RE: Lotus 3-Eleven - official!

[otolith]

Video from Goodwood;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0snKeZW3qgI

[Fantuzzi]

Looks cool from the rear, mainly thanks to the wing hanging over the back, but not a great fan of the s3 front end, not aggressive enough for my tastes - the 2 eleven looked a little meaner at the front end. Top end is impressive in a car of this sort, although being 925dry for the road version is less impressive (the 211 was 670kerb in 'gt4' trim, 745 for road I believe). Not overly impressed for with that figure, wet maybe, but dry isn't great. Yeah Its cheaper than the stripped out supercar lot, but you get a lot, lot less, at least with a 500kg mono or caterham you are right at the extreme in terms of lightness. Big power in a track day car is an idea long overdue from a more 'mainstream' name. Will the race version be GT3 eligible? power looks a little high for gt4.

Interesting to see some 0-200kph figures compared to the lighter yet less powerful Mono. But overall not impressed, bit much, bit heavy, doesn't look that great.

Edited by Fantuzzi on Friday 26th June 16:09

EDIT, 2 11 Road trim was 745 kerb.

Edited by Fantuzzi on Friday 26th June 16:23

[seefarr]

otolith said:

seefarr said:

Why is it 200kg more than the 2-Eleven though?

3.5 litre V6 instead of 1.8 four pot.

That accounts for 50kg (115kg vs 163kg). What about the rest, especially with the "40 per cent lighter" body.

Does look cool though!

[benters]

Blimey. . . .that looks amazing. Regardless of what gets said about comparisons between sevens, Alfas, Elise and the like, that looks to be the Daddy to me.

[wemorgan]

seefarr said:

That accounts for 50kg (115kg vs 163kg). What about the rest, especially with the "40 per cent lighter" body.

Does look cool though!

AFAIK the chassis needed to be larger to take the engine, then with the extra mass of both engine and chassis additional reinforcements were probably required. Adding mass usually has a compound effect.

40% lighter body - I read that as A-surface panels, rather than structural parts. 40% lighter chassis would only come from using composites which the 3-eleven doesn't use from what I read.

[Vee12V]

seefarr said:

otolith said:

seefarr said:

Why is it 200kg more than the 2-Eleven though?

3.5 litre V6 instead of 1.8 four pot.

That accounts for 50kg (115kg vs 163kg). What about the rest, especially with the "40 per cent lighter" body.

Does look cool though!

LSD, bigger brakes, wheels, tyres, etc

[Fantuzzi]

Vee12V said:

seefarr said:

otolith said:

seefarr said:

Why is it 200kg more than the 2-Eleven though?

3.5 litre V6 instead of 1.8 four pot.

That accounts for 50kg (115kg vs 163kg). What about the rest, especially with the "40 per cent lighter" body.

Does look cool though!

LSD, bigger brakes, wheels, tyres, etc

The 2 elven was 670 dry, the 3 925, so 255 increase in dry weight. Does seem a lot even with the v6 and the stuff that goes with a v6 and 450+ bhp. Is it for US safety regs?

[wemorgan]

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motor-shows-good...

"Gales intends recording an early Nürburgring lap time, confident that his car will be “not far away” from the sub-7min time posted by Porsche’s £1 million 918 Spyder"

"The car has a bonded and riveted aluminium monocoque tub chassis reminiscent of other Lotus models’ but “massively strengthened” for this new application. The Road model’s rollcage incorporates extra side impact bars, and the Race cage has additional bars to meet FIA international race regulations."

"The company expects to take about two years to build the planned batch of 311 cars, selling them both through dealers and from its Racing department. Deliveries will begin next April."

[RobM77]

Fantuzzi said:

Vee12V said:

seefarr said:

otolith said:

seefarr said:

Why is it 200kg more than the 2-Eleven though?

3.5 litre V6 instead of 1.8 four pot.

That accounts for 50kg (115kg vs 163kg). What about the rest, especially with the "40 per cent lighter" body.

Does look cool though!

LSD, bigger brakes, wheels, tyres, etc

The 2 elven was 670 dry, the 3 925, so 255 increase in dry weight. Does seem a lot even with the v6 and the stuff that goes with a v6 and 450+ bhp. Is it for US safety regs?

The tub and subframe are quite different now, that's some of the weight.

[gofasterrosssco]

seefarr said:

otolith said:

seefarr said:

Why is it 200kg more than the 2-Eleven though?

3.5 litre V6 instead of 1.8 four pot.

