RE: Koenigsegg - Geneva 2015
Discussion
No they're not. They occupy the place Lambo used to have.
The trouble is Pagani's cars work and for me are head and shoulders above CVK's creations.
Thinking about it since i last posted, a single speed is utterly undesirable to me; he should have made full electric, or made a hybrid with the ability to change gear in E mode and ICE mode. THAT would be impressive.
The trouble is Pagani's cars work and for me are head and shoulders above CVK's creations.
Thinking about it since i last posted, a single speed is utterly undesirable to me; he should have made full electric, or made a hybrid with the ability to change gear in E mode and ICE mode. THAT would be impressive.
7lucky7 said:
Atmospheric said:
No they're not. They occupy the place Lambo used to have.
Lamborghini have shown a hybrid. Pagani have not, ergo Pagani are behind Lamborghini in this field.Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
Watchman said:
I love this.
I don't know much about hydraulics in practice but I have previously wondered if there was any mileage in some sort of hydraulic power transfer. I didn't consider replacing the whole gearbox like this though. It's a fabulous example of fresh thinking.
I really believed the press when the Veyron was launched, than we'd reached the Concorde moment of automotive engineering... meaning we won't ever see anything as mad as a Veyron again. Now though, I have hope for a 300mph "production" car in my lifetime.
Its not even remotely new thinking.I don't know much about hydraulics in practice but I have previously wondered if there was any mileage in some sort of hydraulic power transfer. I didn't consider replacing the whole gearbox like this though. It's a fabulous example of fresh thinking.
I really believed the press when the Veyron was launched, than we'd reached the Concorde moment of automotive engineering... meaning we won't ever see anything as mad as a Veyron again. Now though, I have hope for a 300mph "production" car in my lifetime.
VSG hydraulic drives were taught during my apprenticeship, and that was 30 years ago.
Atmospheric said:
7lucky7 said:
Atmospheric said:
No they're not. They occupy the place Lambo used to have.
Lamborghini have shown a hybrid. Pagani have not, ergo Pagani are behind Lamborghini in this field.Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
It was only last year if I remember correctly that Koenigsegg sold its 100th car, which is not that great over a nearly 14 year production cycle.
On the plus side I like the styling of the new car, but am yet to be convinced about this direct drive malarky
7lucky7 said:
I'd happily have a wager with you, that they are already looking into it.
Possibly, but remember Pagani do not develop their own engines, AMG do that for them under contract. I am not sure Pagani are going to commission that kind of development unless they can piggy back off another AMG hybrid project to keep the costs under control. Streetrod said:
7lucky7 said:
I'd happily have a wager with you, that they are already looking into it.
Possibly, but remember Pagani do not develop their own engines, AMG do that for them under contract. I am not sure Pagani are going to commission that kind of development unless they can piggy back off another AMG hybrid project to keep the costs under control. Koenigsegg have a history of developing their own engines/drivetrain and do on a consultancy basis for many other brands, so it's in their competence bubble to do so.
Pagani have always used Merc, so, as you say, unless Merc develop (pay to develop) a hybrid, I can't see Pagani doing it alone
I suspect they see their spot in the market as 'those looking to avoid' the hybrid mega car
Although saying that, they've been quite quiet with new models since the Huyara, so never say never as their development guys must be doing something
I. for one, am hoping they give the hybrid fad a miss and keep on doing what they do
h0b0 said:
405dogvan said:
I've been thinking about how this works for at least 45 mins now and I just cannot even begin to imagine a petrol engine without any gears - or many of it's other claims
"Below 30mph it runs entirely on electricity" and "it's electric only range is 22 miles" and nowhere did I read that it charges it's battery on-the-move - so it's limited to 22 miles for many people then?
"It will auto-discharge it's battery on the way home to ensure it's ready for a full charge" - erm, that's not how lithium batteries work - is it running Ni-Cads
As someone else said, if the engine is revved-out at 249mph - you'll use < 30% of it on any public road outside Germany - that makes no sense whatsoever (having no gears on a petrol engine makes no sense to me anyway)
So it's basically the world's most expensive/short-range dragster?
The V8 charges the battery. "Below 30mph it runs entirely on electricity" and "it's electric only range is 22 miles" and nowhere did I read that it charges it's battery on-the-move - so it's limited to 22 miles for many people then?
"It will auto-discharge it's battery on the way home to ensure it's ready for a full charge" - erm, that's not how lithium batteries work - is it running Ni-Cads
As someone else said, if the engine is revved-out at 249mph - you'll use < 30% of it on any public road outside Germany - that makes no sense whatsoever (having no gears on a petrol engine makes no sense to me anyway)
So it's basically the world's most expensive/short-range dragster?
Even if it does tho - the whole 'direct drive' thing just bends my head - I realise most super/hypercars are 80% useless in 99% of situations but this one seems to really polish that ;0
Atmospheric said:
I'd argue Paganis don't have to. They aren't a Lamborghini rival - they're not competing with them for sales either. The technology is there and available - the Mercedes-Benz partnership sees to that. Pagani simply do not have to rush anything into production.
Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
All I said before was that they are behind Lamborghini, i.e. in tech and performance. No one mentioned style or uniqueness, which have nothing to do with it!Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
MonkeyMatt said:
Atmospheric said:
I'd argue Paganis don't have to. They aren't a Lamborghini rival - they're not competing with them for sales either. The technology is there and available - the Mercedes-Benz partnership sees to that. Pagani simply do not have to rush anything into production.
Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
All I said before was that they are behind Lamborghini, i.e. in tech and performance. No one mentioned style or uniqueness, which have nothing to do with it!Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
MehMeh said:
The redundancy of the "wasted" 300 hp seems like a fair trade-off for all the gains in relative weight, performance, power, delivery, range and sub-186mph efficiency.
that brought a smile to my face.Love it. I love the technology of "the past" - N/A V8s, manual gearboxes etc - but I'd rather new tech go its own way, rather than try and ape the old.
Atmospheric said:
MonkeyMatt said:
Atmospheric said:
I'd argue Paganis don't have to. They aren't a Lamborghini rival - they're not competing with them for sales either. The technology is there and available - the Mercedes-Benz partnership sees to that. Pagani simply do not have to rush anything into production.
Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
All I said before was that they are behind Lamborghini, i.e. in tech and performance. No one mentioned style or uniqueness, which have nothing to do with it!Competing just isn't their style. Uniqueness is, however.
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