Ambulance and a red light
Discussion
Charlie Michael said:
It was clear for me to move forward through the red light.
You're also right that using common sense, I could've moved forward safely - However, seeing the responses from here. It appears that some others that have driven through the red light, have ended up suffering unfairly at the hands of the law.
Also, seeing as a couple of Paramedics have said that I have done the right thing. It is something that I will continue to do so in the future.
What if your delay results in someone dying? is that not worth the unfair hands of the law?You're also right that using common sense, I could've moved forward safely - However, seeing the responses from here. It appears that some others that have driven through the red light, have ended up suffering unfairly at the hands of the law.
Also, seeing as a couple of Paramedics have said that I have done the right thing. It is something that I will continue to do so in the future.
EnthusiastOwned said:
What if your delay results in someone dying? is that not worth the unfair hands of the law?
What if you moving forward to let the ambulance past results in them (or you) being hit from the side by another car who didn't expect anything to be coming through a red light?That might add more than the minimal delay that results in them not being able to get past you whilst the light is red.
EnthusiastOwned said:
What if your delay results in someone dying? is that not worth the unfair hands of the law?
I'm disappointed. You haven't mentioned children, the disabled or mentally unwell people in your question. How can anyone give a true reply unless you really, properly lean on their conscience? Oh, the horror, the huge manatee. KTF said:
What if you moving forward to let the ambulance past results in them (or you) being hit from the side by another car who didn't expect anything to be coming through a red light?
That might add more than the minimal delay that results in them not being able to get past you whilst the light is red.
Common sense? Caution? Brains? Don't go into a blind junction unless you know you can pass. Safety first, always.That might add more than the minimal delay that results in them not being able to get past you whilst the light is red.
EnthusiastOwned said:
What if your delay results in someone dying? is that not worth the unfair hands of the law?
How exactly do you expect me to answer that? As I said before, I don't want someone to die because I held up an ambulance. However, when the law is so strict, my first instinct is to look out for myself. I also at the time had in my head the stories of people getting fined/points on their licence and my gut response was to stay put to not risk that.
I don't think you'll change your opinion on what I did and I can't change what happened this morning now, so we'll have to agree to disagree.
EnthusiastOwned said:
What if your delay results in someone dying? is that not worth the unfair hands of the law?
What if, by going through the lights, you are prosecuted, penalised, lose your job and you, your significant other and children are out of a house, having to find a new home, school and life somewhere else?b
ks. As sad as it is, until the law protects me when I'm being ambushed by emergency vehicles, I'm not going to break the law.KTF said:
surveyor said:
I do wonder how patient any emergency service driver would be if you did not dap into a bus lane to let them past as that video suggested.
Why should you move into the bus lane if it is clear? If it is covered by cameras then you may get a fine for doing so.They services would use the bus lane to get round you instead so you should stay put.
Merely pointing out that the video was not skewed towards real life, and in real life the EV driver would be up your chuff (or hopefully in the bus lane himself).
Impasse said:
EnthusiastOwned said:
What if your delay results in someone dying? is that not worth the unfair hands of the law?
I'm disappointed. You haven't mentioned children, the disabled or mentally unwell people in your question. How can anyone give a true reply unless you really, properly lean on their conscience? Oh, the horror, the huge manatee. 
Charlie Michael said:
How exactly do you expect me to answer that?
As I said before, I don't want someone to die because I held up an ambulance. However, when the law is so strict, my first instinct is to look out for myself. I also at the time had in my head the stories of people getting fined/points on their licence and my gut response was to stay put to not risk that.
I don't think you'll change your opinion on what I did and I can't change what happened this morning now, so we'll have to agree to disagree.
It was an exaggerated response, I don't expect you to answer. In reality, is the 30 seconds going to make that much of a difference? Not really, is it your fault? No, not at all. I just think it's a sad state of affairs that a fine and points / the law were the first thing that popped into peoples heads in this thread, such a shame. As I said before, I don't want someone to die because I held up an ambulance. However, when the law is so strict, my first instinct is to look out for myself. I also at the time had in my head the stories of people getting fined/points on their licence and my gut response was to stay put to not risk that.
I don't think you'll change your opinion on what I did and I can't change what happened this morning now, so we'll have to agree to disagree.
Randomthoughts said:
What if, by going through the lights, you are prosecuted, penalised, lose your job and you, your significant other and children are out of a house, having to find a new home, school and life somewhere else?
bks. As sad as it is, until the law protects me when I'm being ambushed by emergency vehicles, I'm not going to break the law.
I despair in the human race sometimes.b
ks. As sad as it is, until the law protects me when I'm being ambushed by emergency vehicles, I'm not going to break the law.Charlie Michael said:
So this morning I found myself in a slightly difficult position. I'm at a set of lights, with a car next to me and a lane that filters for left-only. Bearing in mind that I'm already parked at the lights, an ambulance comes from behind me and wants to go through the junction that I, and the other car are at, blocking it's progress.
The Ambulance driver gets right behind me with sirens and lights flashing, he then proceeds to hold down his horn for me to move, at this point, I decide not to, due to the simple fact that I cannot go through a red light, I can't go back, as there's an Ambulance there, I can't go right, as there is a car there, and I can't move over to the left to either join the left filter lane or mount the curb as there is an island in the middle with a high curb that my car cannot mount.
