Brake Pad MOT Question

[littleredfiesta]

Hi,

I'm a fairly new driver and I took my car for the its first MOT since I bought it (second hand, it's a 2006 reg) six weeks ago. Today, the brake pads completely failed. I tried to brake at a junction and all I got was a crunching noise and I couldn't stop. Luckily I was going fairly slow at this point and the road ahead was clear, so I was able to pull over and call out my breakdown provider.

I wanted to ask whether the state of the brake pads should have been picked up on during the MOT? I only drive once or twice a week for short journeys, so they must have been in fairly bad condition prior to the MOT. My car actually failed on the hand brake, which I paid for the provider to fix - I don't know if that's relevant or not. The breakdown repairman advised me to complain but I wasn't sure if I have a leg to stand on as technically the MOT is only valid for that day.

[itcaptainslow]

"Absolutely failed"-in what manner? Did the remaining material detach & fall off the backing plate of the pad or did the pads just wear down to the metal backing?

Apart from on a rolling road to test efficiency brakes are only visually inspected (and the wheels not removed to do this)-a pad must have a minimum of 1.5mm to pass a test if I remember correctly.

If the material detached, the testing station could not have been reasonably expected to pick this up. If the pads were worn, they should have failed (if visible) if the material was below 1.5mm. An advisory could be issued if the tester felt the pads were low but not enough to fail, however this isn't mandatory.

[Disco_Biscuit]

You could complain but probably won't get anywhere, as stated at time of test the brake efficiency was ok, Maybe the tester couldn't see the pads properly to advise?

Vosa states 28 days for mechanical faults from day of test, so I doubt anything would come of it.

Good old brake down man.

Replace the pads, get on with your life

[littleredfiesta]

itcaptainslow said:

"Absolutely failed"-in what manner? Did the remaining material detach & fall off the backing plate of the pad or did the pads just wear down to the metal backing?

Sorry, I meant failed as in I wasn't able to brake - the pedal just went straight to the floor. I think pads have worn down to the metal backing - judging by the scraping sound at least. I didn't find any fallen material down the road.

Thanks for the reply. I'll take the car to a garage to check what's happened before I complain to the MOT station.

[Justin S]

Personally, if I was not that mechanically minded and bought a second hand car, I would have got a garage to go through the basics to check it over. Brakes don't often fail dramatically. They are designed to have twin or more circuits on modern cars, to prevent this. The brakes may not be that visible to the tester. Has it got wheel trims etc, which can make it awkward to see. An MOT is only valid at the point of testing.

[TooMany2cvs]

littleredfiesta said:

Sorry, I meant failed as in I wasn't able to brake - the pedal just went straight to the floor.

Sounds like the pads have broken up, then. If not, then it's a hydraulic problem, not friction material.

MOT _only_ tests the actual braking efficiency. You've said that was fine right up until it wasn't... so there was nothing for them to fail. They're not allowed to remove the wheels, so if the pads weren't visible with the wheels on, then there's absolutely nothing they could have done.

If you only bought it six weeks ago, then you might have some comeback against the vendor, if it was trade - but if it was a private sale, no hope. Caveat emptor. Even if it was trade, then the fact you needed to MOT it so quickly sets a certain expectation. At the end of the day, brake pads are a consumable.

Handbrake is back brakes, sounds like the front pads have failed.

[SmithyAG]

I didn't think thickness was even considered as part of the MOT anymore, just the efficiency test on the rollers. I'm sure it was part of the MOT changes to make the procedure easier for testers. I'll try and dig out a link.

If it passes the test on the rollers, then it gets an MOT, even if there's next to nothing left on the pads.

[TooMany2cvs]

SmithyAG said:

I didn't think thickness was even considered as part of the MOT anymore, just the efficiency test on the rollers. I'm sure it was part of the MOT changes to make the procedure easier for testers. I'll try and dig out a link.

http://www.motinfo.gov.uk/htdocs/m4s03000501.htm
It's in there. 1.5mm, where visible with everything assembled - and that last bit's the key.

[Justin S]

I am in the garage when my local MOT guy tests my cars and can honestly say he has a tiny torch on a rod, which he uses to check pad thickness and disc wear. Just before he starts levering balljoints and cv boot wear, so they are definitely part of the test.

[Mave]

The question here shouldn't be about mot, it should be about service history. When did this car last have a decent service?

[steveo3002]

Mave said:

The question here shouldn't be about mot, it should be about service history. When did this car last have a decent service?

note he says "decent" , alot of services wont take the wheels off to check stuff

if it passed the test for the braking effort then theres not much else they would do if the pads cannot be seen with the wheels on

[PositronicRay]

Mave said:

The question here shouldn't be about mot, it should be about service history. When did this car last have a decent service?

A service means nothing unless advised maintenance carried out.

[Claudia Skies]

MOT isn't a warranty; it's a statement that the car was working when it was tested.

On many cars the inner pads are completely invisible in any event. Don't blame the tester, ask yourself when the car last got a proper service.

[littleredfiesta]

Sorry, I didn't word my original message clearly. I've had the car for around 11 months and it was fully serviced and MOT'd not long before I bought it. I took it for an MOT six weeks ago.

I just wanted to check if the pads issue should have been identified / given an advisory. I was advised to complain to the MOT provider but I didn't want to waste my time and create a fuss if it's just one of those things that happens and not an error on the garage's part. Thanks for the replies!

[Claudia Skies]

Seriously, if the brakes are in good working order when the car is tested, that's a pass.

[Mave]

PositronicRay said:

A service means nothing unless advised maintenance carried out.

A service where the advised maintenance isn't carried out isn't a decent service, is it?

[Nedzilla]

You usually get a bit of warning when the pads are down to the metal. Usually you will hear them grinding for some time before they completely give up. If they just 'went' completely in the blink of an eye and the pedal went straight to the floor it sounds to me like it could be something else.

[spikeyhead]

Nedzilla said:

You usually get a bit of warning when the pads are down to the metal. Usually you will hear them grinding for some time before they completely give up. If they just 'went' completely in the blink of an eye and the pedal went straight to the floor it sounds to me like it could be something else.

^^^ Wot e sed ^^^

though it does seem strange that the graunching noise and pedal to the floor happened at the same time.

[Transiter]

littleredfiesta said:

Sorry, I didn't word my original message clearly. I've had the car for around 11 months and it was fully serviced and MOT'd not long before I bought it. I took it for an MOT six weeks ago.

I just wanted to check if the pads issue should have been identified / given an advisory. I was advised to complain to the MOT provider but I didn't want to waste my time and create a fuss if it's just one of those things that happens and not an error on the garage's part. Thanks for the replies!

You can kick up a fuss if you wish, probably won't get you anywhere. If the car is roadworthy on the time of the test, it passes.

As said, if it was the pads material wearing down to the metal you would have heard some warning, by means of noise coming from the brakes or a light on the dash. If the material broke off the pad metal what you say may be possible.

As for the service before you bought the car- what was carried out? A service could just be/probably was just an oil and filter change.

[Andyjc86]

Does your car have alloys or steelies? With steel wheels it's particularly hard to see the pad condition with the wheels still on.