RE: Jaguar XE: Driven
Discussion
jamieduff1981 said:
Jaguar have for the last decade and a half provided a base model with far more equipment as standard than the Germans. That's bad news for drivers who just want the cheapest, nastiest poverty spec model because Jaguar doesn't do poverty spec very well. If you intend to spec the option doors, windows and seats to your BMW then you'll find the pricing much closer.
Have you tried building up the spec on an F type on jags site? The pricing just like the germans soon gets crazy. Cant comment on the specs on this car yet as to whats standard and whats not.jl34 said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I like this from the front but not too keen on the rear, I have been interested in this coming out and its positive Jag have a 3 series alternative I think, my main gripes are Jags old man image and perceived reliability.
The F-Type has helped massively regards the image I reckon but I wouldn't be that confident regards reliability with a JLR product but that could be me being overly harsh.
Really? , Jaguar has won the JD power survey for the last 3 years running !The F-Type has helped massively regards the image I reckon but I wouldn't be that confident regards reliability with a JLR product but that could be me being overly harsh.
http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/jaguar-...
Audi and BMW didnt even make the top 10 !
We've had three Jags since 2010 (albeit petrols) and between them all they've needed was a rear parking sensor on the S-Type and an O2 sensor on my X-Type. My wife's XF hasn't put a foot wrong in the two years of ownership.
By comparison, her previous VW seemed to regularly need fettling every year.
jamieduff1981 said:
I'm not sure if people are being deliberately stupid or just ignorant regarding pricing.
Jaguar have for the last decade and a half provided a base model with far more equipment as standard than the Germans. That's bad news for drivers who just want the cheapest, nastiest poverty spec model because Jaguar doesn't do poverty spec very well. If you intend to spec the option doors, windows and seats to your BMW then you'll find the pricing much closer.
Much also depends on the individual. Some are happy to pay a very small premium not to be seen in a generic German car.
I think you illustrate the problem well. Your reason for paying more for the Jaguar than the equivalent (and possibly better) BMW or Mercedes would be "to be different" and not because it is a better car, or your heart says "I have to have it". I think Jaguar have not been brave enough to design a truly beautiful car that moves the game on for 2015. It's all a bit generic, like so many cars sold in Florida...Jaguar have for the last decade and a half provided a base model with far more equipment as standard than the Germans. That's bad news for drivers who just want the cheapest, nastiest poverty spec model because Jaguar doesn't do poverty spec very well. If you intend to spec the option doors, windows and seats to your BMW then you'll find the pricing much closer.
Much also depends on the individual. Some are happy to pay a very small premium not to be seen in a generic German car.
jamieduff1981 said:
The British love to pan British products. All a car needs is to not be German to automatically be rubbish. How can we expect other nations to denigrate everything we produce if we don't condemn it before it's on sale ourselves?
I disagree. All petrolheads I know want British car products to do well. All things being equal, I would always support British based engineering and design etc over another country.Edited by jamieduff1981 on Wednesday 28th January 08:17
In my opinion, the car looks generic and the rear in particular is spectacularly uninspiring.
stumpage said:
Yes, but as they've not got the right badge they get dismissed.
That's actually the "old" one, here's the new one :
Good looking car, the interior had a drastic overhaul. So much that I'm actually contemplating buying one.
cerb4.5lee said:
Reliability was never a primary incentive for me either when buying a car...six years in a TVR changed my mind though! and I have just come to the conclusion that British built cars deserve a little caution when it comes to reliability. 
I have owned seven BMW`s now and not a thing has gone wrong with any of them but appreciate as with any manufacturer you get good and bad cars and its just pot luck if you are lucky enough to get a good one.
Well, comparing a manufacturer like BMW to TVR doesn't seem really fair, does it? Should compare it to the likes of Weissmann:I have owned seven BMW`s now and not a thing has gone wrong with any of them but appreciate as with any manufacturer you get good and bad cars and its just pot luck if you are lucky enough to get a good one.
edit: after seeing them like this, the 2016 Mazda 6's changes are very subtle. More visible on the rear, biggest overhaul is certainly the inside though.
Edited by ZesPak on Wednesday 28th January 12:56
Limpet said:
Comparing standard suspension variants of E90 and F30, I respectfully disagree. I don't doubt with four figures of expensive options thrown on it, the F30 handles well. Out of the box, it's average. A humble four pot diesel E90 in ES trim was much nicer to hustle along in my opinion.
As an 'owner' of an F30 320d in basic SE spec, I couldn't agree more.A while back I had an E90 in 325i flavour & that was a hugely more sprting & responsive drive than the F30.
