Ford S-Max, diesel vs. petrol - talk to me
Discussion
Any S-Max owners on here? Looking for general advice on them from 2007-2009ish in Zetec or Titanium spec. I'm put off the diesel DPF/DMF/Fuel pump/Injector issues that plague modern engines, and I've heard word on the street is the 2.0 TDCi is pretty unreliable. Anyone have any pearls of wisdom to prove the rumours wrong on these or the 1.8TDCi?
I'm also assuming the diesel bubble is about to burst in general (environmental pressure), so I'm leaning more towards petrols as this'll be a keeper for a good few years, and likely the 2.0 Duratec lump. Only issue is I keep reading lots of buyers guides saying it's awful, gutless, souless etc. The 2.5T is the one that jumps out at me, obviously, but I know it'll be thirsty (reckon the book figures of 30mpg average are optimistic!) The 2.0 is rated at 35mpg, but being that it'll no doubt be gutless, will it end up getting closer and closer to the 2.5 Volvo lump once you take into account mashing your foot down to keep it going. There's only £20 a year in tax difference between them, and the 2.5T is no more to purchase, even though you're getting more for your money.
The petrols also tend to be lower mileage for the money, too.
Plenty of buyers guides out there, but no real-world opinions that I can find, other than the people who leave reviews for Tripadvisor, and I don't really trust them to be level-headed! I'm treading carefully about it all because we have a ratty old Xsara Picasso HDi which just keeps on going and going, doing 45mpg all the way. It's getting long in the tooth now though, and the S-Max won't be soul-destroying to drive, so I feel it's time for a change. My only concern is how s
te would I feel going from a ratty old car worth 3 pence which, aside from the odd small niggle, just gets on with the job, or a newer car I've spunked a few thousand on which throws its toys fairly often? I've read plenty of mixed reliability reviews on the S-Max.
Any thoughts?
I'm also assuming the diesel bubble is about to burst in general (environmental pressure), so I'm leaning more towards petrols as this'll be a keeper for a good few years, and likely the 2.0 Duratec lump. Only issue is I keep reading lots of buyers guides saying it's awful, gutless, souless etc. The 2.5T is the one that jumps out at me, obviously, but I know it'll be thirsty (reckon the book figures of 30mpg average are optimistic!) The 2.0 is rated at 35mpg, but being that it'll no doubt be gutless, will it end up getting closer and closer to the 2.5 Volvo lump once you take into account mashing your foot down to keep it going. There's only £20 a year in tax difference between them, and the 2.5T is no more to purchase, even though you're getting more for your money.
The petrols also tend to be lower mileage for the money, too.
Plenty of buyers guides out there, but no real-world opinions that I can find, other than the people who leave reviews for Tripadvisor, and I don't really trust them to be level-headed! I'm treading carefully about it all because we have a ratty old Xsara Picasso HDi which just keeps on going and going, doing 45mpg all the way. It's getting long in the tooth now though, and the S-Max won't be soul-destroying to drive, so I feel it's time for a change. My only concern is how s
te would I feel going from a ratty old car worth 3 pence which, aside from the odd small niggle, just gets on with the job, or a newer car I've spunked a few thousand on which throws its toys fairly often? I've read plenty of mixed reliability reviews on the S-Max.Any thoughts?
We've got the 2.0 diesel lump in our 09 smax. It's genuiely a superb engine! It's got bags of torque and teamed with the gearbox, makes it quite fun to drive (for what is essentially a van!). With regards to reliability, my mechanic friend advised me to go for the 2.0 over the 1.8. Apparently the 2.0 is a Peugeot diesel and pretty reliable in his experience. The 1.8 on the other hand is gutless and underpowered for the size of the car. Personally I'm pleased we went for the 2.0 (titanium spec).
Cheers guys.
The 2.5T is the obvious one I want (we do around 6000miles a year) but it's still quite a kick in the nuts going from a 2.0HDI doing 45mpg to a 2.5 petrol doing 20mpg! Especially as I won't be driving it as much as the wife.
Can find very little on the 2.0 petrol though. If people were queuing to tell me they did 35-40mpg, I'd be delighted. My worry is in the real world, they won't be much better than the 2.5T, and that brings a whole lot more for the money.
Diesel-wise, I know the 1.8TDCi is a bit of a lemon in terms of performance, refinement etc, but I'd heard it was actually more reliable than the PSA lump. I've had a few friends with versions of the 2.0 and 2.2HDI/TDCi engines, and they've had trouble.
My heart says 2.5T all day long, but we had a Mondeo ST200 a few years back and the main reason we sold it was because of the fuel economy!
The 2.5T is the obvious one I want (we do around 6000miles a year) but it's still quite a kick in the nuts going from a 2.0HDI doing 45mpg to a 2.5 petrol doing 20mpg! Especially as I won't be driving it as much as the wife.
Can find very little on the 2.0 petrol though. If people were queuing to tell me they did 35-40mpg, I'd be delighted. My worry is in the real world, they won't be much better than the 2.5T, and that brings a whole lot more for the money.
