The best Q Car out of the factory?
Discussion
The problem with new cars is that even a modest spec TDI looks pretty bling and Mr and Mrs Average think their diesel Audi, BMW or Mercedes is the fastest car in the world. I gave up trying to convince my colleague that my WRX was faster than his Hyundai Coupe V6 (but mine's a V6 and has a 2.7 litre engine)!
For this reason, the older cars are better Q cars and I don't think there has been a better example given than the Rover 620ti (or to a lesser extent the 800 Vitesse) but these aren't that quick by today's standards.
The original M5 and 500E (and also the original Legacy and Impreza turbos) were great Q cars when they first come out but now that WE are now familiar with them they have lost their Q car status a bit and any of these age cars that still survive are more likely to be the high performance versions.
The Lexus ISF in a subdued colour may be a good modern example and the Q7 suggested perhaps (who would expect something so large to be so quick) and being that most of them are diesel, the Supercharged Range Rover may also fall into this category.
Not a UK market car but the previous generation Chevrolet Impala was a very innocuous looking car. Popular with rental fleets and normally silver or white. Not a great car but the bland looks did mask a 3.6 V6 with 300bhp (through the front wheels sadly), so really quite quick.
For this reason, the older cars are better Q cars and I don't think there has been a better example given than the Rover 620ti (or to a lesser extent the 800 Vitesse) but these aren't that quick by today's standards.
The original M5 and 500E (and also the original Legacy and Impreza turbos) were great Q cars when they first come out but now that WE are now familiar with them they have lost their Q car status a bit and any of these age cars that still survive are more likely to be the high performance versions.
The Lexus ISF in a subdued colour may be a good modern example and the Q7 suggested perhaps (who would expect something so large to be so quick) and being that most of them are diesel, the Supercharged Range Rover may also fall into this category.
Not a UK market car but the previous generation Chevrolet Impala was a very innocuous looking car. Popular with rental fleets and normally silver or white. Not a great car but the bland looks did mask a 3.6 V6 with 300bhp (through the front wheels sadly), so really quite quick.
Only one option really.
Mercedes E63 AMG Business Line.
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/new-2014-mercede...
Mercedes E63 AMG Business Line.
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/new-2014-mercede...
Jayho said:
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/a...
Looks like any other Big Audi Family Wagon and I don't think anyone would expect such a large car to move so quick in straights AND Round corners.
Not Q at all as everyone knows they're driven by blinging wLooks like any other Big Audi Family Wagon and I don't think anyone would expect such a large car to move so quick in straights AND Round corners.
kers.Jader1973 said:
I'm afraid you are all wrong.
The best Q car out of the factory is the one that started it all back in 1968: The Mercedes 300SEL 6.3.
Fastest 4 door saloon in the world when it came out. 0 to 60 mph in 6.5 seconds and a top speed of 137 mph. Which doesn't seem a lot now, but back then was as quick, if not quicker than a lot of sports cars.
Thing is that car would have looked impossibly exotic and fast back in 1968 and wouldn't have been a Q car at all, neither would half the others mentioned on this thread M5s, Thema 8.32 all looked amazing next to the dreary Escorts, Princesses and Cortinas we had back in the 80's. The best Q car out of the factory is the one that started it all back in 1968: The Mercedes 300SEL 6.3.
Fastest 4 door saloon in the world when it came out. 0 to 60 mph in 6.5 seconds and a top speed of 137 mph. Which doesn't seem a lot now, but back then was as quick, if not quicker than a lot of sports cars.
The only one that qualifies is the A6, dreary looking thing that is.
Jag XF SV8- range topper at launch. 4.2 litre supercharged V8 putting out 420 bhp. 0-60 in 5.1, with no outward bulges,vents or signs other than the bootlid badge. Take that off and it was identical to the boggo 2.7 diesels. Had one for 6 months and it was a lot of fun at the lights!
aeropilot said:
Yes, you are.
MB may have started it all in 1968 in terms of European manufacturers, but they were just copying the format the yanks had been doing for the previous 10 years.....
Biggest engine (or road going NASCAR race engine required for homologation purposes) stuffed into the smallest sedan (saloon) that it would fit in, and often sold in the most basic poverty spec going. Street sleeper road cars were a yank invention, not a European one I'm afraid.
Name one. I can't think of any 1960s Yank 4 door sedan that outperformed a European sports car.MB may have started it all in 1968 in terms of European manufacturers, but they were just copying the format the yanks had been doing for the previous 10 years.....
Biggest engine (or road going NASCAR race engine required for homologation purposes) stuffed into the smallest sedan (saloon) that it would fit in, and often sold in the most basic poverty spec going. Street sleeper road cars were a yank invention, not a European one I'm afraid.
Their muscle cars were invariably 2 door, and didn't go round corners. They were also built to homologate for NASCAR, they weren't real Q cars because they were built to race.
Jader1973 said:
aeropilot said:
Yes, you are.
MB may have started it all in 1968 in terms of European manufacturers, but they were just copying the format the yanks had been doing for the previous 10 years.....
Biggest engine (or road going NASCAR race engine required for homologation purposes) stuffed into the smallest sedan (saloon) that it would fit in, and often sold in the most basic poverty spec going. Street sleeper road cars were a yank invention, not a European one I'm afraid.
Name one. I can't think of any 1960s Yank 4 door sedan that outperformed a European sports car.MB may have started it all in 1968 in terms of European manufacturers, but they were just copying the format the yanks had been doing for the previous 10 years.....
Biggest engine (or road going NASCAR race engine required for homologation purposes) stuffed into the smallest sedan (saloon) that it would fit in, and often sold in the most basic poverty spec going. Street sleeper road cars were a yank invention, not a European one I'm afraid.
Perhaps you should re-read my post.
And additionally, why mention a sports car, which by definition can't be a Q-car, which is after all what we discussing.
lord trumpton said:
calibrax said:
Rover 620ti...
2 litre turbo (Rover T-series engine, not Honda as some think!)
197bhp
0-60mph in 7.2s
Top speed 143mph
All in an innocuous 4 door saloon with a Rover badge, that looked like it was your grandad's car.
Now that's a Q-car!
Although it's awful to behold, I do agree that is a superb example of a Q car. Good call sir2 litre turbo (Rover T-series engine, not Honda as some think!)
197bhp
0-60mph in 7.2s
Top speed 143mph
All in an innocuous 4 door saloon with a Rover badge, that looked like it was your grandad's car.
Now that's a Q-car!
aeropilot said:
Who said anything about outperforming a European sports car......
Perhaps you should re-read my post.
And additionally, why mention a sports car, which by definition can't be a Q-car, which is after all what we discussing.
The point of a Q car is it looks like lesser models but is as quick as a sports car. Perhaps you should re-read my post.
And additionally, why mention a sports car, which by definition can't be a Q-car, which is after all what we discussing.
Your post states the Yanks had been doing it for years, so name a quick Yank 4 door sedan from the 1960s.
I can't think of one. Just asking you to back up your post with an example, which is what everyone else is doing.
Edited by Jader1973 on Wednesday 1st April 23:33
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