The " war on the motorist"

[BGarside]

I'm also a cyclist who owns a car. Most of the time my taxed car sits in the garage while I cycle around town on my untaxed bike, creating less wear and tear on the roads than I would if driving my car. I don't see why / how that makes me a freeloader, especially since the income taxes I pay far outweigh any VED or other vehicle-related taxes and are also spent on the road network.

The fact is the public roads are for the use of the public, whether on a bike, in a car, on a horse, in a disabled buggy, etc, etc.

Why (oh why oh why) is there always this crap about 'you don't pay road tax so can't use the road'???

Why do the Brits in particular seem to loathe cyclists? Does not seem to be the case in other European countries.

Is it because we can actually get around town while car-bound muppets waste their lives in congestion of their own making and complain about 'the traffic'?

[Pan Pan]

BGarside said:

I'm also a cyclist who owns a car. Most of the time my taxed car sits in the garage while I cycle around town on my untaxed bike, creating less wear and tear on the roads than I would if driving my car. I don't see why / how that makes me a freeloader, especially since the income taxes I pay far outweigh any VED or other vehicle-related taxes and are also spent on the road network.

The fact is the public roads are for the use of the public, whether on a bike, in a car, on a horse, in a disabled buggy, etc, etc.

Why (oh why oh why) is there always this crap about 'you don't pay road tax so can't use the road'???

Why do the Brits in particular seem to loathe cyclists? Does not seem to be the case in other European countries.

Is it because we can actually get around town while car-bound muppets waste their lives in congestion of their own making and complain about 'the traffic'?

Bikes are fine for generally younger, relatively fit people who only have to cover short distances around town, without the need to carry large, or heavy items, and for those who don't need to be at another distant place at a particular time.
For just about everyone else (those who must carry / deliver large heavy objects to a distant destination. Those who must visit several distant points in the course of their every day work. Those who are disabled, or who are very elderly, but who who can get themselves around `if' they have a car, particularly one modified for them to use.) for just about everyone else bikes are not a viable transport option suited to the world we live in today (not the one people `think' we should be living in) just a mode of transport that suits a small minority of todays road users.

[WinstonWolf]

I cycled from Peterborough to Kings Cross a couple of months ago, I frequently commute eighteen miles on a bike and thanks to congestion it's quicker than driving. I'm fifty next birthday.

Sorry to burst your bubble

[FiF]

Setting aside the devil's advocate nature of my post on the figures in your haste to condemn other groups of road users ( drivers are murdering psychos vs cyclists are freeloading obey no laws) the point is still being missed.

If the road network and the use of it does not do any favours to any particular group, God knows cyclists get a raw deal in many ways, or the network isn't maintained or improved to solve clearly identifiable issues, it's not because road users specifically do not pay enough into the exchequer. They do, it's just that successive governments over decades and decades have chosen to spend the money on something else.

They get away with it because they are playing divide and rule with road users. Whether you are a user as a driver or passenger of any class of vehicle, a cyclist, pedestrian, horse rider or whoever, someone including yourself has paid handsomely for the transport infrastructure, especially roads, to be a bloody sight better than it is.

[xjay1337]

WinstonWolf said:

I cycled from Peterborough to Kings Cross a couple of months ago, I frequently commute eighteen miles on a bike and thanks to congestion it's quicker than driving. I'm fifty next birthday.

Sorry to burst your bubble

My Dad is 60 and he regularly cycles 30-40 miles on a Saturday, he goes on runs etc.
More active and fitter than me.

[Pan Pan]

WinstonWolf said:

I cycled from Peterborough to Kings Cross a couple of months ago, I frequently commute eighteen miles on a bike and thanks to congestion it's quicker than driving. I'm fifty next birthday.

Sorry to burst your bubble

So a bike happens to suit you, for a certain very limited type of journey, when you don't have to carry large heavy objects, or travel very long distances when doing so, on a daily basis. Your Point??

[WinstonWolf]

xjay1337 said:

WinstonWolf said:

I cycled from Peterborough to Kings Cross a couple of months ago, I frequently commute eighteen miles on a bike and thanks to congestion it's quicker than driving. I'm fifty next birthday.

Sorry to burst your bubble

My Dad is 60 and he regularly cycles 30-40 miles on a Saturday, he goes on runs etc.
More active and fitter than me.

You don't stop exercising because you get old, you get old because you stop exercising

[Horse Pop]

BGarside said:

Well, actually, I've studied, lived and worked in Cardiff, Manchester, Rotherham & Stocksbridge in S. Yorks, Gloucester, Pukekohe in New Zealand (a small rural town 12 miles from work), Loughborough (9 miles from work), Aberdeen and now Yeovil in Somerset, and I've always managed to cycle to work.

