E46 M3 v 135i - how different?

[Mastodon2]

Patrick Bateman said:

daveco said:

I have experience only in the 335 but it might be of benefit to you.

I test drove numerous E46 M3s and numerous 335s...imo the 335 trumps it for real world performance and overall ownership enjoyment.

I had my heart set on an M3 for many years however the 335 felt noticeably quicker, turned sharper, and sounded better overall.

I still think the M3 looks better, has a far better top end both noise and performance wise, and feels more special inside...the beauty of the 335 is that even sat idling in traffic it puts a smile on your face.

Another downside to the M3 is the exorbitant cost of the BMW extended warranty compared to the 335.

Really?

Some people will say anything to justify not getting the car they really wanted.

[Patrick Bateman]

I could understand a TVR prompting that sort of comment, perhaps not a cooking 3 series.

[cerb4.5lee]

Patrick Bateman said:

I could understand a TVR prompting that sort of comment, perhaps not a cooking 3 series.

I thought similar because most modern cars do sound pretty quiet at idle but as you say a TVR does put a smile on the face even at idle, don't get me wrong I like the 3 series have owned three of them but to be fair you have to be driving very quickly before they start raising smiles.

[kiseca]

Mastodon2 said:

Patrick Bateman said:

daveco said:

I have experience only in the 335 but it might be of benefit to you.

I test drove numerous E46 M3s and numerous 335s...imo the 335 trumps it for real world performance and overall ownership enjoyment.

I had my heart set on an M3 for many years however the 335 felt noticeably quicker, turned sharper, and sounded better overall.

I still think the M3 looks better, has a far better top end both noise and performance wise, and feels more special inside...the beauty of the 335 is that even sat idling in traffic it puts a smile on your face.

Another downside to the M3 is the exorbitant cost of the BMW extended warranty compared to the 335.

Really?

Some people will say anything to justify not getting the car they really wanted.

That's a stupid statement. If you can afford a 335i you can afford an E46 M3. Besides, I do know a chap who has owned both and he'd say exactly the same thing that others with experience have been saying all over this thread. The E46 feels ordinary if you're not on a track or rare piece of wide, curvy, well sighted empty road. The driving position in the 335 feels more special, much more laid back and a part of the car. It certainly feels more special to sit in when not going anywhere. And it had a much meatier sound than the tinny M3, which will appeal to some and not to others.

As for how it compares to the 135i, well I'd listen to the poster above who has owned both.

Not every M has been God's gift to motoring. The E46 wasn't too bad but it really isn't a particularly exciting car to drive considering its performance.

[Patrick Bateman]

Wasn't too bad

I haven't driven one but given how they're widely regarded, that does seem to be a bit of an understatement.

[cerb4.5lee]

kiseca said:

The driving position in the 335 feels more special, much more laid back and a part of the car. It certainly feels more special to sit in when not going anywhere. And it had a much meatier sound than the tinny M3, which will appeal to some and not to others.

I really like the driving position of the E9x 3 series as well, you touch on a good point regards the tinny nature of the S54 engine and that wasn't something I liked either in my Z4M yet plenty of others think its a great sounding engine.

We are all different and like different things which can only be a good thing I think.

[clonmult]

kiseca said:

Mastodon2 said:

Patrick Bateman said:

daveco said:

I have experience only in the 335 but it might be of benefit to you.

I test drove numerous E46 M3s and numerous 335s...imo the 335 trumps it for real world performance and overall ownership enjoyment.

I had my heart set on an M3 for many years however the 335 felt noticeably quicker, turned sharper, and sounded better overall.

I still think the M3 looks better, has a far better top end both noise and performance wise, and feels more special inside...the beauty of the 335 is that even sat idling in traffic it puts a smile on your face.

Another downside to the M3 is the exorbitant cost of the BMW extended warranty compared to the 335.

Really?

Some people will say anything to justify not getting the car they really wanted.

That's a stupid statement. If you can afford a 335i you can afford an E46 M3. Besides, I do know a chap who has owned both and he'd say exactly the same thing that others with experience have been saying all over this thread. The E46 feels ordinary if you're not on a track or rare piece of wide, curvy, well sighted empty road. The driving position in the 335 feels more special, much more laid back and a part of the car. It certainly feels more special to sit in when not going anywhere. And it had a much meatier sound than the tinny M3, which will appeal to some and not to others.

As for how it compares to the 135i, well I'd listen to the poster above who has owned both.

Not every M has been God's gift to motoring. The E46 wasn't too bad but it really isn't a particularly exciting car to drive considering its performance.

Each generation of 3 series improves refinement, performance .... but as the expensive of that elusive "feel". Having driven around or owned the E30, E36, E46 and E92, I can't decide if I'd prefer to live with the E36 or E46. The E30 was fun, but too raw. The E92 was way too disconnected from the road for my liking.

It isn't a black & white, one is definitely "better" than the other. A lot of this is down to personal preference.

I wouldn't listen to anyone on here (unless the intent is to check on reliability, running costs, etc.), best option is to head out for a test drive.

