Top spec 'normal' car vs. entry level 'premium'
Discussion
MC Bodge said:
ZX10R NIN said:
3-4 years in a car of your own spec every time why have a basic Golf R when you can drive around in a well spec'd GTI for me the later would always be the only option.
I may be wrong, but I can't imagine that a "basic Golf R" is actually lacking much of importance. Smaller wheels might be better, though.Fox- said:
Rincewind209 said:
The Mazda will be cheaper, slightly quicker, more toys and better fuel economy. I've not driven the Mazda but unless it's atrocious it will probably be very close. The Bmw does look good inside but it's not amazing. If all you've ever driven is small mainstream stuff you will be impressed, otherwise not. Try them both and let us know.
The Mazda is not slightly quicker - it's slightly slower by virtue of it's 15bhp power deficit on the 520d (0-60 8.6 v 8.0 for the autos). The Mazda is also more thirsty by 5mpg on the combined cycle (We all know these figures are rubbish but what else can we go on) and the interior of the 5 Series is a noticeably nicer place to be than the Mazda 6.Your comments seem to be based on no real knowledge of either car - you simply make assumptions which may have been true 10 years ago but do not reflect the performance and specification of the current 5 Series. Both cars are very well specified, both have Nav, leather, xenons, dual zone climate, cruise etc - the only real differences in terms of spec appear to be that the Mazda has a reversing camera, adaptive lights and Bose audio.
Those three things, whilst nice to have, are simply insufficient to make it a better choice than the 5 Series. 10 years ago I'd have been on the other side of the fence and would not have picked a base model 5 Series over a top end something else but that was before the significant revisions to the level of standard equipment.
The Mazda also has keyless entry, electric front seats, folding wing mirrors and auto lights and wipers, all extras on the BMW. And the Mazda would still be nearly 6 grand cheaper.
The BMW is a nice car but in base spec it's not that special. And I test drove one in December, but as I said, I haven't driven the Mazda.
Rincewind209 said:
I find your post confusing. We are talking about a base spec 520d. It doesn't have an automatic gearbox . That's a £1500 extra (slightly more with paddles). And as a manual it's neither as quick or as economical. So comparing like for like ( manuals) the Mazda is slightly better. The ride and handling are good on the BMW, but only if you have the Active Damping. You've guessed it, it's an extra, about a grand so not cheap. The interior is nice in the BMW but it doesn't blow you away in base spec. Those lovely seats in the ads and demonstrators are £1700 and the standard ones are just that standard.
The Mazda also has keyless entry, electric front seats, folding wing mirrors and auto lights and wipers, all extras on the BMW. And the Mazda would still be nearly 6 grand cheaper.
The BMW is a nice car but in base spec it's not that special. And I test drove one in December, but as I said, I haven't driven the Mazda.
For the manuals (I simply assumed nobody would ever buy this sort of car with such a gearbox, but never mind) the fuel consumption figures on both cars are identical - the 6 is not more efficient - and performance is pretty much the same as well (0.1 seconds between them). Despite the bleatings of the press at the cars launch you do NOT need Active Damping on a 5 Series. My car does not have adaptive damping and rides and handles well.The Mazda also has keyless entry, electric front seats, folding wing mirrors and auto lights and wipers, all extras on the BMW. And the Mazda would still be nearly 6 grand cheaper.
The BMW is a nice car but in base spec it's not that special. And I test drove one in December, but as I said, I haven't driven the Mazda.
The BMW has partial keyless entry, the front seats are electric except for forward and back and auto lights and wipers are standard, not extras.
The interior in 'base spec' is exactly the same as the interior in '550i' spec (with the exception of the smaller navigration screen but the nav screen on the Mazda6 is poor also).
I just don't know how you can sit in both cars and declare you'd rather have the Mazda. It's just not as good.
But then it doesn't need to be because as you've also pointed out, it's cheaper - sometimes much cheaper. And for the money you can buy them for its an excellent car - but the question wasn't that, the question was which car should be chosen, top spec Mazd6 or base spec 520d and frankly the answer is base spec 520d.
I 'think' the summary is different strokes for different folks.
However people that have spent some time in the 520d thinks this is a no-brainier (of which I am one) and people that haven't spent time in a 520d are comparing specs.
Good luck OP, it's gone a bit out of control (well it is PH
), please let us know which you choose once you've friven both.
However people that have spent some time in the 520d thinks this is a no-brainier (of which I am one) and people that haven't spent time in a 520d are comparing specs.
Good luck OP, it's gone a bit out of control (well it is PH
), please let us know which you choose once you've friven both. Fox- said:
Rincewind209 said:
I find your post confusing. We are talking about a base spec 520d. It doesn't have an automatic gearbox . That's a £1500 extra (slightly more with paddles). And as a manual it's neither as quick or as economical. So comparing like for like ( manuals) the Mazda is slightly better. The ride and handling are good on the BMW, but only if you have the Active Damping. You've guessed it, it's an extra, about a grand so not cheap. The interior is nice in the BMW but it doesn't blow you away in base spec. Those lovely seats in the ads and demonstrators are £1700 and the standard ones are just that standard.
