Is the 911 still the sports car King?
Discussion
Not driven one yet and no doubt, it would be at least 10 times better than my Civic but it seems from what I have read in the motoring press and the opinion of other people that have driven it that the latest 911 has lost some of its edge and is not necessarily the "go to" driver's sports car/junior supercar with everyday useability any more. This seems like a shame, as it has always had a strong reputation as a driver's car and is probably the car that I have promised myself one day for the longest time. Porsche has pretty much had this market to itself for the majority of the last 50 years but now it has some seriously good competition for c.100k of your hard earned. Faster and more capable, yes and the availability of +2 seating is something that not many of its rivals offer and may be a clincher for some but my preference in a sports car would always be a manual transmission and it seems that the 911 is now geared up for PDK predominantly (I mean a 7-speed manual gearbox seems a bit unnecessary). So, if you were in the market for this type of vehicle, would you still buy the 911 or one of its rivals?
Porsche Cayman? I actually think the new one looks great and is arguably a better machine than the 911. I think of it now as a great model in its own right rather than a Boxster coupe/poor man's 911 and think I would probably have one in preference to a 911 now (especially a GTS/GT4). It's usefully cheaper than a 911 too.
Aston Martin Vantage? Getting old now but still looks stunning and sounds fantastic and possibly offers the involvement that the new 911 lacks?
Nissan GTR? Crushingly quick and capable, 4 seats and a comparative bargain but a bit uncouth maybe?
AMG GT? I have heard nothing but good things about this car. The first convincing Mercedes sports car for decades?
Audi R8? Does the everyday thing as well as/better than the 911 but with more power and AWD traction as standard. No manual option on the new one though. Boo!
Jaguar F-Type? The first serious Jaguar sports car since the E-Type?
BMW i8? A taste of tomorrow and makes a compelling case as an everyday car. 4 seats too?
Porsche Cayman? I actually think the new one looks great and is arguably a better machine than the 911. I think of it now as a great model in its own right rather than a Boxster coupe/poor man's 911 and think I would probably have one in preference to a 911 now (especially a GTS/GT4). It's usefully cheaper than a 911 too.
Aston Martin Vantage? Getting old now but still looks stunning and sounds fantastic and possibly offers the involvement that the new 911 lacks?
Nissan GTR? Crushingly quick and capable, 4 seats and a comparative bargain but a bit uncouth maybe?
AMG GT? I have heard nothing but good things about this car. The first convincing Mercedes sports car for decades?
Audi R8? Does the everyday thing as well as/better than the 911 but with more power and AWD traction as standard. No manual option on the new one though. Boo!
Jaguar F-Type? The first serious Jaguar sports car since the E-Type?
BMW i8? A taste of tomorrow and makes a compelling case as an everyday car. 4 seats too?
I thought the MX5 was the sports car king? Or an Elise.
If the 911 in question was a 996 he might even have a nicer cabin too.
white_goodman said:
Not driven one yet...
white_goodman said:
Provided the 911 is In the hands of someone who knows what they're doing, it would surprise me if any hot hatch could keep pace with it unless it was very wet/slippery in anything other than a straight line.
I've only driven a 996 C2. I wouldn't like to extrapolate much about other 911s from that experience. But if I had to I'd say that a determined man in a 2 litre Vectra could easily keep up with me in any 911 on a twisty country road.If the 911 in question was a 996 he might even have a nicer cabin too.
Just read this.
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2015/04/watch-a-c7-cor...
The old Z06 pissed all over most super and hypercars at the Nurburgring.
This one seems to continue that trend.
But...but.. it just isn't made in Europe.
So it must be w**k right?
http://gmauthority.com/blog/2015/04/watch-a-c7-cor...
The old Z06 pissed all over most super and hypercars at the Nurburgring.
This one seems to continue that trend.
But...but.. it just isn't made in Europe.
So it must be w**k right?
kambites said:
I don't think the 911 has really been a sports car at all for a few generations now, let alone the "king".
It is still the king of the vaguely affordable 2+2 sports/GT hybrid type thing, though.