Using my car has always been the second back-up option, only if cycling and public transport fail.

Living in a large city is not a pre-requisite for being able to get around by bike.

What I said was having opinions about how I get from A to B.

Big ups on you using your bike.

I'm not as a) I don't want to and b) I don't want to (CBA rationalising it).

I only have an issue with you if you have an issue with that.

[WinstonWolf]

Pan Pan said:

WinstonWolf said:

I cycled from Peterborough to Kings Cross a couple of months ago, I frequently commute eighteen miles on a bike and thanks to congestion it's quicker than driving. I'm fifty next birthday.

Sorry to burst your bubble

So a bike happens to suit you, for a certain very limited type of journey, when you don't have to carry large heavy objects, or travel very long distances when doing so, on a daily basis. Your Point??

There are very few journeys where I *need* a car. By cycling I save time on my commute and I don't need to go the gym. Strange as it seems I have more free time if I use a *supposedly* slower form of travel.

Plus it frees up a parking space I've paid for by leaving my three taxed vehicles in the garage.

[otolith]

xjay1337 said:

My Dad is 60 and he regularly cycles 30-40 miles on a Saturday, he goes on runs etc.
More active and fitter than me.

There's an old bearded chap in the village who looks older than God and is usually seen pottering about on his bike.

[p1esk]

Mr Gear said:

corozin said:

Seriously what planet are you on? Do you really think that petrol at even the current £5 a gallon is cheap?

You should get your medication renewed.

It's a fking bargain! I can drive from London to Brighton and back for about a tenner. Compare that to what the train costs and then tell me it's expensive.

I have only just seen this thread, so I expect others will already have asked this: but what do the figures look like if you take account of all the costs of running a car, and not just fuel for one journey?

[p1esk]

Nigel Worc's said:

Compared to when I started, in 1977, petrol was 75p a gallon, and I earned £16 a week, it is much cheaper now.

Well young man when I got my first car, petrol was 4s 4d per gallon, (my first purchase was 13 shillings for 3 gallons), which equates to a bit less than 5p per litre if I've done the sums right. I was probably earning about £7 a week at the time.

Seasonal greetings to one and all,
Dave.

[p1esk]

WinstonWolf said:

I cycled from Peterborough to Kings Cross a couple of months ago, I frequently commute eighteen miles on a bike and thanks to congestion it's quicker than driving. I'm fifty next birthday.

Sorry to burst your bubble

I once cycled from Scarborough to York and back in the day(roughly 80 miles in total), that would be about 1956. Me bum didn't return to the right shape for several days afterwards!

Heh, I shall be 75 next birthday. 50 is relatively young, these days.

[irocfan]

BGarside said:

Why do the Brits in particular seem to loathe cyclists? Does not seem to be the case in other European countries.

could be a chicken and the egg situation TBH - do motorists 'hate' cyclists or do cyclists hate motorists with that feeling being reciprocated? As I posted earlier I don't recall seeing as many lycra clad tts pretending they're Sir Chris Hoy out there and so the whole feel is less confrontational (quite possibly there are also less Neanderthals trying to emulate Stig Blomqvist with a similar reduction in confrontation) . As has also been mentioned and something I also agree with - there does seem to be a lot of divide and conquer going on, probably to prevent us realising how royally screwed our transport system really is

[WinstonWolf]

p1esk said:

WinstonWolf said:

I cycled from Peterborough to Kings Cross a couple of months ago, I frequently commute eighteen miles on a bike and thanks to congestion it's quicker than driving. I'm fifty next birthday.

Sorry to burst your bubble

I once cycled from Scarborough to York and back in the day(roughly 80 miles in total), that would be about 1956. Me bum didn't return to the right shape for several days afterwards!

Heh, I shall be 75 next birthday. 50 is relatively young, these days.

And you've got some proper hills en route too

[okgo]

irocfan said:

could be a chicken and the egg situation TBH - do motorists 'hate' cyclists or do cyclists hate motorists with that feeling being reciprocated? As I posted earlier I don't recall seeing as many lycra clad tts pretending they're Sir Chris Hoy out there and so the whole feel is less confrontational (quite possibly there are also less Neanderthals trying to emulate Stig Blomqvist with a similar reduction in confrontation) . As has also been mentioned and something I also agree with - there does seem to be a lot of divide and conquer going on, probably to prevent us realising how royally screwed our transport system really is

There are more clubs and a bigger racing scene in France than here.

And those tts you reference could just be our next Olympic/tour winners you know, Bradley Wiggins can be seen training on his home roads on occasion. You're coming at it from a typical 'tt' angle, I don't call people playing Sunday league football in my local park a bunch of tts pretending to be Bayern Munich, they're playing football, in the attire suited to that, same goes for people cycling.

