RE: Lotus 3-Eleven - official!

[RobM77]

I like him. He seems like a decent honest and approachable guy.

[otolith]

He seems like the sort of man the last incumbent should have been answerable to.

[andy_s]

otolith said:

He seems like the sort of man the last incumbent should have been answerable to.

Good take on it - I concur!

[RoverP6B]

otolith said:

Yes, compared to things that should be and are cheaper, it is expensive. Pointless comparison is pointless.

Why should an Ultima be cheaper than the 3-11 if it's as quick (if not more so)? I'd have thought an LS7-engined Ultima would be about the fastest thing on track short of an LMP2.

[otolith]

RoverP6B said:

Why should an Ultima be cheaper than the 3-11 if it's as quick (if not more so)? I'd have thought an LS7-engined Ultima would be about the fastest thing on track short of an LMP2.

Because it's a spaceframe kit car, with a base price not that far off the 3-11's for a turnkey solution?

[wemorgan]

Normally the RRP is proportional to the R&D and manufacturing costs. In that respect the 3-Eleven is what it is. If someone thinks an Ultima/Caterham is better value so be it, but don't think you're buying a car that's had more R&D and higher quality manufacturing spent on it, because I doubt it very much.

[Kolbenkopp]

ESOG said:

LOL yes mr CEO i-forgot-his-name, you look very excited. LOL

Not everybody is born to be an entertainer. Honestly prefer that to the usual empty hyperbole (US tech stuff "keynotes" seem to be the most cringe worthy)...

[ESOG]

Kolbenkopp said:

Not everybody is born to be an entertainer. Honestly prefer that to the usual empty hyperbole (US tech stuff "keynotes" seem to be the most cringe worthy)...

No, i understand, truly i get it. I was just saying he could have showed a bit more enthusiasm and adlib, not come off so obviously reading verbatim what some Lotus PR employee wrote down for him.

[zebra]

ESOG said:

Kolbenkopp said:

Not everybody is born to be an entertainer. Honestly prefer that to the usual empty hyperbole (US tech stuff "keynotes" seem to be the most cringe worthy)...

No, i understand, truly i get it. I was just saying he could have showed a bit more enthusiasm and adlib, not come off so obviously reading verbatim what some Lotus PR employee wrote down for him.

I'd rather Lotus were making the right saleable profit and letting the cars speak for themselves. Ok, JMG is not the best in front of a camera but he seems to be making the right choices for Lotus so good luck to him. Thank god he's not Bahar or any of the 'lifestyle' characters that he drummed up to help.

That 311 is the star there. The best publicity would have been to bring it out of the box followed up with a run up the hill like they did with the Evora GTE.

[glazbagun]

ESOG said:

No, i understand, truly i get it. I was just saying he could have showed a bit more enthusiasm and adlib, not come off so obviously reading verbatim what some Lotus PR employee wrote down for him.

I think it might matter more with a mainstream car (say the F-Type) to appeal to the masses on a big budget launch. But I'd imagine that the people interested in the 3-11 (especially those at Goodwood watching it, literally, roll out of a crate) will know who Lotus are, maybe even know who Gales is, and won't really need to be "sold" the car as such.

[Tuna]

glazbagun said:

ESOG said:

No, i understand, truly i get it. I was just saying he could have showed a bit more enthusiasm and adlib, not come off so obviously reading verbatim what some Lotus PR employee wrote down for him.

I think it might matter more with a mainstream car (say the F-Type) to appeal to the masses on a big budget launch. But I'd imagine that the people interested in the 3-11 (especially those at Goodwood watching it, literally, roll out of a crate) will know who Lotus are, maybe even know who Gales is, and won't really need to be "sold" the car as such.

After Bahar, the slightest wiff of BS in a Lotus presentation will cause the hounds to be unleashed.

[RoverP6B]

otolith said:

Because it's a spaceframe kit car, with a base price not that far off the 3-11's for a turnkey solution?

Right... so is there a turnkey option for the Ultima as there is for e.g. Caterham?

[otolith]

RoverP6B said:

Right... so is there a turnkey option for the Ultima as there is for e.g. Caterham?

Yes.

http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/Evo/Convertible



~ 66k entry price vs 82k entry level price for the Lotus. So 16k difference. Worth it for an extruded aluminium chassis, setup by Lotus, some modern technology? Maybe. Depends on your priorities, really.

[blueg33]

otolith said:

RoverP6B said:

Right... so is there a turnkey option for the Ultima as there is for e.g. Caterham?

Yes.

http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/Evo/Convertible



~ 66k entry price vs 82k entry level price for the Lotus. So 16k difference. Worth it for an extruded aluminium chassis, setup by Lotus, some modern technology? Maybe. Depends on your priorities, really.

Don't know where Ultima buy their BMW's but they are being ripped off. List on a 335i is £42,365 with the sport auto box

[otolith]

blueg33 said:

Don't know where Ultima buy their BMW's but they are being ripped off. List on a 335i is £42,365 with the sport auto box

I think they're saying you can have one for that sort of money if you build it yourself.

[BBS-LM]

Just been looking at some video of this car at the Ring, what a Fantastic sound this car makes, looks like it can go like a rocket to boot. Much want with this one.

[RobM77]

otolith said:

RoverP6B said:

Right... so is there a turnkey option for the Ultima as there is for e.g. Caterham?

Yes.

http://www.ultimasports.co.uk/Evo/Convertible



~ 66k entry price vs 82k entry level price for the Lotus. So 16k difference. Worth it for an extruded aluminium chassis, setup by Lotus, some modern technology? Maybe. Depends on your priorities, really.

Good points. Don't forget the weight distribution of course. I adore Lotuses for the way they drive, but their Achilles heel is that high mounted transverse engine. The Ultima has the engine and gearbox in the right place. I'd probably still go for the Lotus though for the reasons you list.

[blueg33]

I wouldn't call the high mounted engine an Achilles heel. Its not quite ideal but most modern lotus cars handle better than almost anything that is comparable in terms of price, intended audience etc

[RobM77]

blueg33 said:

I wouldn't call the high mounted engine an Achilles heel. Its not quite ideal but most modern lotus cars handle better than almost anything that is comparable in terms of price, intended audience etc

Yeah, 'Achilles Heel' was probably too strong a term, but in otherwise perfect cars it does stand out, so I used it as a relative term. On the whole Lotuses are utterly fantastic to drive and the two I've owned (Elise 8 years, 2-Eleven 3 years) have been the best road cars I've owned with no shadow of a doubt. The rearward weight distribution is a definite feature though, both in the driving style required and in tyre temperatures and wear. I think it's true to say that they handle well despite this drawback.