RE: Shed Of The Week: MG TF

[MGJohn]

B'stard Child said:

Well ^ that is your opinion

Here's mine - I enjoy MGJohn's posts - they can often be educational and they are always enthusiastic towards his chosen favorite brand but isn't that a given for any car enthusiast, I think perhaps you should relax a little and if posts by MGJohn are starting to wind you up to a point where you write stuff like that then perhaps it would be better if you skimmed over them. This is exactly what I will do with your posts because they aren't very nice.

As for time running out I do hope that when I'm 70 I'm still enjoying working on my own cars just like I do now and there are PH'rs who appreciate sharing the experience.

JM2pW

Oh and one last point - MGJohn - please don't speak for others because I doubt you will be.

My shoulders are quite broad BC... Good "skimmed" advice BC. However I prefer to let others speak for themselves.

Yonex's numerous anti posts remind me of someone I know in the trade who having been bitten hard in his financial arse having cocked up work on Rovers due to incompetence, is forever embittered and will never have a good word to say about them. Far easier to blame the car.

Contrary to popular belief, I have found that it ain't Rocket Science.

[AW111]

MGJohn - a genuine question :
Have you ever come across a k-series that wasn't dirt cheap to fix, ie dud liners or warped / softened head etc?
I am not saying they all did that, just wondering if you never came across any of the well-documented issues.

[MGJohn]

I've rebuilt several PG1s over the years. The Type A Torsen Differential fitted to the the early T-Series Turbocharged cars like the 220 Coupe I had years ago is prone to sheer it's bearing journal. It is not simply poor design weakness as some would have you believe. My investigations with several of these broken boxes indicate lack of sufficient or even any lubricant leading to bad wear in the big 6208 differential bearings. That allows oscillation under power and that vibration when giving the engine some welly fatigues the metal in the key journal area which sheers off:~



The above image clearly shows the broken off bearing journal still inside the bearing.



My 220 Turbo coupe ( Type A Differential ) came with a wodge of Invoices including one for £800 for a gearbox rebuild a few months before I got the car. Soon after, the gearbox started complaining loudly so I decided to remove it and have a look see. Placed a tray under the gearbox to collect the 2.2 litres of lubricant and removed the drain plug. What came out would not fill and egg cup! No bluddy wonder.

Every used car bought since I have always checked the volume and condition of the oil in the gearbox. Glad I did on two occasions! Insufficient lubricant.

[MGJohn]

AW111 said:

MGJohn - a genuine question :
Have you ever come across a k-series that wasn't dirt cheap to fix, ie dud liners or warped / softened head etc?
I am not saying they all did that, just wondering if you never came across any of the well-documented issues.

Myself, my sons and friends must have replaced the cylinder head gaskets on close to twenty cars in the last decade. 1.4s, 1.6s 1.8s and VVCs. We have never found one yet. However, there is always a first time. I suspect that my latest project car, an 03-MG ZT 1.8t may have liner height issues. There are signs of severe overheating. Drivers drive on when they should stop the car. That's when the cylinder head gasket or indeed other engine parts get severely damaged. Contrary to popular belief, the CHGs rarely actually fail. Invariably they are first damaged by over heating and so damaged, they "fail".

I have recovered two stranded cars for work colleagues with suspect CHG "failures" on my twin-axle braked trailer since stolen ..along with gearboxes and engines... metal thieves. One was a Rover the other a Toyota. Both drivers drove on of necessity so damage was worst than it should have been had they stopped straightaway on seeing obvious warning signs. It was cheaper to swap the engine in the Rover than repair the original and the Toyota needed extensive engine parts renewed.

If that proves to be the case with this car I will source a spares or repair car with a good engine and swap them over. The car is worth the effort and time. I do not need it to get to work tomorrow... I have others available...

Ten years ago, my son and his friends demonstrated that they can swap a K-Series engine in an afternoon using only DIYer tools and borrowing my Engine Crane. I did not believe it could be done so quickly outside a pro-workshop set-up but, it can and they proved me wrong. They even did it without disturbing the AirCon! Old Dog new tricks ...

I have swapped an engine alone working single handed several times.

I suspect that once you really get to know your subject, most types of cars are like that.

[AW111]

MGJohn said:

<snip>
I have swapped an engine alone working single handed several times.

I suspect that once you really get to know your subject, most types of cars are like that.

I agree. It's as much learning what you don't have to remove as what you do.

Once you have pulled the engine from a given car a few times, it usually gets easier, although I hope I never have to do the van.

I assume an MGF is like my MR2 : drop the drivetrain and lift the body (or the other way around), or does it come out upwards?

