RE: Nissan Hakosuka GT-R: Time For Tea?

[thatdude]

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

I have a question

Can you tell me anything end everything about them?

How would I go about aquiring one?

For a given amount of money, what sort of condition could I expect?

Where can i get good parts?

How long will my marriage last if I buy one to build up?

[PZR]

Andy616 said:

Can I have a go?

Just like 'effwun', pay drivers are welcome...

[sisu]

This is the 1972 Fuji race - with Jazz Flute intro - of them in action with the Mazda RX2/3, Toyota Tureno and the Nissan Hakosuka
Part 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5iWjPjNxOs
Part 2 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y38bGoZg0sg

[PZR]

thatdude said:

I have a question

Can you tell me anything end everything about them?

Errr...

thatdude said:

How would I go about aquiring one?

Best way is to take a personal trip to Japan and go to look at the few that are for sale with the specialist dealers. There's usually several at any given time. Buying privately would be better, but logistically more difficult. It would also be better to have time on your side and not have to buy a pig in a poke, but I think that's the situation for most (relatively) rare old cars.

thatdude said:

For a given amount of money, what sort of condition could I expect?

At current exchange rate (a bit better than it has been for a while) you'd probably be best not to buy anything that was priced less than the equivalent of around 35k GBP, as it would likely be in need of a lot of work in the near future. You're probably looking at 50k GBP + for a relatively sound and correct (and genuine...) KPGC10, but the better cars with all the correct bits are way north of 90k GBP these days. I know of a couple of cars that have changed hands privately in Japan for much, much more. But they were exceptional examples.

thatdude said:

Where can i get good parts?

There are a few excellent specialists in Japan, and NOS genuine Nissan parts as well as excellent reproductions of the more esoteric stuff are available (some of it a bit pricey though). That side of things is not that much of a worry.

thatdude said:

How long will my marriage last if I buy one to build up?

Like the cars, wives have to be viewed on a case-by-case basis! My Mrs is very understanding about it all.



Just to clarify, I'm talking about PGC10 (four door) and KPGC10 (2 door 'Hard Top' coupe) GT-Rs here. We could include the even rarer KPGC110 'Ken & Mary' shape if required.

Reason I state the above is that lots of people know talk about the 'Hakosuka' as though Hakosuka=GT-R. It doesn't. The vernacular 'Hakosuka'/'Box Skyline' simply refers to the whole C10-series Nissan Skyline range, right from the short-nosed 4cyl G-series engined cars, through the 6cyl SOHC L20A-engined cars - in all sorts of body styles from column-shifting sedans through utility wagons and the slightly more glam GTs and GT-X coupes. They are all Hakosukas. But there were only two Hakosuka models with the S20 twin cam engine and all the trick parts that went with the GT-R moniker, and a total of less than two thousand Hakosuka GT-Rs made (832 4-doors and 1,113 2-doors) in comparison to a total production in the many hundreds of thousands for the other Hakosuka models. It's a little like confusing bench-seated column-shifting pre-Crossflow engined MkI Cortinas with the Lotus Cortina. Different animals.



About the car in the video: In some ways it's been a bit of a burden as much as a blessing. It was built by specialist 'R-Factory' and is a very highly developed and modified car, with an engine running very few stock internal parts and a huge compression ratio. It's at pretty much max bore and stroke for the bore centres and the height of the S20 cylinder block, and is lifed in hours before rebuilds. In short it's a race engine, and it's mated to a (much later) C-type transmission, some sophisticated suspension and many other tweaks. It's a hard act to live up to for any more standard or more period-correct early GT-R.

[HairyPutter]

Gan san no less

[roystinho]

PZR said:

Loads of interesting stuff

I think I've seen you chat about these before on here. I've looked into it getting one very briefly, but circumstances, a house move and kids plus the faff of getting one has stopped me.

I'd love a car like this on the depth of speed video

http://youtu.be/R0CA4Sgd6yI

Do you know anything about it? From my limited knowledge, it isn't a 'proper' GTR as they're all racers (is that right?). I'd want one like this, that sounds like that, that I can take out on the roads. In all honesty I'm probably a few years off getting one, like you say going to Japan seems the best way, but that's not an option - yet.