True. The original 911 was certainly a sports car though. I don't think we could agree on the sports car King. Some people would say that the MX5 doesn't have enough power, Elises/Caterhams are too compromised etc. The 911 seems to have universal appeal and make even the non-petrolhead go a bit gooey.It is still the king of the vaguely affordable 2+2 sports/GT hybrid type thing, though.
Why do still think the 911 is King of its class and better than all the other cars that I suggested? Evo magazine, who have slavishly worshipped the 911 from day one, seem to have really turned on the latest one and I have yet to hear a glowing review on this forum.
white_goodman said:
Provided the 911 is In the hands of someone who knows what they're doing, it would surprise me if any hot hatch could keep pace with it unless it was very wet/slippery in anything other than a straight line.
Megane trophy r ring time 7.54.36Porsche 911 gt3 ring time 7.54.00
Ferrari f430 ring time 7.55.00
You might want to rethink that statement Tbh
loose cannon said:
white_goodman said:
Provided the 911 is In the hands of someone who knows what they're doing, it would surprise me if any hot hatch could keep pace with it unless it was very wet/slippery in anything other than a straight line.
Megane trophy r ring time 7.54.36Porsche 911 gt3 ring time 7.54.00
Ferrari f430 ring time 7.55.00
You might want to rethink that statement Tbh
C6 Corvette ZR1 ring time 7:19:63
Pagani Zonda F Clubsport 7:24:22
The 2015 Z06 is apparently much faster than the ZR1.... watch this space....
Captain Muppet said:
I've only driven a 996 C2. I wouldn't like to extrapolate much about other 911s from that experience. But if I had to I'd say that a determined man in a 2 litre Vectra could easily keep up with me in any 911 on a twisty country road.
If the 911 in question was a 996 he might even have a nicer cabin too.
You will be aware of this (I'm sure). You don't get into even a moderately grunty rear engined car and know how to drive it in one session. Even 996 generation (which others will say is too smooth, not raw enough, may as well be an audi and other subjective nonsense) is a totally different thing to drive hard in comparison to anything mid or front engined. I'm brought up on a combination of the others (plus fast bikes). The 911 takes a lot of learning compared to these other more common formats and thats part of the appeal (to me).If the 911 in question was a 996 he might even have a nicer cabin too.
loose cannon said:
Megane trophy r ring time 7.54.36
Porsche 911 gt3 ring time 7.54.00
Ferrari f430 ring time 7.55.00
You might want to rethink that statement Tbh
Wow. Nurburgring lap times achieved by highly skilled factory drivers! Hardly representative of average drivers on the road. And the Megane Trophy R is a bit more extreme than the Golf R/M135i/A45 mentioned by others. My experience sharing track time with hot hatches and 911s, is that some of the hot hatches that overtook me were very quick but looked like they were being driven completely on the edge, whereas the 911s looked so planted and didn't even look like they were trying (I was driving my WRX Wagon)!Porsche 911 gt3 ring time 7.54.00
Ferrari f430 ring time 7.55.00
You might want to rethink that statement Tbh
Anyway, I'm not sure how this developed into a 911 vs. fast hot hatch thread (re-reads OP)...
996 gt3 all the times are on the Nurburgring website
The fact remains a well driven modern hot hatch will not be trounced by a well driven 911
There was no statement on particular model 911
On the road you'd be spending more time rubbing Kurbs and cats eyes than pushing on in a new 911
The fact remains a well driven modern hot hatch will not be trounced by a well driven 911
There was no statement on particular model 911
On the road you'd be spending more time rubbing Kurbs and cats eyes than pushing on in a new 911
white_goodman said:
Wow. Nurburgring lap times achieved by highly skilled factory drivers! Hardly representative of average drivers on the road. And the Megane Trophy R is a bit more extreme than the Golf R/M135i/A45 mentioned by others. My experience sharing track time with hot hatches and 911s, is that some of the hot hatches that overtook me were very quick but looked like they were being driven completely on the edge, whereas the 911s looked so planted and didn't even look like they were trying (I was driving my WRX Wagon)!
Anyway, I'm not sure how this developed into a 911 vs. fast hot hatch thread (re-reads OP)...
You clearly stated a 911 would piss all over a hot hatch with a professional driver you doAnyway, I'm not sure how this developed into a 911 vs. fast hot hatch thread (re-reads OP)...
Remember what you posted right ?
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