[chris watton]

AW111 said:

I agree. It's as much learning what you don't have to remove as what you do.

Once you have pulled the engine from a given car a few times, it usually gets easier, although I hope I never have to do the van.

I assume an MGF is like my MR2 : drop the drivetrain and lift the body (or the other way around), or does it come out upwards?

I think that most drop the rear sub frame with the engine and running gear still attached.

[s m]

AW111 said:

s m said:

Lack of differential? Do you mean propshaft?

Transverse engine/gearbox packages tend to have lower driveline losses. Turning the drive through 90 degrees (longitudinal drive to axle) costs a bit of power in friction.
It's not the differental as such, but the bevel drive.

I guessed he meant that but was interested to hear

[s m]

MGJohn said:

I've rebuilt several PG1s over the years. The Type A Torsen Differential fitted to the the early T-Series Turbocharged cars like the 220 Coupe I had years ago is prone to sheer it's bearing journal. It is not simply poor design weakness as some would have you believe. My investigations with several of these broken boxes indicate lack of sufficient or even any lubricant leading to bad wear in the big 6208 differential bearings. That allows oscillation under power and that vibration when giving the engine some welly fatigues the metal in the key journal area which sheers off:~



The above image clearly shows the broken off bearing journal still inside the bearing.



My 220 Turbo coupe ( Type A Differential ) came with a wodge of Invoices including one for £800 for a gearbox rebuild a few months before I got the car. Soon after, the gearbox started complaining loudly so I decided to remove it and have a look see. Placed a tray under the gearbox to collect the 2.2 litres of lubricant and removed the drain plug. What came out would not fill and egg cup! No bluddy wonder.

Every used car bought since I have always checked the volume and condition of the oil in the gearbox. Glad I did on two occasions! Insufficient lubricant.

The Type A diff is quite "aggressive" as well compared to the later type. When the gearbox needed doing on a friend's K- reg Tomcat Turbo , it was switched to the later type

[MGJohn]

s m said:

The Type A diff is quite "aggressive" as well compared to the later type. When the gearbox needed doing on a friend's K- reg Tomcat Turbo , it was switched to the later type

Yes, and some folks prefer it for track use. I prefer the Type B.

[MGJohn]

chris watton said:

AW111 said:

I agree. It's as much learning what you don't have to remove as what you do.

Once you have pulled the engine from a given car a few times, it usually gets easier, although I hope I never have to do the van.

I assume an MGF is like my MR2 : drop the drivetrain and lift the body (or the other way around), or does it come out upwards?

I think that most drop the rear sub frame with the engine and running gear still attached.

Yes Chris, that's the best way to do it. Over on MG-Rover.org, there are good "How To" threads and stickies for the job.

When my son fitted a VVC 1.8 to our 1.1c Rover Metro bought new in 1993, he got the whole MGF VVC sub-frame assembly complete with engine, gearbox, drive shaft and hub assemblies into his MG Metro. Easy fit sideways... amazing what you can get in that little hatchback. Mind you, for the two hundred mile return trip, the little car looked well "slammed". ...

Youngsters today eh ..

The Rover Metro with VVC power is a hoot to drive as can be imagined.

[mikal83]

I had a 71 MGBGT in my yoof and loved it, (til I wrote it off) and then just various run of the mill cars for 30 yrs til I bought a converted rubber bumber '76 MG roadster, 2 years ago, but a couple of friendly neighbours asked me why I wasnt wearing a flat cap.....mmmm. So I sold that and bought a Chim, which I kept for a summer and sold that. Now sportscarless and getting the sports car twitches again.
Its either something nasty and a bit expensive, a Tuscan or mid $$$ an XK8 or maybe a cheapie, yep the TF 160. But I still have that little man sitting on my shoulder saying, wheres yer flat cap matey!

[angelicupstarts]

bencollins said:

Nice car, about 8mpg better than Z3 or MX5 which has got to be important to folks who spend £1k on a car. Mainly due to the lack of differential, better engine and better aerodynamics esp drag and rear lift. Always liked stronger metallic colours on these, bright green/blue/red look fantastic. IMO the best styled accessible sportscar of the last 30 years. Like others have said, the HGF is hardly the end of the world and occurs on many types of car. One of the few convertibles that looks equally coherent with roof up or down. The coupe would have been nice, it always gets posted in these threads, so time to duly oblige the two people on PH who havent seen it..........



plus a nice random one from the inet:

wow ...i love the coupe !
never seen it before ......oh why didn't they make it ....
would be a dream in brg

[anonymous-user]

MGJohn said:

My shoulders are quite broad BC... Good "skimmed" advice BC. However I prefer to let others speak for themselves.