[cerb4.5lee]

clonmult said:

I wouldn't listen to anyone on here

I agree they even rate the MX5 on here and it doesn't get much more crazy than that!

[lord trumpton]

Ive had both - at least 6 e46 M3 over the years and only one 135i

The best way I can describe it is the difference in sex with and without wearing a rubber.

The 135i while fast, is dull, too smooth and just feels like a fast BMW. The M3 has soul, attitude, quirks, presence, provenance and hard earned power supplied by what is still, to this day the best NA engine ever made (imho)

Oh the M3 is far more reliable too!

[aeropilot]

pilchardthecat said:

You'll be bored of it in a week.

Just because you were, doesn't mean everyone else will be

There are at least 3 ex-E46 M3 owners that have chopped them in for a E82 135i that post (have posted on BabyBMW forum, and neither of them were bored with the 135 within a week.


Stock suspension on the 135i is pants, but that is easily remedied, and the 135i lacks a LSD, which again can be remedied.

Running costs of the 135i will be about half that of the M3

[mcelliott]

lord trumpton said:

Ive had both - at least 6 e46 M3 over the years and only one 135i

The best way I can describe it is the difference in sex with and without wearing a rubber.

The 135i while fast, is dull, too smooth and just feels like a fast BMW. The M3 has soul, attitude, quirks, presence, provenance and hard earned power supplied by what is still, to this day the best NA engine ever made (imho)

Oh the M3 is far more reliable too!

Totally agree with everything you've said about the M3 however, I will concede that the 335 does sound better idling in traffic, but who the fk wants to be stuck in traffic! Oh, and that engine in the M3 - sublime.

[lord trumpton]

aeropilot said:

pilchardthecat said:

You'll be bored of it in a week.

Just because you were, doesn't mean everyone else will be

There are at least 3 ex-E46 M3 owners that have chopped them in for a E82 135i that post (have posted on BabyBMW forum, and neither of them were bored with the 135 within a week.


Stock suspension on the 135i is pants, but that is easily remedied, and the 135i lacks a LSD, which again can be remedied.

Running costs of the 135i will be about half that of the M3

bks. They are about the same on fuel the same on RFL and suffer HPFP, Wastegate chatter and ultimately failure, Turbo issues and look just like a 118d.

[rm163603]

lord trumpton said:

Ive had both - at least 6 e46 M3 over the years and only one 135i

The best way I can describe it is the difference in sex with and without wearing a rubber.

The 135i while fast, is dull, too smooth and just feels like a fast BMW. The M3 has soul, attitude, quirks, presence, provenance and hard earned power supplied by what is still, to this day the best NA engine ever made (imho)

Oh the M3 is far more reliable too!

Totally agree. I've owned both and the e46 M3 is better in almost all respects.

My m135i has the auto which is probably the best bit about it. The M3 box can be a bit clunky when cold... apart from that its sublime.

The M3 has a more soulful and exciting engine by far. The handling has better control and feedback. The steering is far nicer on the M3.

The interior is also better built with nicer materials.

Plus the M3 looks good. The M135i is gopping ugly.

It's reliability / bork potential which goes against the M3..

Mine needed a new bootfloor and it was an 03 car with 70k...

Don't buy one unless the floor has been fixed or recently inspected... A cursory glance underneath isnt enough....

[aeropilot]

lord trumpton said:

bks. They are about the same on fuel the same on RFL and suffer HPFP, Wastegate chatter and ultimately failure, Turbo issues and look just like a 118d.

Not if you buy the N55 version


And I like the fact that it flies under the radar looks-wise.....especially when de-badged. I don't want it attracting unwanted attention.

[Timbola]

rm163603 said:

Totally agree. I've owned both and the e46 M3 is better in almost all respects.

My m135i

The comparison is with the 135i, not the M135i

For the second time.

[Pommygranite]

How bad/good is the SMG box in an M3 if an auto was needed?

[cerb4.5lee]

Pommygranite said:

How bad/good is the SMG box in an M3 if an auto was needed?

People with the manual will say the SMG is pants and people with SMG say the manual is pants that's usually the way it goes. I think if you don't mind an auto then I would have thought the SMG will be fine, I have read that if the SMG goes wrong it can be a little costly though.

[SG167]

I havent driven an M3 - but drove a 135i and thought it was dull as hell. Felt nice, but power delivery made it seem slow.

I havent heard anyone describe an M3 as dull, performance wise on paper they seem the same. I would imagine if you fancy having the occasional blast the M3 will be a load more fun, but the 135i would be a better everyday motor.

[rm163603]

Timbola said:

rm163603 said:

Totally agree. I've owned both and the e46 M3 is better in almost all respects.

My m135i

The comparison is with the 135i, not the M135i

For the second time.

Sorry! Must try harder.

[lilwashu]

If anyone has driven a modern-ish mid-range performance car that is not an E46 M3, then goes and drives an E46 M3, I suspect they will be disappointed all round given the near-holy status it seems to have somehow held. The interior has dated as you would expect and it feels slow compared to anything with a turbo.

They are obviously very different to a 135i - i would still have an E46 M3 over one of those.