And whatever cyclists may think about car drivers (despite the fact many cyclists are obviously car owners too) there is only really one party that can do damage to other people (and the environment if you care about that sort of thing) and it's not the people pedalling around making themselves more healthy and probably being less of a drain on the country's health service in the long term as a result of it.

The irony of this forum is that quickly the cycling section is outgrowing nearly every other sub forum, it's not going anywhere and the only loser is Golf as more people start cycling as their hobby.

[mph1977]

irocfan said:

BGarside said:

Why do the Brits in particular seem to loathe cyclists? Does not seem to be the case in other European countries.

could be a chicken and the egg situation TBH - do motorists 'hate' cyclists or do cyclists hate motorists with that feeling being reciprocated? As I posted earlier I don't recall seeing as many lycra clad tts pretending they're Sir Chris Hoy out there and so the whole feel is less confrontational (quite possibly there are also less Neanderthals trying to emulate Stig Blomqvist with a similar reduction in confrontation) . As has also been mentioned and something I also agree with - there does seem to be a lot of divide and conquer going on, probably to prevent us realising how royally screwed our transport system really is

once again the pH bubble strikes

the powerfully built, 'net contributor', company directors , 'considerably mawer important than yow ' and their A4 tdi driving wannabe sycophants of 'business development managers' ( yes dear it;s called be a rep ) with their most get everywhere ahead of anyone else borderline sociopathic behaviour and sense of entitlement becasue they have decided they are a net contributor ...

[TankRizzo]

mph1977 said:

once again the pH bubble strikes

the powerfully built, 'net contributor', company directors , 'considerably mawer important than yow ' and their A4 tdi driving wannabe sycophants of 'business development managers' ( yes dear it;s called be a rep ) with their most get everywhere ahead of anyone else borderline sociopathic behaviour and sense of entitlement becasue they have decided they are a net contributor ...

[irocfan]

mph1977 said:

irocfan said:

BGarside said:

Why do the Brits in particular seem to loathe cyclists? Does not seem to be the case in other European countries.

could be a chicken and the egg situation TBH - do motorists 'hate' cyclists or do cyclists hate motorists with that feeling being reciprocated? As I posted earlier I don't recall seeing as many lycra clad tts pretending they're Sir Chris Hoy out there and so the whole feel is less confrontational (quite possibly there are also less Neanderthals trying to emulate Stig Blomqvist with a similar reduction in confrontation) . As has also been mentioned and something I also agree with - there does seem to be a lot of divide and conquer going on, probably to prevent us realising how royally screwed our transport system really is

once again the pH bubble strikes

the powerfully built, 'net contributor', company directors , 'considerably mawer important than yow ' and their A4 tdi driving wannabe sycophants of 'business development managers' ( yes dear it;s called be a rep ) with their most get everywhere ahead of anyone else borderline sociopathic behaviour and sense of entitlement becasue they have decided they are a net contributor ...

seriously?? I fail to see where my question about differences betwixt here and the mainland referenced powerfully built yada yada and the inference that car-drivers are boarder-line psychos. It's precisely your type of post (from both 'sides' of the debate) that engenders and then maintains bad feeling between various groups of road users

[mph1977]

irocfan said:

mph1977 said:

irocfan said:

BGarside said:

Why do the Brits in particular seem to loathe cyclists? Does not seem to be the case in other European countries.

could be a chicken and the egg situation TBH - do motorists 'hate' cyclists or do cyclists hate motorists with that feeling being reciprocated? As I posted earlier I don't recall seeing as many lycra clad tts pretending they're Sir Chris Hoy out there and so the whole feel is less confrontational (quite possibly there are also less Neanderthals trying to emulate Stig Blomqvist with a similar reduction in confrontation) . As has also been mentioned and something I also agree with - there does seem to be a lot of divide and conquer going on, probably to prevent us realising how royally screwed our transport system really is

once again the pH bubble strikes

the powerfully built, 'net contributor', company directors , 'considerably mawer important than yow ' and their A4 tdi driving wannabe sycophants of 'business development managers' ( yes dear it;s called be a rep ) with their most get everywhere ahead of anyone else borderline sociopathic behaviour and sense of entitlement becasue they have decided they are a net contributor ...

seriously?? I fail to see where my question about differences betwixt here and the mainland referenced powerfully built yada yada and the inference that car-drivers are boarder-line psychos. It's precisely your type of post (from both 'sides' of the debate) that engenders and then maintains bad feeling between various groups of road users

the vocal minority of 'powerfully built company directors' on pH do not represent the views of the vast majority of people , yet like Farage they portray themselves as the voice of common man when in fact they are more deluded than the lib-lab-con elite precisely becasue they THINK they are the common man in the street / on the clapham omnibus