Diesel-wise, I know the 1.8TDCi is a bit of a lemon in terms of performance, refinement etc, but I'd heard it was actually more reliable than the PSA lump. I've had a few friends with versions of the 2.0 and 2.2HDI/TDCi engines, and they've had trouble.
My heart says 2.5T all day long, but we had a Mondeo ST200 a few years back and the main reason we sold it was because of the fuel economy!
I test drove both (albeit in 2013), TDCI 168 against the Ecoboost petrol. The petrol was obviously smoother, and the difference in torque not anywhere as much as I had expected. I ended up with the TDCI, purely for MPG purposes. The reports I read suggested both engines real world MPG is way off quoted figures but the differences was greater with the petrol. 20k miles so far and no problems yet, my journeys are either very short or very long, so hopefully the long ones will keep the DPF problems at bay...lets see 
Mine does 30-32 MPG, never anything above 40 even on a long steady run.
If I had the choice again I would opt for the auto, given the size of the thing it lends itself in my opinion to a auto box for smooth progress.
Mine does 30-32 MPG, never anything above 40 even on a long steady run.
If I had the choice again I would opt for the auto, given the size of the thing it lends itself in my opinion to a auto box for smooth progress.
2.0TDCi in the S-Max mix driving 40mpg (tops) 6,000 miles is £762 a year (112p ltr)
2.5 5cyl Turbo in S-Max mix driving 26 mpg (easily) 6,000 miles is £1089 a year (104p ltr)
So a differance of £327 to drive the petrol, which honestly for how good the engine is, is nothing!
Just be aware the liners do have a habit of going on the 2.5, but there are ways to easily prevent this.
2.5 5cyl Turbo in S-Max mix driving 26 mpg (easily) 6,000 miles is £1089 a year (104p ltr)
So a differance of £327 to drive the petrol, which honestly for how good the engine is, is nothing!
Just be aware the liners do have a habit of going on the 2.5, but there are ways to easily prevent this.
Just traded in a 2.0 diesel TItanium 06 plate with 56k and it was a sad day. That car did not miss a beat in five years of ownership. It returned 38mpg around town and up to 52mpg on a run, did numerous family duties and was well looked after. We bought a diesel because of resale value and were over the moon with the deal into our new S-max 2.2 diesel Titanium Auto. Wow, even better.
BoostMonkey said:
2.0TDCi in the S-Max mix driving 40mpg (tops) 6,000 miles is £762 a year (112p ltr)
2.5 5cyl Turbo in S-Max mix driving 26 mpg (easily) 6,000 miles is £1089 a year (104p ltr)
So a differance of £327 to drive the petrol, which honestly for how good the engine is, is nothing!
Just be aware the liners do have a habit of going on the 2.5, but there are ways to easily prevent this.
When you put it like that.......2.5 5cyl Turbo in S-Max mix driving 26 mpg (easily) 6,000 miles is £1089 a year (104p ltr)
So a differance of £327 to drive the petrol, which honestly for how good the engine is, is nothing!
Just be aware the liners do have a habit of going on the 2.5, but there are ways to easily prevent this.
£327 will be saved when the day comes that I don't have to change the DMF
Makes the difference between the 2.0 and the 2.5 look even smaller, too. Not heard of the liner issue though, could you elaborate?
RVVUNM said:
Just traded in a 2.0 diesel TItanium 06 plate with 56k and it was a sad day. That car did not miss a beat in five years of ownership. It returned 38mpg around town and up to 52mpg on a run, did numerous family duties and was well looked after. We bought a diesel because of resale value and were over the moon with the deal into our new S-max 2.2 diesel Titanium Auto. Wow, even better.
What sort of MPG is the auto giving so far?
The missus has just ordered her 3rd 2.0ltr diesel Smax. She has them as company cars, doing around 40k a year and has had no problems at all. We've been all over Europe in them twice and they're not short on power or driving enjoyment plus they're very, very practical.
I should add that the current one plus the ordered ones are autos. She wouldn't go back to manual and I dont think mpg is much different nowadays.
She's also a very fast driver
I should add that the current one plus the ordered ones are autos. She wouldn't go back to manual and I dont think mpg is much different nowadays.
She's also a very fast driver
Edited by stuartmmcfc on Friday 9th January 16:30
I looked for a petrol S-Max a few months back and gave up.
Of the 1500 for sale on Autotrader at the moment 1400 are Diesels. Out of the remaing 100 only 3 are the 2.5T variant. Once you remove the high milers, zero history cars and other ones that don't fit you may well be left with nothing to look at and even if you are that are not necessarily going to be within a short drive. I waited for about 3 months till I gave up after not finding a single car for sale within 200 miles that fitted my requirements i.e. Under 8k, Petrol, manual box, less than 100k with a FSH.
Oh and driving 200 miles might not seem like a big deal till you do it a few times and waste a day and a tank of fuel on a car that wasn't half as good as the description.
If I was after something special for myself I'd be prepared to go to those lengths, but not a people carrier, which is very likely to have seen a hard life, certainly in terms of wear to interior trim!