Any info would be great - this article has got me thinking about these again and if it's possible... Otherwise it's an Integrale EVO2 next

[PZR]

roystinho said:

I'd love a car like this on the depth of speed video

http://youtu.be/R0CA4Sgd6yI

Do you know anything about it? From my limited knowledge, it isn't a 'proper' GTR as they're all racers (is that right?). I'd want one like this, that sounds like that, that I can take out on the roads. In all honesty I'm probably a few years off getting one, like you say going to Japan seems the best way, but that's not an option - yet.

That's a perfect example of what I'm talking about with the 'Hakosuka=GT-R' misconception.

The car in the video is a C10-series 'Hakosuka', but it's not a KPGC10 GT-R model. It's a KGC10 GT/GT-X model modified to look like a KPGC10. If you think of a Cortina GT dolled up to look like a Lotus Cortina, it's that kind of thing.

The KGC10 models came with single carb (GT) and twin carb (GT-X) 12 valve SOHC L20A sixes (KPGC10 GT-R models came with the 24 valve, triple carb, DOHC S20 six), full 'surf line' rear quarters (GT-R model had full radius rear arches and rivet-on 'Overfenders' for race homologation purposes) and none of the other trick GT-R specific stuff (quite a long list...).

KGC10 looked like this ex-factory: http://www.nissan-global.com/EN/HERITAGE/skyline_h...

KPGC10 looked like this ex-factory: http://vital.sakura.ne.jp/NISSAN%20SKYLINE%20KGC10...

Trouble is, if you search for 'KGC10' photos on the 'net you'll get pages and pages of cars that are modified to look like KPGC10 GT-Rs. If you search for 'KPGC10' photos you'll come across many of the same photos. It's because so many GTs and GT-Xs have been modified to look like GT-Rs. I'm sure its confusing for anybody who is new to it all.

The car in the video actually belongs to my friend Eric B in the USA. Eric has posted on this forum occasionally in the past. His car is a highly modified example with a hot engine (an L28 bored up to 3 litres as far as I remember) which is probably more along the lines of what you want, as they are miles cheaper than real GT-Rs. Eric has taken the GT-R emblems off of it now...

Edited by PZR on Friday 28th November 15:02

[PZR]

roystinho said:

From my limited knowledge, it isn't a 'proper' GTR as they're all racers (is that right?).

Forgot to answer this, sorry.

In fact, the vast majority of PGC10 (4-door) and KPGC10 (2-door 'Hard Top' coupe) cars were sold as standard road cars by Nissan. Only the Works race cars - and a few special cars sold direct to privateers and well-connected teams - were built as pure race cars.

The road cars were built and sold to the general public in order to homologate the models for Japanese domestic racing.

[NJH]

That sound is right up there with the M1 race cars, properly rude.

[roystinho]

PZR said:

roystinho said:

From my limited knowledge, it isn't a 'proper' GTR as they're all racers (is that right?).

Forgot to answer this, sorry.

In fact, the vast majority of PGC10 (4-door) and KPGC10 (2-door 'Hard Top' coupe) cars were sold as standard road cars by Nissan. Only the Works race cars - and a few special cars sold direct to privateers and well-connected teams - were built as pure race cars.

The road cars were built and sold to the general public in order to homologate the models for Japanese domestic racing.

Ah, thanks for the response(s). Knowledge enhanced a smidge there. Well, obviously, now I want a KPGC10 but as they're quite expensive it's probably beyond me. I'll see what the budget is when the time comes.

Many thanks

[sisu]

thatdude said:

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

I have a question

Can you tell me anything end everything about them?

How would I go about aquiring one?

For a given amount of money, what sort of condition could I expect?

Where can i get good parts?

How long will my marriage last if I buy one to build up?