The Mazda also has keyless entry, electric front seats, folding wing mirrors and auto lights and wipers, all extras on the BMW. And the Mazda would still be nearly 6 grand cheaper.
The BMW is a nice car but in base spec it's not that special. And I test drove one in December, but as I said, I haven't driven the Mazda.
For the manuals (I simply assumed nobody would ever buy this sort of car with such a gearbox, but never mind) the fuel consumption figures on both cars are identical - the 6 is not more efficient - and performance is pretty much the same as well (0.1 seconds between them). Despite the bleatings of the press at the cars launch you do NOT need Active Damping on a 5 Series. My car does not have adaptive damping and rides and handles well.The Mazda also has keyless entry, electric front seats, folding wing mirrors and auto lights and wipers, all extras on the BMW. And the Mazda would still be nearly 6 grand cheaper.
The BMW is a nice car but in base spec it's not that special. And I test drove one in December, but as I said, I haven't driven the Mazda.
The BMW has partial keyless entry, the front seats are electric except for forward and back and auto lights and wipers are standard, not extras.
The interior in 'base spec' is exactly the same as the interior in '550i' spec (with the exception of the smaller navigration screen but the nav screen on the Mazda6 is poor also).
I just don't know how you can sit in both cars and declare you'd rather have the Mazda. It's just not as good.
But then it doesn't need to be because as you've also pointed out, it's cheaper - sometimes much cheaper. And for the money you can buy them for its an excellent car - but the question wasn't that, the question was which car should be chosen, top spec Mazd6 or base spec 520d and frankly the answer is base spec 520d.
A900ss said:
I 'think' the summary is different strokes for different folks.
However people that have spent some time in the 520d thinks this is a no-brainier (of which I am one) and people that haven't spent time in a 520d are comparing specs.
Good luck OP, it's gone a bit out of control (well it is PH), please let us know which you choose once you've friven both.
Will do. There is certainly a lot of divided opinions! However people that have spent some time in the 520d thinks this is a no-brainier (of which I am one) and people that haven't spent time in a 520d are comparing specs.
Good luck OP, it's gone a bit out of control (well it is PH
), please let us know which you choose once you've friven both. Local Mazda garage has just invited me to a 'VIP' event on Friday, they should have the facelift 6 in so I will report back.
Rincewind209 said:
The interior is nice but it's not wow nice unless you add those seats and the leather dash.
But in the context of this thread it simply needs to be better than the Mazda which of course it is. As for leather dash, nobody adds that, not even 550i M Sport buyers, so to throw that into the thread is bizarre. The dash as standard is excellent anyway.Rincewind209 said:
With auto and the dampers which really are necessary the car costs £40000. And your still driving a 2.0 litre diesel.
Auto I agree, I don't know anyone would want this sort of car as a manual, but then that applies with the Mazda too. Your obsession with the dampers is a bit bizarre, as I said - it rides and handles fine without adaptive suspension. It's nice to have (But then so is a 3 litre engine, or a pan roof, or a V8) but it isn't required at all and the Mazda is hardly some sort of sports car.Fox- said:
Rincewind209 said:
The interior is nice but it's not wow nice unless you add those seats and the leather dash.
But in the context of this thread it simply needs to be better than the Mazda which of course it is. As for leather dash, nobody adds that, not even 550i M Sport buyers, so to throw that into the thread is bizarre. The dash as standard is excellent anyway.Rincewind209 said:
With auto and the dampers which really are necessary the car costs £40000. And your still driving a 2.0 litre diesel.
Auto I agree, I don't know anyone would want this sort of car as a manual, but then that applies with the Mazda too. Your obsession with the dampers is a bit bizarre, as I said - it rides and handles fine without adaptive suspension. It's nice to have (But then so is a 3 litre engine, or a pan roof, or a V8) but it isn't required at all and the Mazda is hardly some sort of sports car.Rincewind209 said:
But the BMW rolls a bit to much in the corners and it's not the best ride over rough surfaces. And frankly I expect a bit more from a big BMW. And that 2.0 diesel probably looks good for company car drivers but I don't think it's such a great idea to buy one, not new anyway. But with lots of toys and a big lump I expect it's a much nicer place to be.
But the alternative in this thread is a Mazda6, which also has a 4 cylinder diesel engine and no adaptive suspension...Popped into the dealer for their 'VIP' event at lunchtime and had a test drive of a new (pre-facelift 6).
My thoughts were that the car pulled better than mine (with 102k on the clock) but the interior & tyre noise was a massive let down.
I also had a look at the new facelift car that they had in the showroom, the interior quality is much higher! I grabbed a few pics (not great due to the sunlight coming through the showroom windows):
Deal wise, it's looking to be significantly cheaper than the 520d, although the figures they've quoted me are straight off the website so i'm expecting to be able to get them down even further.
