RE: Lotus 3-Eleven - official!
Discussion
DonkeyApple said:
Earn a few hundred K a year net. Nice house with plenty of garages. Bored. Like cars. Looking for something that'll be fun, isn't cheap or old hat like a Caterham and will be great to drop out of the trailer and pass your mate's 918 or P1.
I'm guessing they only plan on selling a couple of hundred, if that, and I'm not sure that'll be an issue.
Thing is, i know that guy. He races a GT3. It'd monster that lotus on track by a gajillion miles.I'm guessing they only plan on selling a couple of hundred, if that, and I'm not sure that'll be an issue.
Why would "that guy" drive a 3-11 to Oulton instead of trailering a proper track car behind his Cayenne turbo?
Hilarious, only on ph.
All hail the Cayman with a detuned 911 engine which is universally declared outstanding value for money based on a theoretical base cost.
Lotus makes a white hot track day/race car (with a road legal version) with extreme, mind altering performance for the price of a high spec Cayman GT4 and ph is outraged!
For those in any doubt the 211, just like the Ariel Atom and Caterham 7 is laugh out loud hilarious on the road but best enjoyed on the track. You really won't have to trailer a 311 if you really don't want to. For those that want a roof it's simply a question of waiting for the Exige 400 or the Exige 450 Cup which sits perfectly in between the road car and the 311. Then there's the Evora 400 for those interested in mainly road use. Lotus have all the bases covered so why ever not offer an extreme track car, set some lap times and make some headlines?
All hail the Cayman with a detuned 911 engine which is universally declared outstanding value for money based on a theoretical base cost.
Lotus makes a white hot track day/race car (with a road legal version) with extreme, mind altering performance for the price of a high spec Cayman GT4 and ph is outraged!
For those in any doubt the 211, just like the Ariel Atom and Caterham 7 is laugh out loud hilarious on the road but best enjoyed on the track. You really won't have to trailer a 311 if you really don't want to. For those that want a roof it's simply a question of waiting for the Exige 400 or the Exige 450 Cup which sits perfectly in between the road car and the 311. Then there's the Evora 400 for those interested in mainly road use. Lotus have all the bases covered so why ever not offer an extreme track car, set some lap times and make some headlines?
I'm sadly not in the company of the kind of people who buy things like this. But I would imagine this mixes the best of the worlds of radical/kit cars and production cars. Namely it's astonishingly fast and enjoyable to drive, feels like a racecar, etc... but also comes with a manufacturers warranty and if it breaks/gets broken you know you're going to get parts for "off the shelf" so to speak.
I'm displaying my ignorance and am sure there similar methods of people who've dented their porsche on track finding new panels, etc, but might the ownership costs of something like this not be lower than full-blown exotica? Plus with only 311 made, it's hardly going to bomb in value.
I'm displaying my ignorance and am sure there similar methods of people who've dented their porsche on track finding new panels, etc, but might the ownership costs of something like this not be lower than full-blown exotica? Plus with only 311 made, it's hardly going to bomb in value.
Some Gump said:
DonkeyApple said:
Earn a few hundred K a year net. Nice house with plenty of garages. Bored. Like cars. Looking for something that'll be fun, isn't cheap or old hat like a Caterham and will be great to drop out of the trailer and pass your mate's 918 or P1.
I'm guessing they only plan on selling a couple of hundred, if that, and I'm not sure that'll be an issue.
Thing is, i know that guy. He races a GT3. It'd monster that lotus on track by a gajillion miles.I'm guessing they only plan on selling a couple of hundred, if that, and I'm not sure that'll be an issue.
Why would "that guy" drive a 3-11 to Oulton instead of trailering a proper track car behind his Cayenne turbo?
This is not that much more than a Caterham 620R/Atom 3R but I think it will be a lot more complete. Lotus are on a roll - stunning machine IMO
Regarding the price of the 'race' 311 -the Xtrac paddleshift sequential box is £25k on its own. The current heavier (1040kg) Exige Cup R with 360bhp, no chargecooler and the same gearbox is £90-something grand.
As many will know a 991 GT3 Cup car is something like £160k +VAT and that offers 460bhp (less than the road going GT3) 8500rpm (less than the road going GT3), 1200kg.
A sub-900kg, 450bhp track car is not going to get monstered by a GT3 Cup car and starts to look pretty reasonable at £115k.
As many will know a 991 GT3 Cup car is something like £160k +VAT and that offers 460bhp (less than the road going GT3) 8500rpm (less than the road going GT3), 1200kg.
A sub-900kg, 450bhp track car is not going to get monstered by a GT3 Cup car and starts to look pretty reasonable at £115k.
Some Gump said:
DonkeyApple said:
Earn a few hundred K a year net. Nice house with plenty of garages. Bored. Like cars. Looking for something that'll be fun, isn't cheap or old hat like a Caterham and will be great to drop out of the trailer and pass your mate's 918 or P1.