Yonex's numerous anti posts remind me of someone I know in the trade who having been bitten hard in his financial arse having cocked up work on Rovers due to incompetence, is forever embittered and will never have a good word to say about them. Far easier to blame the car.

Contrary to popular belief, I have found that it ain't Rocket Science.

Here you go again. Funny, I seemed to get most the build on my own K Series quite right, probably not up to your standards obviously but it was 'only' putting out 245 HP at the end, I rate the design but unlike you am honest enough to see its shortcomings, that's what sane people do. I also never had an issue with anything I raced nor getting jobs in the paddock let alone designing and installing 'things' for 25 years in a work capacity. Yes, I must be totally incompetent as you say. It's a shame there's not a 'foe' button which would cull your posts, never mind like any annoying little buzzy thing I'll just have to ignore it.

[anonymous-user]

B'stard Child said:

Well ^ that is your opinion

Here's mine - I enjoy MGJohn's posts - they can often be educational and they are always enthusiastic towards his chosen favorite brand but isn't that a given for any car enthusiast, I think perhaps you should relax a little and if posts by MGJohn are starting to wind you up to a point where you write stuff like that then perhaps it would be better if you skimmed over them. This is exactly what I will do with your posts because they aren't very nice.

Good, great, it doesn't matter very much! No axe to grind with anyone really. Perhaps you should change your username or in future revert to type

[MGJohn]

yonex said:

Here you go again. Funny, I seemed to get most the build on my own K Series quite right, probably not up to your standards obviously but it was 'only' putting out 245 HP at the end, I rate the design but unlike you am honest enough to see its shortcomings, that's what sane people do. I also never had an issue with anything I raced nor getting jobs in the paddock let alone designing and installing 'things' for 25 years in a work capacity. Yes, I must be totally incompetent as you say. It's a shame there's not a 'foe' button which would cull your posts, never mind like any annoying little buzzy thing I'll just have to ignore it.

There YOU go again. Bigging yourself up.

You are a dreamer...and not even very good at that. Incompetent dreamer riddled with inaccuracies.

I have never said YOU are incompetent, you said that! You are incompetent when trying to be truthful or accurate with your postings.

Obviously something I've posted in the past has hit a nerve with you BIG TIME. The truth hurts.

Get over it you incompetent and inaccurate PH poster.

[anonymous-user]

MGJohn said:

There YOU go again. Bigging yourself up.

You are a dreamer...and not even very good at that. Incompetent dreamer riddled with inaccuracies.

I have never said YOU are incompetent, you said that! You are incompetent when trying to be truthful or accurate with your postings.

Obviously something I've posted in the past has hit a nerve with you BIG TIME. The truth hurts.

Get over it you incompetent and inaccurate PH poster.

Lol, great! Have you been at the brandy and ginger again? You do what every sociopath does, suggest things, it's because they feel insecure. As I said I haven't really got an axe to grind with you, but I do find you a little tedious. I can't like everybody, that's life. Do you need anything more

Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 30th November 15:25

[B'stard Child]

yonex said:

B'stard Child said:

Well ^ that is your opinion

Here's mine - I enjoy MGJohn's posts - they can often be educational and they are always enthusiastic towards his chosen favorite brand but isn't that a given for any car enthusiast, I think perhaps you should relax a little and if posts by MGJohn are starting to wind you up to a point where you write stuff like that then perhaps it would be better if you skimmed over them. This is exactly what I will do with your posts because they aren't very nice.

Good, great, it doesn't matter very much! No axe to grind with anyone really. Perhaps you should change your username or in future revert to type

Good to hear

I quite like my user name and it relates to cars and motorcycles not my parentage.

[anonymous-user]

[B'stard Child]

yonex said:

excellent idea - it is a virtual pub here - no-one should get too serious - just talk crap about cars over a beer (or sherry for MGJohn )

I try not to say anything that I wouldn't say face to face (sometimes I fail but I try)

[anonymous-user]

B'stard Child said:

excellent idea - it is a virtual pub here - no-one should get too serious - just talk crap about cars over a beer (or sherry for MGJohn )

I try not to say anything that I wouldn't say face to face (sometimes I fail but I try)

I know what you mean. Sometimes you have to take stock, look at it and say 'what are you doing' I'm sure if most people in the site were sat in the pub the actual conversations would be unrecognisable from what is said online. For my part, I'm sorry. Absolutely ridiculous!!