Supermarket fuel inferior quality says Telegraph. Really?
Discussion
KTF said:
Is your maths based on doing a repeated test in the same repeatable conditions after the tank has been completely drained cleaned and refilled between tests?
No mate, I live in the real world, things get done on as repeatable a basis as possible so I know whether to bother or not, but I'm not a scientist, and I doubt many others posting on this thread are either! You can only go by your own experiences, that's what the majority of people are posting, I'm no different.KTF said:
Heaveho said:
If you tried it and did the maths, you may find that the fact that some vehicles are significantly poorer on fuel when using cheap supermarket fuel shows your point of view to be wrong.
Is your maths based on doing a repeated test in the same repeatable conditions after the tank has been completely drained cleaned and refilled between tests?Err
Indeed, which is why people frequently believe things that aren't true. Personal experiences are not a good form of evidence for anything.
Heaveho said:
KTF said:
Is your maths based on doing a repeated test in the same repeatable conditions after the tank has been completely drained cleaned and refilled between tests?
No mate, I live in the real world, things get done on as repeatable a basis as possible so I know whether to bother or not, but I'm not a scientist, and I doubt many others posting on this thread are either! You Can't only go by your own experiences, that's what the majority of people are posting, I'm no different.Edited by Devil2575 on Monday 22 December 12:19
dcb said:
My BMW says it has to run on 91 Oktane or richer. Given that the
weakest petrol available in the UK is 95 Oktane, I think I am
on safe territory.
AFAIK, the only country in Europe that sells 91 Oktane is Austria.
I don't think they sell much of it ;->
Is that referring to MON, RON or PON?weakest petrol available in the UK is 95 Oktane, I think I am
on safe territory.
AFAIK, the only country in Europe that sells 91 Oktane is Austria.
I don't think they sell much of it ;->
Devil2575 said:
Heaveho said:
KTF said:
Is your maths based on doing a repeated test in the same repeatable conditions after the tank has been completely drained cleaned and refilled between tests?
No mate, I live in the real world, things get done on as repeatable a basis as possible so I know whether to bother or not, but I'm not a scientist, and I doubt many others posting on this thread are either! You Can't only go by your own experiences, that's what the majority of people are posting, I'm no different.If premium petrol such as Shell Nitro has additional cleaning additives.
If you use it in an older engine with a lot of deposits, is it not likely to cause some running issues during the cleaning process?
I personally only buy Shell Nitro, but that's becuase I like collecting the Lego cars.
If you use it in an older engine with a lot of deposits, is it not likely to cause some running issues during the cleaning process?
I personally only buy Shell Nitro, but that's becuase I like collecting the Lego cars.
If premium petrol such as Shell Nitro has additional cleaning additives.
If you use it in an older engine with a lot of deposits, is it not likely to cause some running issues during the cleaning process?
I personally only buy Shell Nitro, but that's becuase I like collecting the Lego cars.
If you use it in an older engine with a lot of deposits, is it not likely to cause some running issues during the cleaning process?
I personally only buy Shell Nitro, but that's becuase I like collecting the Lego cars.
billzeebub said:
I never buy fuel from supermarkets, only Shell V power goes in my car, or failing that will fill up on BP Super or Esso Premium. Only if I'm about to run dry would I fuel anywhere else, then I would only put in the bare minimum
But how do you know what your car, assuming you didn't buy it new, was run on before you purchased it? If it was run only on premium fuel then there *might* be a case for continuing with premium fuel. But, if it has been run on supermarket fuel, then I doubt there is any point.I am less concerned about the additives in the fuel, after all, they are all going to be better than the grades we had 10-20 years ago, and more bothered by the freshness of the fuel. Petrol deteriorates with age, therefore freshest is best, and supermarkets with the cheap prices and high through flow is going to be fresh.
That said, I mostly use the BP station just outside the village.
A bunch more unrelated thoughts:
- many ordinary cars' ECUs can't advance timing to take advantage of > 95 RON
- your model of car with your model of engine is probably used in the same configuration all across Europe and the world, where 95 RON would be a luxury, and yet they all keep going
- most direct injection engines don't benefit very much from the cleaning properties of fuel as there's no washing effect in the intake
- I gather it can take several tanks worth of fuel for the ECU to fully adapt, so a lot of anecdotal tests are probably useless
- many ordinary cars' ECUs can't advance timing to take advantage of > 95 RON
- your model of car with your model of engine is probably used in the same configuration all across Europe and the world, where 95 RON would be a luxury, and yet they all keep going
- most direct injection engines don't benefit very much from the cleaning properties of fuel as there's no washing effect in the intake
- I gather it can take several tanks worth of fuel for the ECU to fully adapt, so a lot of anecdotal tests are probably useless
kambites said:
I certainly can't tell any difference between different 95RON fuels in my car.
On 95 RON I can't either - on my summer toy it runs rubbish on all of them (branded or supermarket)On 95 RON in 6th gear it won't pull below 80 mph, in fact it struggles to maintain that speed without a lot of throttle down on even slight inclines (frequently you have to drop it into 5th) and both factors really knocks the economy with 4-5 mpg less being typical
Please bear in mind my summer toy is doing 1500 rpm at 80 mph
On "Super" fuels of V-Power is prefered
It will pull 6th from 60 mph (1100 rpm) and will do so with just a smidge more throttle on long M-way inclines performance is restored to expected levels
My Fuels of choice in preferred order are
V-Power
Momentum (Yes I was surprised but I've not used it much)
BP Ultimate (definately worse than V-Power)
Any other Super Unleaded (Supermarket inc)
However the difference between V Power and any of the others "supers" is still there so it remains my preferred fuel
Comparing the costs per mile of V-Power v 95 ROM
you can see why for me and my summer car the cost difference of the fuel is more than covered by the mpg saving
| Fuel | 95 RON | V-Power |
| Current £ | £1.15 | £1.23 |
| Gal Cost | 5.223354 | 5.587034 |
| Avg Mpg | 22 | 26 |
| Cost per mile | £0.24 | £0.21 |
I never use supermarket fuel, just normal Shell/BP etc 95RON.
Last couple of times I used supermarket fuel my MPG dropped considerably. I don't normally care about such things so for me to notice then it was significant. Refilled with Shell or whatever and it was back up to the usual MPG.
Just my experiences, has happened a few times so not just a one off.
Last couple of times I used supermarket fuel my MPG dropped considerably. I don't normally care about such things so for me to notice then it was significant. Refilled with Shell or whatever and it was back up to the usual MPG.
Just my experiences, has happened a few times so not just a one off.
madbadger said:
We put some supermarket and branded fuel through our mass spectrometer to have a look.
100.0% the same.
Apologies for my lack of understanding, but what exactly does a mass spectrometer measure? Is it effectively just saying that the fuels are exactly the same Octane rating? Or is it saying that the additives are the same as well?100.0% the same.
Lots of people here are talking about the difference in additives, rather than the Octane rating. Of course the placebo effect is very important (and not negated by data showing an improvement, that's the who point of placebo, it can lead to a real change, not just a perceived one) but I'm also interested in what impact additives have (if any).
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