I'm guessing they only plan on selling a couple of hundred, if that, and I'm not sure that'll be an issue.
Thing is, i know that guy. He races a GT3. It'd monster that lotus on track by a gajillion miles.I'm guessing they only plan on selling a couple of hundred, if that, and I'm not sure that'll be an issue.
Why would "that guy" drive a 3-11 to Oulton instead of trailering a proper track car behind his Cayenne turbo?
Lol. GT3cup "mid level Porsche"?
I'm not aiming to troll. However, i can assure you all that a race prepped car and a fast road / slow track car are 2 totally different animals. The lotus on road tyres has no chance against a slicked car; whip slicks on it and it'll be so far from it's performance window that it's daft. There's no upside in a car that is this "mildly extreme" imo.
I'm not sayng that it's a bad car. What i am questioning is. "What is it's target market"? If the answer is "winner of the track day" then that is fair enough and sad in equal measures. Most elise / exige owners i know don't think of track days that way, and the one that did got bored and decided to win the british sprint championship in his 'S1 instead.
I'm not aiming to troll. However, i can assure you all that a race prepped car and a fast road / slow track car are 2 totally different animals. The lotus on road tyres has no chance against a slicked car; whip slicks on it and it'll be so far from it's performance window that it's daft. There's no upside in a car that is this "mildly extreme" imo.
I'm not sayng that it's a bad car. What i am questioning is. "What is it's target market"? If the answer is "winner of the track day" then that is fair enough and sad in equal measures. Most elise / exige owners i know don't think of track days that way, and the one that did got bored and decided to win the british sprint championship in his 'S1 instead.
Some Gump said:
Lol. GT3cup "mid level Porsche"?
I'm not aiming to troll. However, i can assure you all that a race prepped car and a fast road / slow track car are 2 totally different animals. The lotus on road tyres has no chance against a slicked car; whip slicks on it and it'll be so far from it's performance window that it's daft. There's no upside in a car that is this "mildly extreme" imo.
I'm not sayng that it's a bad car. What i am questioning is. "What is it's target market"? If the answer is "winner of the track day" then that is fair enough and sad in equal measures. Most elise / exige owners i know don't think of track days that way, and the one that did got bored and decided to win the british sprint championship in his 'S1 instead.
Not sure what you are getting at - why is the next step up racing (which inevitably costs way too much). Plenty of people want a hardcore road and track car (I think Caterham, BAC and Aerial are doing pretty well for themselves).I'm not aiming to troll. However, i can assure you all that a race prepped car and a fast road / slow track car are 2 totally different animals. The lotus on road tyres has no chance against a slicked car; whip slicks on it and it'll be so far from it's performance window that it's daft. There's no upside in a car that is this "mildly extreme" imo.
I'm not sayng that it's a bad car. What i am questioning is. "What is it's target market"? If the answer is "winner of the track day" then that is fair enough and sad in equal measures. Most elise / exige owners i know don't think of track days that way, and the one that did got bored and decided to win the british sprint championship in his 'S1 instead.
Why would I want a slick shod racing car to trailer to a track? For the type of driving I do, it seems a bit of waste.
Some Gump said:
Lol. GT3cup "mid level Porsche"?
I'm not aiming to troll. However, i can assure you all that a race prepped car and a fast road / slow track car are 2 totally different animals. The lotus on road tyres has no chance against a slicked car; whip slicks on it and it'll be so far from it's performance window that it's daft. There's no upside in a car that is this "mildly extreme" imo.
I'm not sayng that it's a bad car. What i am questioning is. "What is it's target market"? If the answer is "winner of the track day" then that is fair enough and sad in equal measures. Most elise / exige owners i know don't think of track days that way, and the one that did got bored and decided to win the british sprint championship in his 'S1 instead.
I don't think I understand. Are Porsche's the only car anyone wants and the only ones allowed to run slicks?I'm not aiming to troll. However, i can assure you all that a race prepped car and a fast road / slow track car are 2 totally different animals. The lotus on road tyres has no chance against a slicked car; whip slicks on it and it'll be so far from it's performance window that it's daft. There's no upside in a car that is this "mildly extreme" imo.
I'm not sayng that it's a bad car. What i am questioning is. "What is it's target market"? If the answer is "winner of the track day" then that is fair enough and sad in equal measures. Most elise / exige owners i know don't think of track days that way, and the one that did got bored and decided to win the british sprint championship in his 'S1 instead.
This car is a toy and it'll be bought just like any toy. It'll be used until the next toy comes along and then chopped for that. It's just for fun. Everyone's seen or owned a Porsche at this point so it's not as if turning up with a GT3 is going to excite anyone all that much? I don't see what the issue is with that?
The Pits said:
Hilarious, only on ph.
All hail the Cayman with a detuned 911 engine which is universally declared outstanding value for money based on a theoretical base cost.
Lotus makes a white hot track day/race car (with a road legal version) with extreme, mind altering performance for the price of a high spec Cayman GT4 and ph is outraged!