My thoughts were that the car pulled better than mine (with 102k on the clock) but the interior & tyre noise was a massive let down.
I also had a look at the new facelift car that they had in the showroom, the interior quality is much higher! I grabbed a few pics (not great due to the sunlight coming through the showroom windows):
Deal wise, it's looking to be significantly cheaper than the 520d, although the figures they've quoted me are straight off the website so i'm expecting to be able to get them down even further.
The quote on the Mazda has just come through:
25k miles p/annum
175bhp Sport Tourer with Nav & Auto
Safety Pack
Soul Red Paint
Stone interior
Car - £30,455.
Based on £1k down from me and £500 Mazda contribution with a GFV of £7,565 over 3yr i'm looking at £594 p/mth
They don't seem to like to budge on list price! I'm just waiting for them to let me know the service costs (i'm guessing an extra £27 p/mth for my mileage which takes me to £599. For an extra £27 I can have the BMW!
Broadspeed are offering the base car @ £25,624 + options (£1,660) = £27,124
Updated costs as he'd quoted on a saloon not a touring (£800 difference). Servicing is looking at £47.30 p/mth (6 services - £1,702.80).
Total cost - £641.30 p/mth. Not a true like for like as the BMW was on 48mths @ £626 IIRC.
A call to broadspeed may be in order.
25k miles p/annum
175bhp Sport Tourer with Nav & Auto
Safety Pack
Soul Red Paint
Stone interior
Car - £30,455.
Based on £1k down from me and £500 Mazda contribution with a GFV of £7,565 over 3yr i'm looking at £594 p/mth
They don't seem to like to budge on list price! I'm just waiting for them to let me know the service costs (i'm guessing an extra £27 p/mth for my mileage which takes me to £599. For an extra £27 I can have the BMW!
Broadspeed are offering the base car @ £25,624 + options (£1,660) = £27,124
Updated costs as he'd quoted on a saloon not a touring (£800 difference). Servicing is looking at £47.30 p/mth (6 services - £1,702.80).
Total cost - £641.30 p/mth. Not a true like for like as the BMW was on 48mths @ £626 IIRC.
A call to broadspeed may be in order.
Edited by pmanson on Monday 16th March 15:25
A900ss said:
But look at the mileage. Think of this car more of a tool than an entirely emotional purchase.
But the reverse is the point.I'd pay 30K for a car that pulled on me emotionally - a 911 etc etc,
But I'd pay 14K for a nearly new Mondeo 2.0 tdci zetec nav estate as a business tool.
A GFV of 7.5K for the Mazda tells you all you need to know.
A good friend of mine has got a fantastic deal on a new 520d Touring, but does far fewer miles so maybe it's just a subsidised thing to feed good stock into the used network in the next 2-3 years, but there should be deals to be done.
As a tool the 520d is the best car in the world in my view. It's comfortable, refined, quiet and even the base model now has nav, leather and xenons so isn't that badly equipped either.
For me there's no question that the 5 wins of the two options. I've spent quite a bit of time driving a 2012 520d and it's a fantastic car, if the question was between a Mazda 6 or a 3 series then it's a much harder choice, but the 5 is a step above in refinement and the way the interior feels.
As a tool the 520d is the best car in the world in my view. It's comfortable, refined, quiet and even the base model now has nav, leather and xenons so isn't that badly equipped either.
For me there's no question that the 5 wins of the two options. I've spent quite a bit of time driving a 2012 520d and it's a fantastic car, if the question was between a Mazda 6 or a 3 series then it's a much harder choice, but the 5 is a step above in refinement and the way the interior feels.
hornetrider said:
That GFV is ridiculous!
I concur on the tyre noise though. Maybe an SE-L on smaller wheels would help?
I've just picked a random leasing site and based on 3 years and 25k miles:I concur on the tyre noise though. Maybe an SE-L on smaller wheels would help?
£1,500ish in
£492 p/mth
Aiding maintenance takes it to £625 (including all servicing, tyres etc).
A900ss said:
Are you sure you've driven an F10/F11 520d?????
I've done over 70k in mine and have not noticed this 'roll to (sic) much in the corners'.
For info I'm on 17" wheels and standard suspension.
What are you comparing it to? I went from an E91 320d to an F10 520d. And the 5er was a soggy ride compares to the 3er part of which is body roll through the corners.I've done over 70k in mine and have not noticed this 'roll to (sic) much in the corners'.
For info I'm on 17" wheels and standard suspension.
I'm not saying its ride on standard SE suspension is poor. But there was a noticeable downgrade between the two cars. Same could be said for physical build quality too - the doors and tailgate on the E91 shut with a positive kerchunk. The doors on the F10 weren't anything like as solid, and the boot lid had a tendency to bounce back open. And that was on the 8 or so F10s in the company fleet...
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