The base F30 is a decent motorway car, with refinement & comfort, but not particularly agile or fun to punt down a winding road, unlike the E90 imho.
jl34 said:
Very depressing to hear negative comments from people who havent seen or driven the car. It has a nice sporty profile when put next to a 3 series or A4 with the rakish front pillars. I think in terms of packaging constraints and requirements of the fleet market they have a done a great job. It was never going to look like an e-type or Mk2 was it ???? !!!! Today you have strict crash safety and aero constraints before you even start on the styling. As for comparing it to a mustang, why not compare an Audi A4 to a Mustang ?
Double wishbone suspension , aluminium body, app controlled functions, 99g CO2 engine , you dont get those on the Germans so whats the matter with you lot?
I agreed lets be more positive, its more jobs and money for UK plc and our automotive industry that is doing so well and needs more support to become world class. I hope it is a run away success.Double wishbone suspension , aluminium body, app controlled functions, 99g CO2 engine , you dont get those on the Germans so whats the matter with you lot?
Maldini35 said:
GTEYE said:
Isn't Autocar written by the JLR PR team though?
For all the pre launch puff I'd expect a car to look a little more modern.
This looks like it's driven off the 2005 Geneva show stand.
I'm sure it'll drive well but both the interior and exterior look horribly dated already. Bizarre.
the c class rear end has been ruined. A4 and 3 series are boring so i don't see how looks can be compared less favorably either. if it had been more aventurous people would complain about that.
its been designed to fit in a segment no doubt. but it looks good and appears to be a class leading driving wise.
never happy you people are you
smilo996 said:
More insightful comments regarding the XE:
Car & Driver:
"The XE is proof that there’s at least one automaker still looking out for enthusiasts. The question is whether there are enough enthusiasts still looking for a car like the XE. We believe there are"
Car & Driver:
"The XE is proof that there’s at least one automaker still looking out for enthusiasts. The question is whether there are enough enthusiasts still looking for a car like the XE. We believe there are"
JonnyVTEC said:
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/1501_20...
More praise than even AutoCar.
"The Porsche GT3 might have Jag's EPAS solution licked in terms of outright wowza, but I've never felt electrically assisted power steering of this caliber on a sports sedan. It's not only that the steering is weighted just about perfectly, but the feel stays excellent all the way through a corner, and that's no small feat. Jaguar made a point to emphasize that it waited years before offering up an EPAS solution because it wanted to make sure it met the brand's reputation for sportiness. To me, that initially sounded like typical marketing BS. Thing is, the steering is revelatory. They might actually be telling the truth!"
Good to know that it isn't UK journals reporting in favour of a local car. Are there any reviews from the rest of Europe? Haven't had time to look, and not really good enough on the languages anyway.More praise than even AutoCar.
"The Porsche GT3 might have Jag's EPAS solution licked in terms of outright wowza, but I've never felt electrically assisted power steering of this caliber on a sports sedan. It's not only that the steering is weighted just about perfectly, but the feel stays excellent all the way through a corner, and that's no small feat. Jaguar made a point to emphasize that it waited years before offering up an EPAS solution because it wanted to make sure it met the brand's reputation for sportiness. To me, that initially sounded like typical marketing BS. Thing is, the steering is revelatory. They might actually be telling the truth!"
RobinBanks said:
Isn't that a bit premature? It's the first month of 2015!
That's what I thought. Apparently it's coming to dealers Q1 2015. And it's called the "2016 Mazda 6"
.Anyway, to stay off topic, it's not just the 6 that impressed me, the Mazda 2 blew me away as it had nearly the same interior, for such a small "cheap" car. Impressive.
Too bad there wasn't an MX5 on the show, but if the new range is anything to go by, it'll be a very nice place to be in
.That was my point though, if you're not looking at these saloons for their driving prowess (sorry, on PH we "should" be though), there's a lot of alternatives for less money that offer similar or better comfort, mileage, looks, practicality,...
Jaguar however is a strong brand, and I wish them all the best. They'll have to shift quite a few to regain development costs and I hope they do. But it'll be hard to "breach" the current triangle we have in Europe - Mercedes, Audi, BMW.
On top of that, the Jag will not be competing against the current A4, there'll be a new A4 that'll definitely step up the game in terms of interior at least if it wants to compete with the likes of the c-class.