I felt guilty that I was inconveniencing an Ambulance and obviously in all other situations, I would move over (there's a hospital near where I live so moving over is a regular thing round here), however, am I in the wrong for not moving forward? What is the legal standpoint for this situation, as I have heard stories before of other motorists receiving fines for going through a red light, hence my reluctance to go forward.
You did the right thing, the ambulance driver is a dick for doing that and sounds like he/she was suffering from 'red mist'The Ambulance driver gets right behind me with sirens and lights flashing, he then proceeds to hold down his horn for me to move, at this point, I decide not to, due to the simple fact that I cannot go through a red light, I can't go back, as there's an Ambulance there, I can't go right, as there is a car there, and I can't move over to the left to either join the left filter lane or mount the curb as there is an island in the middle with a high curb that my car cannot mount.
I felt guilty that I was inconveniencing an Ambulance and obviously in all other situations, I would move over (there's a hospital near where I live so moving over is a regular thing round here), however, am I in the wrong for not moving forward? What is the legal standpoint for this situation, as I have heard stories before of other motorists receiving fines for going through a red light, hence my reluctance to go forward.
Major pet peev of mine.
EnthusiastOwned said:
Randomthoughts said:
What if, by going through the lights, you are prosecuted, penalised, lose your job and you, your significant other and children are out of a house, having to find a new home, school and life somewhere else?
bks. As sad as it is, until the law protects me when I'm being ambushed by emergency vehicles, I'm not going to break the law.
I despair in the human race sometimes.b
ks. As sad as it is, until the law protects me when I'm being ambushed by emergency vehicles, I'm not going to break the law.kapiteinlangzaam said:
EnthusiastOwned said:
I despair in the human race sometimes.
You shouldn't despair at him, but rather the total s who have systematically failed to protect the motorist in these situations over the last years.If you are sitting on 9pts, do you really expect someone to run the risk of triggering the red-light camera and the associated consequences?
Not a chance!
KTF said:
Why should you move into the bus lane if it is clear? If it is covered by cameras then you may get a fine for doing so.
They services would use the bus lane to get round you instead so you should stay put.
No we don't and I don't expect you to either. They services would use the bus lane to get round you instead so you should stay put.
I don't generally use clear bus lanes to respond to in. As that's undertaking, and when you do it, people who aren't paying attention see the blue lights and pull over to the left smashing in to you as you undertake. We've seen time after time, so go offside instead
Charlie Michael said:
Challo said:
I think it depends on the junction, and what you can or cannot do. Most of the times its possible for you creep forward slightly across the white line allowing enough space for the Emergency Vehicle to get through.
If it was blind junction, and i was not able to see the other traffic then I would not have moved, and waited till the green light.
OP - Can you show us the junction in question?
The is the junction: https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.4107103,-0.29673...If it was blind junction, and i was not able to see the other traffic then I would not have moved, and waited till the green light.
OP - Can you show us the junction in question?
I'm in the left lane of the right only lanes so effectively the middle lane.
As I said before, I can creep forward - but only past a red - which is where I felt unsure as to what to do.
Ideally i would have gone through slightly to help the Ambulance, but I can understand why you didn't, and the comments from the response vehicle drivers confirm you where right to do so. All you can do is make a judgement call at the time.
I've said my 2p, so I'm out. But I'll just leave this here before I go - Let not any one pacify his conscience by the delusion that he can do no harm if he takes no part, and forms no opinion. Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing.
Edited by EnthusiastOwned on Wednesday 26th November 16:56
What about crossing double white lines?
A12 coming into London has a couple of tunnels where the two lanes (both going same way) are split by double white lines. Evidently in place to prevent lane swapping and hopefully minimise impacts/accidents in the tunnel.
Couple of weeks ago was in lane 2 with an ambulance behind me. Gaps existed in lane 1 so I moved across the double whites and the ambulance went past (and stayed in 1 until the end of the tunnel I hasten to add).
Any PHer out there who would wait until the end of the tunnel (and thus the double whites) before moving across and letting the ambulance past?
It'd have to be a very hard hearted copper who'd see this and still book you for crossing double whites.
A12 coming into London has a couple of tunnels where the two lanes (both going same way) are split by double white lines. Evidently in place to prevent lane swapping and hopefully minimise impacts/accidents in the tunnel.
Couple of weeks ago was in lane 2 with an ambulance behind me. Gaps existed in lane 1 so I moved across the double whites and the ambulance went past (and stayed in 1 until the end of the tunnel I hasten to add).
Any PHer out there who would wait until the end of the tunnel (and thus the double whites) before moving across and letting the ambulance past?
It'd have to be a very hard hearted copper who'd see this and still book you for crossing double whites.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I agree.The reason we can't go forward, is because we KNOW we're getting a ticket, and we KNOW that there's a slim chance of escape even if the media turn it into a mockery of the system.
Those who speed, do so exercising judgement as to the risk of getting caught. If they risk getting caught, that infers there's a chance they won't.
It's a fine line, but it's the difference between jumping into a river to save a child/pet/loved one/stranger and jumping into a vat of boiling acid to do the same. The former, you know you might not come away. The latter, you (should) know you're not coming away.
g3org3y said:
It'd have to be a very hard hearted copper who'd see this and still book you for crossing double whites.
The point with this one is it's not a 'computer says no' offence; you do it, and you HAVE to be at the mercy of a copper who will inevitably thank you for being attentive.At a red light camera, you get 'computer says no' moron telling you that you shouldn't have moved.
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