"RE: Mercedes-Benz C450 AMG 4Matic: Driven
Discussion
MuSplit said:
bertie said:
Wow!
My logic was that since the EU are legislating to reduce what they call environmental noise emissions from cars, is it not inevitable that some form of synthetic noise will be created inside the cabin to satisfy people's desire to hear a "nice" engine noise.
http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/sectors/automotive/...
I'm not sure why you're getting so personal with me, by the way, I've worked for 28 years in automotive engineering.
Go ahead, be nonchalant and don't care about lying and fakery. You can have any layman's opinion you want. But don't try to rationalise it and give BS excuses.My logic was that since the EU are legislating to reduce what they call environmental noise emissions from cars, is it not inevitable that some form of synthetic noise will be created inside the cabin to satisfy people's desire to hear a "nice" engine noise.
http://ec.europa.eu/enterprise/sectors/automotive/...
I'm not sure why you're getting so personal with me, by the way, I've worked for 28 years in automotive engineering.
I myself have never heard of cabin noise being so loud that it becomes an environmental concern...
Jesus, did you not even read that the C63, a different version of the same car, has no fake sounds played through the speakers?????????? Let me guess, you worked at British Leyland or Lada?
And finally, as I already wrote: go find out what is on sale right now (even those with the pathetic fake sounds through speakers), and listen to their actual exhaust sounds. Clearly you haven't done that. Yet you keep spewing very arrogant messages that are clearly nothing but products of your 'reasoning' and imagination.
Above all I wonder why are you trying so vehemently to justify such stupid fakery??
Edited by MuSplit on Friday 6th March 22:33
If you take a look at my cars you'll see I enjoy a good engine sound as much as the next man, but a lot of residents don't, hence the EU reducing drive by noise limits.
You seem very angry and you seem to be directing it at me and I'm not sure why.
bertie said:
I'm not trying to justify it, I didn't design the car, just saying that with stricter rules on what noise a car can emit, you might well start seeing this technology more.
If you take a look at my cars you'll see I enjoy a good engine sound as much as the next man, but a lot of residents don't, hence the EU reducing drive by noise limits.
You seem very angry and you seem to be directing it at me and I'm not sure why.
You seem to not even try to answer my arguments. I guess you think it's fun to just troll around.If you take a look at my cars you'll see I enjoy a good engine sound as much as the next man, but a lot of residents don't, hence the EU reducing drive by noise limits.
You seem very angry and you seem to be directing it at me and I'm not sure why.
You did try to justify it and you made up excuses. Then you completely ducked my arguments and have not responded to them or even acknowledged them! That is extremely rude and dishonest!
-I already told you several times that the article itself already says that the BIGGER ENGINED and LOUDER version of the SAME CAR, which has to abide by the SAME RULES does NOT have any fake sounds coming through the speakers!!
-Cabin noise, you know the sounds INSIDE the car do not affect the amount of sound heard OUTSIDE the car very much, and definitely not enough to be an environmental concern!
-You HAVE made up that excuse about noise rules, because for the millionth time: many cars with fake sound through the stereos sound really nice on the outside and are not very quiet at all! That is reality, it's what's out there right now.
-And finally, even if cars would be mandated to be super-quiet inside (they aren't), then that's just something we would have to live with. A slightly quieter engine. No need for juvenile, absolutely pathetic and ridiculous fake sounds played through the speakers!! And the manufacturers trying to trick customers into thinking that it's the genuine sound too!! They'll only privately admit it when asked, never acknowledge it publicly or in any PR-material or marketing!!
The real reasons are: simple, all-enveloping instead of selective noise suppression. It's easier to just drown out all the noise than intelligently design the car so that only the unpleasant sounds are suppressed. It's easier to just put lots of sound deadening and not bother with tuning the engine's sounds meticulously instead of engineering the overall noise level to stay at a low level when cruising and yet rise when pushed. And most importantly, the number one reason for these fake sound systems: the monotonous drone of turbocharged engines, which they then don't even try to engineer to really sound better (except in top models like the 63 AMG and top brands like Ferrari), and no matter what they do they'll pretty much always lose the octave change (and whatever else, I don't know the proper terms) and induction noise change that naturally aspirated cars have. That makes it, as BMW for example argues, harder for drivers to determine the revs just by sound. Listen to the pure sound files and you'll hear how they're desperately trying to get the 'tuneful' sound of rising revs added to the drone of the actual engine noise.
You seem to be aggressively against the truth (both in automotive engineering and the debate), and I find it pathetic.
Osinjak said:
He also said that he'd' never heard where cabin noise was such an environmental concern.' I think he's got his angry wires crossed.
Yes, genius, I really don't think interior noise levels are a concern for legislators. It seems to be you and bertie who have your wires crossed.MuSplit said:
Osinjak said:
He also said that he'd' never heard where cabin noise was such an environmental concern.' I think he's got his angry wires crossed.
Yes, genius, I really don't think interior noise levels are a concern for legislators. It seems to be you and Bertie who have your wires crossed.Osinjak said:
Which wasn't what Bertie said you utter plank. So while you're busy ramming his internet words down his throat with your internet hard man act, you're missing the point. He's talking about noise legislation outside the car not inside it. So genius, who's the clever one now?