The 240hp petrol Portfolio looks interesting - at £33,745 with no extras it is cheaper than a BMW 328i Luxury auto at £34,520 (the closest 3-series in basic spec)
The XE has xenons as standard - £710 extra on the BMW
Stereo - I think it has a Meridian system as standard (£500 extra on non-Portfolio model) - and we all know how abysmal the standard BMW stereo is so better allow £675 for HK
the £2k extra cost on the BMW would probably be more than wiped out as BMW discounts are fairly spectacular these days
On the "its price is close to the XF" point (a) I suspect that the new XF will be more expensive but (b) the 5-series is (in 2.0 engines anyway) priced more or less the same as 3-series
The diesel prices look more ambitious but then 320d prices aren't what I would call low
Would I buy one? No idea until I drive one and see if it is refined - if it is (unlike the shockingly noisy 3-series - a 330d I had on test gave me a headache the tyre noise was so bad) I might consider one but I would like a 6-cylinder estate in an ideal world. Or maybe an F-pace (if I can ever get over the stupid name)
The XE has xenons as standard - £710 extra on the BMW
Stereo - I think it has a Meridian system as standard (£500 extra on non-Portfolio model) - and we all know how abysmal the standard BMW stereo is so better allow £675 for HK
the £2k extra cost on the BMW would probably be more than wiped out as BMW discounts are fairly spectacular these days
On the "its price is close to the XF" point (a) I suspect that the new XF will be more expensive but (b) the 5-series is (in 2.0 engines anyway) priced more or less the same as 3-series
The diesel prices look more ambitious but then 320d prices aren't what I would call low
Would I buy one? No idea until I drive one and see if it is refined - if it is (unlike the shockingly noisy 3-series - a 330d I had on test gave me a headache the tyre noise was so bad) I might consider one but I would like a 6-cylinder estate in an ideal world. Or maybe an F-pace (if I can ever get over the stupid name)
Amusing thread. The review is broadly positive yet more than 75% of people in here seem to have read "it's a bit s
t then".
Quite incredible.
In my view, it looks a lot better in the flesh than it does in a photo. I don't think that's a bad thing.
I'm glad to hear the driving experience is up to scratch. I gather that the German press are quite impressed with it as well compared to the competition, which is good news.
t then".Quite incredible.
In my view, it looks a lot better in the flesh than it does in a photo. I don't think that's a bad thing.
I'm glad to hear the driving experience is up to scratch. I gather that the German press are quite impressed with it as well compared to the competition, which is good news.
It looks dated to me, about a generation old already - probably because of the XF similarities and side profile comparisons to many other existing cars.
Would like to see an estate though... Plus the one bodystyle will restrict the success to a degree in this country where saloons are in a decline.
Would like to see an estate though... Plus the one bodystyle will restrict the success to a degree in this country where saloons are in a decline.
Loving the Mustang comparison! only on PH..... as if THAT car is in anyway forward looking aesthetically... even IF it were comparable in any way but price...
Generic styling here was ALWAYS a given, Jag can't afford to upset the executive car park person....so for now, their re-entry to the market place follows solid 3 series/A4/C Class proportion and detail. Job done
Perhaps..hopefully...byt he sounds of it they have from a lowly market share position aken the fight properly to the big three in terms of 'driving enjoyment'? something 'we've' always hoped for? something hopefully Alfa can follow suit with.
I think this is a 1st class re-entry and position from which to develop a long term model line up.
"I'll have a Mustang instead"
only on PH..... as if THAT car is in anyway forward looking aesthetically... even IF it were comparable in any way but price...Generic styling here was ALWAYS a given, Jag can't afford to upset the executive car park person....so for now, their re-entry to the market place follows solid 3 series/A4/C Class proportion and detail. Job done
Perhaps..hopefully...byt he sounds of it they have from a lowly market share position aken the fight properly to the big three in terms of 'driving enjoyment'? something 'we've' always hoped for? something hopefully Alfa can follow suit with.
I think this is a 1st class re-entry and position from which to develop a long term model line up.
"I'll have a Mustang instead"
Jonny TVR said:
I personally find the interior of the jags very dated with poor exterior styling .. except for the F type which is gorgeous. The brand still has a very old image.
True, drove a Jaguar XF briefly and was amazed by how cheap the interior looked, and it was full leather. Beige leather seats in the back also looked extremely... standard. Edited by Jonny TVR on Wednesday 28th January 08:25
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Diesels in the class:Merc C class: 1 dreadful 4 cyl, in various states of tune.
BMW 3 series: 1 4 cyl and 1 6 cyl, in various states of tune.
Audi A4: 1 4 cyl and 1 6 cyl, in various states of tune.
Jag XE: 1 4 cyl in various states of tune.
So to me, it looks like Jag and Merc are in the same camp, with a single 4 cyl offering. BMW and Audi have a single 4 cyl and a single 6 cyl.
Of course, if the 275 hp V6 diesel will fit in, then that'll make a cracking car. But the majority of the market is for a 4 pot, so Jaguar need to make that Ingenium engine smooth, powerful and silent.
Has anyone here (with functioning hearing) actually driven both a new C Class and an old Massey Ferguson and is capable of telling the difference?
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