For those in any doubt the 211, just like the Ariel Atom and Caterham 7 is laugh out loud hilarious on the road but best enjoyed on the track. You really won't have to trailer a 311 if you really don't want to. For those that want a roof it's simply a question of waiting for the Exige 400 or the Exige 450 Cup which sits perfectly in between the road car and the 311. Then there's the Evora 400 for those interested in mainly road use. Lotus have all the bases covered so why ever not offer an extreme track car, set some lap times and make some headlines?
All hail the Cayman with a detuned 911 engine which is universally declared outstanding value for money based on a theoretical base cost.
Lotus makes a white hot track day/race car (with a road legal version) with extreme, mind altering performance for the price of a high spec Cayman GT4 and ph is outraged!
For those in any doubt the 211, just like the Ariel Atom and Caterham 7 is laugh out loud hilarious on the road but best enjoyed on the track. You really won't have to trailer a 311 if you really don't want to. For those that want a roof it's simply a question of waiting for the Exige 400 or the Exige 450 Cup which sits perfectly in between the road car and the 311. Then there's the Evora 400 for those interested in mainly road use. Lotus have all the bases covered so why ever not offer an extreme track car, set some lap times and make some headlines?
I completely agree. Lotus do a car to suit all tastes, provided that you like driving. The Evora, Exige and Elise are the best cars of their type I've ever driven - they really are utterly superb. As you know, I drive my 2-Eleven to track days and back and my car's done 21,000 happy miles now. I'm actually selling it to return to racing, but in my three years of track days I've met lots of potential 3-Eleven customers, and I haven't even done an RMA day yet! Lotus need a halo car to show how they can take on a P1 for a tenth of the price, and good luck to them, I think JMG is doing the company a lot of good.At least Lotus are giving their cars some proper performance at last, the uprated 400 + hp V6 range of Evora/Exige and this look good (don't like the styling on this much though, but then again did not like the last one much either...)
Now they need to bolt a SC onto the 1.6 and up the power on the 1.8
Now they need to bolt a SC onto the 1.6 and up the power on the 1.8
peter450 said:
At least Lotus are giving their cars some proper performance at last, the uprated 400 + hp V6 range of Evora/Exige and this look good (don't like the styling on this much though, but then again did not like the last one much either...)
Now they need to bolt a SC onto the 1.6 and up the power on the 1.8
From what Gales has been saying recently, I think he has realised that although low weight gives you loads of good stuff, the thing it gives you that sells cars is acceleration. Now they need to bolt a SC onto the 1.6 and up the power on the 1.8
Whatever else Lotus may be doing, they need to get someone who can make a car look less ugly - that whole front-end look isn't working on ANY of the cars they've slapped-it-onto.
The current Exige has awful proportions, looks like it's too-far-from-the-ground - and that shares the whole stance/raised eyebrows/bulgy eye nonsense.
The current Exige has awful proportions, looks like it's too-far-from-the-ground - and that shares the whole stance/raised eyebrows/bulgy eye nonsense.
Varn said:
I completely understand why Lotus have done it, but what sort of person wants TC on a 3-11?
Y'know I have a horrible feeling that TC in some guise is with us forever now - the desire for 'more performance', the need for 'bigger power numbers' and the limits of tyres/suspension etc. mean that I think we'll just see it evolve into something we expect (in the way we've had to accept feel-free steering, diminishing manual boxes, front-wheel-drive and turbos over raw displacement)Ferrari are marketting the 488GTB on it's clever slip-angle control - you simply let it know how much fun you want to have and it'll keep you inside that. The other word for that is 'traction control'.
Porsche have rear-wheel-steer on many of their flagship cars now - another 'driving aid' to promote traction (traction control)
Everyone seems awfully excited about 'torque vectoring' - traction maximisation (traction control)
and so on...
I seem to recall from some reviews a while back of either the Exile or Evora that the TC software Lotus have developed is very light touch and considered excellent.
I think having it is no bad thing. If it means you can go out and enjoy the car in damp conditions on the road and have a safety net it's all good, as long as on a dry trackday you can turn it all off completely.
On this car specifically I think it's a clever addition. There are probably a few people with the money for one of these but feel they lack the skills to enjoy it on a trackway because of a fear of binning it. Being able to buy something like this with TC means these people can give their money to Lotus with a warm cosy feeling they can go out and drive it harder and faster than they could say a Caterham.
I think having it is no bad thing. If it means you can go out and enjoy the car in damp conditions on the road and have a safety net it's all good, as long as on a dry trackday you can turn it all off completely.
On this car specifically I think it's a clever addition. There are probably a few people with the money for one of these but feel they lack the skills to enjoy it on a trackway because of a fear of binning it. Being able to buy something like this with TC means these people can give their money to Lotus with a warm cosy feeling they can go out and drive it harder and faster than they could say a Caterham.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff