car will ALWAYS be on the verge of losing it and crashing.

Thus far this appears to be the winning definition of "VERY powerful car".

Any photos of the Audi you'd like to share?

Or videos, even?

[sealtt]

RDMcG said:

Years ago I was on the M5 board one evening when a young man came on with questions about a new V10 M5. We all thought it was trolling for a while, and that a teenager could not possibly own one. It was his first night posting, and his last. A very,very sobering day when we heard that he and his three passengers died that night...by page 3 of the thread the realization begins to dawn on us...


http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e60-m5-e61-m5-tou...

This is one of the reasons why I would not buy a powerful car from my son as a young man, and did not et him drive my sports cars until he had become a sensible driver ( which he is now, and welcome to drive anything)

That's a pretty shocking story, especially to see it happen on the forum. You know, these days I actually share your opinion about restricting the kids. I was lucky and made some money when I was young, I bought an M3 when I was 19 and a 911 turbo when I was 20.. great combination, a young guy with something to prove and the cars to do it in. I span the M3 the day I got it, nothing serious fortunately, and never had an accident in the 911 - but looking back and being 100% honest I did definitely drive too fast & risky at times, something I didn't really notice or give much thought to at the time. I feel very sorry for my parents!

So I think I am definitely on your page about this, though I'd probably let them drive the car if I was in the car with them - just to have a taste of it - but certainly driving within the speed limits and very carefully.

[sealtt]

ArnieVXR said:

I ran my 1200hp Monaro on the road for a while. It pulled 10.2 on the quarter, so was literally as fast as a Veyron. Most of the time I drove round off boost and at the speed limit. Spooling the turbos on the street was daft, as you ended up breaking the speed limit by stupid amounts in no time at all and would also catch other road users out. Keeping the tail behind the car was a problem, even with drag radials. Eventually, lost the tail at the Pod and wrote it off.

I now have a 1500hp++ street legal Audi that runs 8.5 at York. Performance is f*cking mental, much faster than your average superbike. I'd never consider driving it hard on the street. It's just too fast.

You don't get use to driving at those sorts of speeds, as the car will ALWAYS be on the verge of losing it and crashing.

Wow, now look how ridiculous we look complaining that an M6 is too powerful!!! Such a heavily tuned car must be a nightmare on roads I'd have thought, I wonder how tempting it is when there is open road ahead of you just to open it up!!

[ArnieVXR]

Losing the Monaro on a patch of oil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FagIAFwOUzE
PS I would have beaten that Yank. My 60-ft times were rubbish due to the lack of a trans-brake.

Test run from inside the Audi (9-second pass roughly speaking):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79M8t7UEKk8
Witness the tatty tax disc hanging off the screen.

Me and the Audi losing this year's SuperCup championship by 0.1 seconds to John Sleath's diesel truck (oh the indignity):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XnJ25vvlM8
4-minutes 32-seconds in, though you should watch the rest

[sealtt]

ArnieVXR said:

Losing the Monaro on a patch of oil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FagIAFwOUzE
PS I would have beaten that Yank. My 60-ft times were rubbish due to the lack of a trans-brake.

Test run from inside the Audi (9-second pass roughly speaking):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79M8t7UEKk8
Witness the tatty tax disc hanging off the screen.

Me and the Audi losing this year's SuperCup championship by 0.1 seconds to John Sleath's diesel truck (oh the indignity):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XnJ25vvlM8
4-minutes 32-seconds in, though you should watch the rest

Love the in car video, that launch is unbelievable. The G force hurts my insides just watching it!

[RobM77]

I've owned and driven quite a wide variety of road cars and I think there are occasions where you can use the power of a very fast (>400bhp/tonne) road car, although obviously those occasions diminish the more power you have. I think what's more limiting are the general capabilities of such a car, i.e. the brakes, suspension, tyres etc, which are all usually just as high performance as the acceleration that the engine provides; a truly quick car at 60mph on a twisty B road will feel like its virtually stationary - and where's the fun in that?

I'm in an odd position now, owning the slowest car I've ever owned (a BMW 320d) and the fastest (a mildly tweaked Lotus 2-Eleven). The BMW is obviously fun when I want it to be, with not much grip, a predictable FE/RWD chassis etc and I can use all the grip and slither around as much as I want, especially when it's wet; but the Lotus is a bit silly on the road if I'm honest - I can't think of a single corner anywhere I've ever been where you could use the 2-Eleven's full capabilities, even in the wet, and even the straights where I can open it up fully are few and far between, if you want to keep things sensible from a legal perspective. I bought the 2-Eleven for track days and now that I've owned it two years I can confidently say that track days are where it spends the vast majority of its time. The best way to describe it is to imagine driving through a 20/30mph limit road in town in a normal car like a Mondeo or Focus etc - the sort of speed that's well within the capabilities of the car and you're only really thinking about where to point the car. That's what a lepton feels like on a B road in the 2-Eleven. Tracks are great, because you get the slithering fun of the BMW but at a higher speed with more sensory enjoyment, but roads are a bit daft really.