Of the 1500 for sale on Autotrader at the moment 1400 are Diesels. Out of the remaing 100 only 3 are the 2.5T variant. Once you remove the high milers, zero history cars and other ones that don't fit you may well be left with nothing to look at and even if you are that are not necessarily going to be within a short drive. I waited for about 3 months till I gave up after not finding a single car for sale within 200 miles that fitted my requirements i.e. Under 8k, Petrol, manual box, less than 100k with a FSH.
Oh and driving 200 miles might not seem like a big deal till you do it a few times and waste a day and a tank of fuel on a car that wasn't half as good as the description.
If I was after something special for myself I'd be prepared to go to those lengths, but not a people carrier, which is very likely to have seen a hard life, certainly in terms of wear to interior trim!
We had a 1.8 diesel (boggo LX trim) for three years and 46,000 miles.
Must have been lucky as it was good - never let us down and came out at 15pence per mile (ignoring fuel but all other costs inc depreciation included).
Quiet at tickover - even compared to my ex-bosses 330d. Only complaint was sudden boost in 1st gear when pulling away - took some getting used to.
Only other fault was the alarm went mad but was covered by warranty.
Nice car to drive/be driven in, bags of space, well specced even in LX, cheap to run (49mpg average).
But, if you can afford a 2.5t with whistles and bells also check out a Mazda CX7. Only 5 seats, though, and 25mpg.
Must have been lucky as it was good - never let us down and came out at 15pence per mile (ignoring fuel but all other costs inc depreciation included).
Quiet at tickover - even compared to my ex-bosses 330d. Only complaint was sudden boost in 1st gear when pulling away - took some getting used to.
Only other fault was the alarm went mad but was covered by warranty.
Nice car to drive/be driven in, bags of space, well specced even in LX, cheap to run (49mpg average).
But, if you can afford a 2.5t with whistles and bells also check out a Mazda CX7. Only 5 seats, though, and 25mpg.
Our 2.0 diesel smax returns 45mpg with mixed driving, and over 50 on a run. I also looked at petrol ones, as it's the missus' car but they were all either knackered or crap condition. I'm well happy with ours and heartily recommend them!
Honest john reckons there'sittle difference between the 2 and 2.5 petrols in MPg terms, or between the 2.0 and 1.8 diesels either http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/ford/s-max-200...
Honest john reckons there'sittle difference between the 2 and 2.5 petrols in MPg terms, or between the 2.0 and 1.8 diesels either http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/ford/s-max-200...
Our 2.0 diesel smax returns 45mpg with mixed driving, and over 50 on a run. I also looked at petrol ones, as it's the missus' car but they were all either knackered or crap condition. I'm well happy with ours and heartily recommend them!
Honest john reckons there'sittle difference between the 2 and 2.5 petrols in MPg terms, or between the 2.0 and 1.8 diesels either http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/ford/s-max-200...
Honest john reckons there'sittle difference between the 2 and 2.5 petrols in MPg terms, or between the 2.0 and 1.8 diesels either http://www.honestjohn.co.uk/realmpg/ford/s-max-200...
I have the 2.0 Ecoboost with the 6 speed dual clutch "Powershift" auto and it suits the car really well. I was in a similar position to many here in that I wanted the petrol but of the 1,500 or so on Autotrader, at any point in time, there were between none and 2 of the right spec, mileage and cost. However, I was glad that I stuck it out as it really is a great engine / gearbox combo for the car. The Ecoboost petrol is very torquey and quite smooth and the box is very good. There is an occasional hesitation when pulling away from standstill which can make pulling out into fast moving traffic a bit of a laugh but you get used to driving round it.
I live in the city and figured that the diesel would never get up to temperature and not give particularly good MPG anyway so fancied the petrol. I hardly do any miles so poorer economy wasn't a big deal. In reality, fuel consumption is horrific - on a long journey driving briskly but sensibly I struggle to do 30mpg but a month of driving around town on the school and Waitrose run will see that getting closer to 20. On the summer road trip to Central France and back, 2000 miles absolutely loaded to the roof and with a roof box, I got 26 according to the computer.
As a family bus, it's superb. Really quite nice to drive, great driving position, fully loaded (mine's the Toys R Us spec Titanium X Sport with all the bells) and totally unpretentious.
Loaded for the trip to France...
I live in the city and figured that the diesel would never get up to temperature and not give particularly good MPG anyway so fancied the petrol. I hardly do any miles so poorer economy wasn't a big deal. In reality, fuel consumption is horrific - on a long journey driving briskly but sensibly I struggle to do 30mpg but a month of driving around town on the school and Waitrose run will see that getting closer to 20. On the summer road trip to Central France and back, 2000 miles absolutely loaded to the roof and with a roof box, I got 26 according to the computer.
As a family bus, it's superb. Really quite nice to drive, great driving position, fully loaded (mine's the Toys R Us spec Titanium X Sport with all the bells) and totally unpretentious.
Loaded for the trip to France...
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