Exactly, and noise legislation outside the car doesn't regulate the noise inside the car!!!!! He is saying, repeatedly, that cars have been made quiet INSIDE due to EXTERNAL noise regulations!!! Which does not make sense, especially since we know that the cars are not quiet on the outside and also because outside noise does not determine inside noise. And it's no wonder that it doesn't make sense because he made that excuse up.
Edited by MuSplit on Saturday 7th March 00:41
Edited by MuSplit on Saturday 7th March 00:42
Osinjak said:
Aye, ruined by a moronic troll by the name of MuSplit.
FU. You are a rude a**hole with ZERO rational arguments so far. I've given many arguments, and have addressed other people's arguments, you don't know how to have a conversation or debate.Hey genius, tell me more about how 'reduced' external noise emissions FORCE car manufacturers to play engine sounds inside the car!! Haha!
Edited by MuSplit on Saturday 7th March 00:39
Edited by MuSplit on Saturday 7th March 00:40
This is the entirety of your contribution to this 'discussion':
-level trolling, with actual arguments.
Your mother must be proud, chav troll.
Osinjak said:
He also said that he'd 'never heard where cabin noise was such an environmental concern.' I think he's got his angry wires crossed.
Which wasn't what Bertie said you utter plank. So while you're busy ramming his internet words down his throat with your internet hard man act, you're missing the point. He's talking about noise legislation outside the car not inside it. So genius, who's the clever one now?
Aye, ruined by a moronic troll by the name of MuSplit.
So your contribution, arguments, wisdom and manners amount to absolutely ZERO. Excuse me if I ruined your Nobel laureate -level discussion, sorry I meant Which wasn't what Bertie said you utter plank. So while you're busy ramming his internet words down his throat with your internet hard man act, you're missing the point. He's talking about noise legislation outside the car not inside it. So genius, who's the clever one now?
Aye, ruined by a moronic troll by the name of MuSplit.
-level trolling, with actual arguments.Your mother must be proud, chav troll.
Edited by MuSplit on Saturday 7th March 01:32
I don't know what's going on now.
I never said synthesised engine noise was a good thing, just that it's likely to become more common.
I get that you don't like it, however you seem to be getting very aggressive and very personal for some reason, and I don't need it.
In summary, nice car.
I never said synthesised engine noise was a good thing, just that it's likely to become more common.
I get that you don't like it, however you seem to be getting very aggressive and very personal for some reason, and I don't need it.
In summary, nice car.
Edited by bertie on Saturday 7th March 10:18
I often wonder if the population of the UK genuinely is losing its sanity or if it's merely a case that the growth of the Internet over the last couple of decades has given a mouthpiece to a static proportion of citizens with borderline and/or undiagnosed mental health issues. Pistonheads continues to expose me to all sorts of bizarre behaviour.
I bet the car is very nice.
I bet the car is very nice.
scenario8 said:
I often wonder if the population of the UK genuinely is losing its sanity or if it's merely a case that the growth of the Internet over the last couple of decades has given a mouthpiece to a static proportion of citizens with borderline and/or undiagnosed mental health issues. Pistonheads continues to expose me to all sorts of bizarre behaviour.
I bet the car is very nice.
It's not a phenomenon limited to the UK, people from all backgrounds try to 'express themselves' anonymously on the internet and decide themselves whether or not they have something intelligent to say or even try to put any effort. For many it seems to be a hobby ranging from just blurting out stuff without the burden of responsibility (it's their free time so why do it properly) all the way to purposefully harassing and offending others to vent their frustrations and angst. It's a worldwide thing, not just limited to you who are living in the UK.I bet the car is very nice.
The car seems nice, shame about the fake stuff.
MuSplit said:
It's not a phenomenon limited to the UK, people from all backgrounds try to 'express themselves' anonymously on the internet and decide themselves whether or not they have something intelligent to say or even try to put any effort. For many it seems to be a hobby ranging from just blurting out stuff without the burden of responsibility (it's their free time so why do it properly) all the way to purposefully harassing and offending others to vent their frustrations and angst. It's a worldwide thing, not just limited to you who are living in the UK.
The car seems nice, shame about the fake stuff.
Are you aware that you have just described yourself?The car seems nice, shame about the fake stuff.
tomjol said:
MuSplit said:
It's not a phenomenon limited to the UK, people from all backgrounds try to 'express themselves' anonymously on the internet and decide themselves whether or not they have something intelligent to say or even try to put any effort. For many it seems to be a hobby ranging from just blurting out stuff without the burden of responsibility (it's their free time so why do it properly) all the way to purposefully harassing and offending others to vent their frustrations and angst. It's a worldwide thing, not just limited to you who are living in the UK.
The car seems nice, shame about the fake stuff.
Are you aware that you have just described yourself?The car seems nice, shame about the fake stuff.
spot on....tomjol said:
MuSplit said:
It's not a phenomenon limited to the UK, people from all backgrounds try to 'express themselves' anonymously on the internet and decide themselves whether or not they have something intelligent to say or even try to put any effort. For many it seems to be a hobby ranging from just blurting out stuff without the burden of responsibility (it's their free time so why do it properly) all the way to purposefully harassing and offending others to vent their frustrations and angst. It's a worldwide thing, not just limited to you who are living in the UK.
The car seems nice, shame about the fake stuff.
Are you aware that you have just described yourself?The car seems nice, shame about the fake stuff.
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