So to go back to the OP's mention on the P1 etc. I don't really hanker after cars like that like I used to. I dream of owning a GT with a charasmatic engine, like a 550 Maranello, to drive down through Europe, but track days and racing are where my love of fast cars gets put to good use.

[ArnieVXR]

sealtt said:

Wow, now look how ridiculous we look complaining that an M6 is too powerful!!! Such a heavily tuned car must be a nightmare on roads I'd have thought, I wonder how tempting it is when there is open road ahead of you just to open it up!!

My engine on an early dyno run. Watch the readout at the top/middle of the screen @ 4-minute 15-seconds. It shows bhp. See how quickly it jumps up by 3-400bhp. This was on around 15-17psi IIRC. When I'm racing we hit around 25psi.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ow0em6OUAsY

[E65Ross]

Output Flange said:

9mm said:

Anyone who says that they would choose something like a Passat diesel over an M5/M6/F-type/SLS if money was no object or there wasn't a specific need (like going to the tip) is either lying or not remotely interested in cars.

I'd chose a 530d or 535d over an M5 of the current generation. And I like cars A LOT.

Are you for real? How come?

Before going for the M6 my dad test drove a 640d, which is basically as economical as the 30/35d variants yet more powerful, and he still ended up with the M6.

The M5 has a very decent range, it's faster, sounds nicer, and rides every bit as good as a normal 5er due to no run flats....I can't think of any reason why you'd rather the slower, less refined and more industrial engine over the M5; other than the save money?

Is it because the diesel can go further without stopping? Guessing the M5 is going to be all but identical but my old can can easily top 400+ miles to a tank, which seems perfectly fine. on a long drive you could nudge 500 miles. So why else would you prefer a less refined diesel to the V8 petrol, other than to save money?

[RobM77]

E65Ross said:

Output Flange said:

9mm said:

Anyone who says that they would choose something like a Passat diesel over an M5/M6/F-type/SLS if money was no object or there wasn't a specific need (like going to the tip) is either lying or not remotely interested in cars.

I'd chose a 530d or 535d over an M5 of the current generation. And I like cars A LOT.

Are you for real? How come?

Before going for the M6 my dad test drove a 640d, which is basically as economical as the 30/35d variants yet more powerful, and he still ended up with the M6.

The M5 has a very decent range, it's faster, sounds nicer, and rides every bit as good as a normal 5er due to no run flats....I can't think of any reason why you'd rather the slower, less refined and more industrial engine over the M5; other than the save money?

Is it because the diesel can go further without stopping? Guessing the M5 is going to be all but identical but my old can can easily top 400+ miles to a tank, which seems perfectly fine. on a long drive you could nudge 500 miles. So why else would you prefer a less refined diesel to the V8 petrol, other than to save money?

I often get a lot of flak (or even just plain old abuse) for my car choices on here, and yes, I would choose plenty of slower models over their faster equivalents, because often slower models are lighter, easier to find with manual gearboxes (some cars, like the 335d, are auto only..), have less grip (i.e. more fun more of the time), are quieter on the motorway (smaller tyre contact patch) and better balanced. I shan't mention examples because I'll start an argument again. However, in the above example, if we're talking pukka M cars and AMG cars, and if money really was no object, then I'd take the M car or AMG car every single time. The main reason for that is a pukka M car like the M3 or M5 has completely different suspension and setup, and they normally drive beautifully, even if you're not going to use the power. If it's a 330ci vs a 320i though it's a much different argument, because they have identical suspension, so the differences are far more subtle.

[Output Flange]

E65Ross said:

Are you for real? How come?

Because going fast in a straight line doesn't set my cock on fire, and the diesel version will go fast enough for the road round corners. They're big old barges that don't do much for me in terms of how they drive, so a 530d would do just fine, thanks. Ideally I'd have a 530d on whatever the smallest diameter wheels you can get are, with the skinniest tyres available. The range on either is probably ample, but the farther the better, and given the interior is near-as-dammit the same on them there's little to pick.

It actually wouldn't have to be a diesel model either. I'm out of touch with what the other petrol models available are, but I'm sure there'd be something suitable around the 535i level, assuming it exists.

[liner33]

ArnieVXR said:

Losing the Monaro on a patch of oil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FagIAFwOUzE
PS I would have beaten that Yank. My 60-ft times were rubbish due to the lack of a trans-brake.

Test run from inside the Audi (9-second pass roughly speaking):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79M8t7UEKk8
Witness the tatty tax disc hanging off the screen.

Me and the Audi losing this year's SuperCup championship by 0.1 seconds to John Sleath's diesel truck (oh the indignity):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8XnJ25vvlM8
4-minutes 32-seconds in, though you should watch the rest

York still looks like a farm track I see ! Raced there when it was on the ACU calendar in the early 90's , everyone in the class broke their gearboxes and the winner won on a streetbike , vowed never to return.

do they still serve food from the bus ?

