RE: Honda Civic Type R - more details

[blearyeyedboy]

otolith said:

allergictocheese said:

If it drives like a turkey because it was set up for a 'ring time, what then? Your teeth rattling out every time you go to Sainsbury's isn't much fun and it's not as if you've got something pretty to look at as a consolation, is it!? I would never buy a car on the basis it has a good 'ring time, but maybe that's because I'm an old fart?

I suspect that's a large part of the reason they've specced adaptive dampers.

And it'll be interesting to see how adaptive dampers change the usual script with Ring Raider FWD hot hatches. Renault's recent Trophy R got its time with trick dampers. Perhaps to make a car go quicker beyond a certain point, you need a certain degree of compliance over rough surfaces to maximise the amount of time the wheels are in contact with the ground for. It remains to be seen, but that might change the "fast FWD cars shake your teeth out" cliché. Limo it won't be but I'd be interested to see if it has better ride than an FN2.

Mind you, my arse on a skateboard might have a better ride than the FN2.

[R1gtr]

Just finished reading the group test in Evo, the Civic finishes 4th out of 5 and gets beaten round the track by the Leon and is 1 tenth quicker than the Megane which is getting on a bit.
Got a funny feeling the new RS is going to destroy this thing.

[Derek Chevalier]

R1gtr said:

Just finished reading the group test in Evo, the Civic finishes 4th out of 5 and gets beaten round the track by the Leon and is 1 tenth quicker than the Megane which is getting on a bit.
Got a funny feeling the new RS is going to destroy this thing.

I feel a bit sorry for Honda - hopefully they can continue to evolve the Type R until it is class leading

[R1gtr]

It is not a looker so I guess they were hoping the performance would blow everything else in to the weeds but that does not seem to be the case.

We have waited how long for a NSX? by the time they get it out I bet something from a competitor (new GTR perhaps) will be announced and wipe the floor with it. Honda have dropped the ball I think.

[shoestring7]

Derek Chevalier said:

R1gtr said:

Just finished reading the group test in Evo, the Civic finishes 4th out of 5 and gets beaten round the track by the Leon and is 1 tenth quicker than the Megane which is getting on a bit.
Got a funny feeling the new RS is going to destroy this thing.

I feel a bit sorry for Honda - hopefully they can continue to evolve the Type R until it is class leading

CAR magazine loved it, placed it top, above the Golf Gti and Megane.

SS7

[otolith]

Evo seem often to get interesting lap times.

[CorvetteConvert]

The Type R should have had the option of a DSG 'box to get sales up there and as things stand i can see the new Focus RS being the daddy hot hatch for sure. The Megane needs replacing with a whole new model and a smoother and better engine with 300+ bhp. The 135i needs to remove it's ugly face and gain 20 bhp.
Focus RS. Golf R. RS3. 235i. A45AMG. Best HHs out there.
Calling the 235i a HH, it does the same job.

[blearyeyedboy]

CorvetteConvert said:

The Type R should have had the option of a DSG 'box to get sales up there and as things stand i can see the new Focus RS being the daddy hot hatch for sure. The Megane needs replacing with a whole new model and a smoother and better engine with 300+ bhp. The 135i needs to remove it's ugly face and gain 20 bhp.
Focus RS. Golf R. RS3. 235i. A45AMG. Best HHs out there.
Calling the 235i a HH, it does the same job.

With respect, I would struggle to disagree with most of this post any more than I do. I agree that the 135i won't win beauty pageants though.

Don't get me wrong. You've highlighted some very nice cars there. But they're not the only things that everyone likes. If you want something to travel as quickly as possible, a horsepower race is brilliant. Likewise, a power increase rarely hurts for track weapons. But there are better track weapons for £30k than those based on family cars if that's what you want. If you want a road car with some day-to-day useability- and most do or they'd all buy Caterhams instead- then 300bhp is fun but less relevant than getting the power down, good damping and good steering response.

I would take an M135i with an LSD over one without and 20 more bhp. Making the fun of these cars accessible so that a greater percentage of your driving is spent having fun is easily worth more smiles than a power hike.

As for DSG... well, there are two camps. Some manufacturers make rubbish manual gearboxes; Honda isn't one of them. I struggled to gel with a Civic FN2 I tried a few years ago but the gearbox was sublime. Certainly they would sell some more with DSG but something important would be lost, I think.

By the time we insist all hot hatches must have 4wd and 300bhp+, instead of making them chuckable and fun, then something precious risks being lost. If you want to buy one, then great. But like you said, you've got a range of options in flavours you like already. Insisting that other people follow their recipes is a bit like banning Mint Choc Chip ice cream because you only like strawberry and raspberry.

I won't be buying a Civic Type R. It's not the right flavour for me. But I'm bloody glad it exists. Vive la difference.