This guy in Australia documents in his blog how he sourced the car, the choice he had,who shipped it, what to expect of the Japanese classic cars, what it was like got it running correctly and who he used and the parts that he could get from Z-cars of the era and the places in Japan to acquire the C10 bits.



http://japanesenostalgiccar.com/forum/viewtopic.ph...

[PZR]

sisu said:

thatdude said:

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

I have a question

Can you tell me anything end everything about them?

How would I go about aquiring one?

For a given amount of money, what sort of condition could I expect?

Where can i get good parts?

How long will my marriage last if I buy one to build up?

This guy in Australia documents in his blog how he sourced the car, the choice he had,who shipped it, what to expect of the Japanese classic cars, what it was like got it running correctly and who he used and the parts that he could get from Z-cars of the era and the places in Japan to acquire the C10 bits.

http://japanesenostalgiccar.com/forum/viewtopic.ph...

But you (and hopefully everybody else) understand that's not a KPGC10, right?

[s m]

sisu said:

thatdude said:

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

I have a question

Can you tell me anything end everything about them?

How would I go about aquiring one?

For a given amount of money, what sort of condition could I expect?

Where can i get good parts?

How long will my marriage last if I buy one to build up?

This guy in Australia documents in his blog how he sourced the car, the choice he had,who shipped it, what to expect of the Japanese classic cars, what it was like got it running correctly and who he used and the parts that he could get from Z-cars of the era and the places in Japan to acquire the C10 bits.



http://japanesenostalgiccar.com/forum/viewtopic.ph...

I used to see a guy in one of the unloved 240K GT Skylines trundling to work in Shropshire a few years back

Have they started going up in value yet?

[sisu]

PZR said:

sisu said:

thatdude said:

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

I have a question

Can you tell me anything end everything about them?

How would I go about aquiring one?

For a given amount of money, what sort of condition could I expect?

Where can i get good parts?

How long will my marriage last if I buy one to build up?

This guy in Australia documents in his blog how he sourced the car, the choice he had,who shipped it, what to expect of the Japanese classic cars, what it was like got it running correctly and who he used and the parts that he could get from Z-cars of the era and the places in Japan to acquire the C10 bits.

http://japanesenostalgiccar.com/forum/viewtopic.ph...

But you (and hopefully everybody else) understand that's not a KPGC10, right?

Yessss as I said that it is a C10 and none of the cars in the pictures or that he looked at were your Bukkake KPG, they are just L-series engined cars.

Maybe this will explain it better... Right?

[PZR]

sisu said:

PZR said:

sisu said:

thatdude said:

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

I have a question

Can you tell me anything end everything about them?

How would I go about aquiring one?

For a given amount of money, what sort of condition could I expect?

Where can i get good parts?

How long will my marriage last if I buy one to build up?

This guy in Australia documents in his blog how he sourced the car, the choice he had,who shipped it, what to expect of the Japanese classic cars, what it was like got it running correctly and who he used and the parts that he could get from Z-cars of the era and the places in Japan to acquire the C10 bits.

http://japanesenostalgiccar.com/forum/viewtopic.ph...

But you (and hopefully everybody else) understand that's not a KPGC10, right?

Yessss as I said that it is a C10 and none of the cars in the pictures or that he looked at were your Bukkake KPG, they are just L-series engined cars.

Maybe this will explain it better... Right?

LOL
I just want to make triple sure that you realise that the subject of this thread is "Nissan Hakosuka GT-R: Time For Tea", and that the thread you linked to is all about a car that isn't one. You get that, yes?

And here's a photo for you:

Edited by PZR on Saturday 29th November 21:01

[daytona365]

It's just amazing how an elderly square box can garner such affection. This is not a slur, because I love it to bits myself. A Japanese E30 M3 if you will ?

[daytona365]

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

Would you swop it for a similar condition E30 M3 Evolution ?

[PZR]

daytona365 said:

PZR said:

KPGC10 owner here.

If anybody has any questions I'd be happy to take a shot at answering them.
Just try shutting me up.

Would you swop it for a similar condition E30 M3 Evolution ?

No thanks. Great car, but a bit late for me. I'm concentrating on older stuff. Sorry.