[MC Bodge]

The "less-refined" thing is all relative. The relative refinement of 4/5/6/8/12 cylinders and even of petrol or diesel (for 99% of driving) is over-emphasised by some. Ok, so the crank is balanced better by some configurations and a 1 cylinder can be a bit lumpy, but there are few cars with single cylinder engines.

The NVH of most modern mid-size upwards cars is very good. It is rarely intrusive and rarely an issue worth commenting on, despite some people declaring that some numbers of cylinders are "a chore" to drive...

Going back to the original post, it seems that some can't understand why some people don't feel the need for the halo model of car with the absolute maximum possible horsepower that can't necessarily be deployed.

I can understand why some would like it though

Edited by MC Bodge on Friday 28th November 16:53

[ArnieVXR]

No sign of the bus these days. The toilets are probably the same and are in a bit of a state.

You need wellies in the pits as the concrete disappears under the encroaching mud. The car parking looks like a bomb hit the runway.

Running the strip is a bit lively to say the least. The run-off is littered with potholes, some of which are huge. And the farm track back to the start line regularly knackers suspension parts.

That said, the atmosphere is really great and the racing is far more 'personal'. Onsite bar with flexible opening hours and usually a live band too.

[ORD]

MC Bodge said:

The "less-refined" thing is all relative. The relative refinement of 4/5/6/8/12 cylinders and even of petrol or diesel (for 99% of driving) is over-emphasised by some. Ok, so the crank is balanced better by some configurations and a 1 cylinder can be a bit lumpy, but there are few cars with single cylinder engines.

The NVH of most modern mid-size upwards cars is very good. It is rarely intrusive and rarely an issue worth commenting on, despite some people declaring that some numbers of cylinders are a chore...

bks.

4 cyl BMWs (petrol and diesel) are like tractors on start-up, and all 4 cyl diesels that I have ever driven are noisy, rattly, hateful things.

[E65Ross]

MC Bodge said:

The "less-refined" thing is all relative. The relative refinement of 4/5/6/8/12 cylinders and even of petrol or diesel (for 99% of driving) is over-emphasised by some. Ok, so the crank is balanced better by some configurations and a 1 cylinder can be a bit lumpy, but there are few cars with single cylinder engines.

The NVH of most modern mid-size upwards cars is very good. It is rarely intrusive and rarely an issue worth commenting on, despite some people declaring that some numbers of cylinders are a chore...

Really, I recently drove a 2010 Audi A6 3.0 TDI and thought the engine was rather unrefined to be honest. At very slow speed and town especially. 4 cylinder diesels are all hideous, from my experience. I've been in a 520d and it was just an awful engine. Perhaps I've been spoilt with having been in some nice cars over the years as I have some friends with some nice stuff.... But to say the difference these days is minimal simply isn't true. A modern 4 cylinder diesel doesn't even come close to a V12 of just about any age for refinement and smoothness.

A chore.... No. I could live with a 4 cylinder diesel. But I'd be outright lying if I said I'd prefer it to a V12 petrol.

[FrankUnderwood]

The V8 in the E65 is lovely isn't it

Forget about power, it's brilliant because it's so smooth, silky, effortless and is nicely linear in its throttle response.

[cerb4.5lee]

ORD said:

MC Bodge said:

The "less-refined" thing is all relative. The relative refinement of 4/5/6/8/12 cylinders and even of petrol or diesel (for 99% of driving) is over-emphasised by some. Ok, so the crank is balanced better by some configurations and a 1 cylinder can be a bit lumpy, but there are few cars with single cylinder engines.

The NVH of most modern mid-size upwards cars is very good. It is rarely intrusive and rarely an issue worth commenting on, despite some people declaring that some numbers of cylinders are a chore...

bks.

4 cyl BMWs (petrol and diesel) are like tractors on start-up, and all 4 cyl diesels that I have ever driven are noisy, rattly, hateful things.

I think BMW`s 4 pot diesel is a hateful thing too and even the 6 cylinder diesel cant hide what fuel it uses at low revs/speeds as Ross mentioned.

Maybe I have just been a little spoilt with driving some nice petrol engines and don't get me wrong I always enjoy driving a 6 cylinder diesel but I think you can tell the quality of a larger petrol engine with more cylinders.

Don't mind 4 pot petrol engines either but I do struggle with a 4 pot diesel.

[MC Bodge]

If you are all anywhere near as perturbed by mid-size and low cylinder quantity engines as you are making out, then you are obviously a very sensitive bunch

[FrankUnderwood]

MC Bodge said:

If you are all anywhere near as perturbed by mid-size and low cylinder quantity engines as you are making out, then you are obviously a very sensitive bunch

If cars cost 50p and we spent 5 minutes a day in one I would agree.

But that's not the case.

We tend to spend significant amounts of time in cars and for most people they're the second most expensive purchase.

Hence if you could afford to then you would take something like a performance orientated V8 over a diesel.