That accounts for 50kg (115kg vs 163kg). What about the rest, especially with the "40 per cent lighter" body.

Does look cool though!

The standard 3.5 V6 comes in at ~163kg. Add a supercharger and chargecooling system (with radiator / piping, pump, coolant etc.) and you can safely add 30-40kg

Plus the Toyota 1.8 comes attached to a light duty 6-speed g'box found in small Toyota's, where as this comes with a much stronger 6-speed found in bigger diesel saloons and stuff, so add another 10-15kg minimum.

So the whole drivetrain probably accounts for ~100kg of the increase. Then add your bigger wheels, suspension, chassis changes etc.


Ps. Typical PH - company fabled for producing genuinely special sportcars releases a nutcase, bedroom wall / screen-saver worthy special edition, and all we get is bafflement and consternation that its not a radical redesign from the ground up (on a chassis concept originally designed to be modular), and that it isn't £4.67..

Edited by gofasterrosssco on Friday 26th June 17:14

[redroadster]

Only thing I would like to add is could they make a hardtop version ? gullwing doors to help get in would be handy and not add too much weight, price for performance looks fair value coming to a race track near you to show up a few super cars !

[otolith]

seefarr said:

otolith said:

seefarr said:

Why is it 200kg more than the 2-Eleven though?

3.5 litre V6 instead of 1.8 four pot.

That accounts for 50kg (115kg vs 163kg). What about the rest, especially with the "40 per cent lighter" body.

Does look cool though!

There's a larger subframe, wider track, more bodywork. The 2-11 rolled on 195/50/16 front and 225/45/17 rears. The 3-11 is 225/40/18 and 275/35/19. The 2-11 had 288mm brakes, the 3-11 has 332mm. There's a different (and presumably beefier) transmission. Once you start adding weight and power, it snowballs.

I think the same lighter body material was used for the 2-11.

[stephen300o]

Equite an odd car, just another enormously fast track day car. Maybe lotus should only work with others to sprinkle some sport in their brand.

[ravon]

I think what you have all missed is that this car is a Radical competitor, and as a track machine I'd guess it falls somewhat short .

[unsprung]

Dick Seaman said:

unsprung said:

Laugh-out-loud prices. As usual. At £115000, the Race is exactly the same price as the average US home.

Thanks, that's as relevant as posting the average US home lap time.

DonkeyApple said:

unsprung said:

Laugh-out-loud prices. As usual. At £115000, the Race is exactly the same price as the average US home.

So much creativity, know-how and that little bit of whimsy in the UK. So little access.

Cheaper than a garage in my street. It's clearly a bargain.

There's too little access in Blighty.

I'm happy for Lotus to continuing trading if this means that they must focus on a select customer. However, the disproportionate number of UK product announcements that risk that old bromide, rip-off Britain, is tiring.

Even TVR, in its pending relaunch, now seeks to go upmarket.

The announcement of things like a £33,000 V8 Mustang -- UK homologation, OEM warranty and RHD -- put this topic on the spot.

[otolith]

ravon said:

I think what you have all missed is that this car is a Radical competitor, and as a track machine I'd guess it falls somewhat short .

On what basis?

[SidewaysSi]

unsprung said:

Dick Seaman said:

unsprung said:

Laugh-out-loud prices. As usual. At £115000, the Race is exactly the same price as the average US home.

Thanks, that's as relevant as posting the average US home lap time.

DonkeyApple said:

unsprung said:

Laugh-out-loud prices. As usual. At £115000, the Race is exactly the same price as the average US home.

So much creativity, know-how and that little bit of whimsy in the UK. So little access.

Cheaper than a garage in my street. It's clearly a bargain.

There's too little access in Blighty.

I'm happy for Lotus to continuing trading if this means that they must focus on a select customer. However, the disproportionate number of UK product announcements that risk that old bromide, rip-off Britain, is tiring.

Even TVR, in its pending relaunch, now seeks to go upmarket.

The announcement of things like a £33,000 V8 Mustang -- UK homologation, OEM warranty and RHD -- put this topic on the spot.

Not entirely sure you can compare a Mustang to a 3-11.

[otolith]

The Mustang is almost completely irrelevant to the UK car industry, the only people it puts on the spot are the Germans.

[unsprung]

I offer no contest of vehicles, eg: Lotus and Ford. My question is about value for money.

Given the extraordinary talent in Britain, as well as a tradition of individualism that is a marked contrast to Continental cultures, it is not unreasonable to question the cavalcade of high-priced cars that are regularly announced and put on sale. As well as the slight whiff of class consciousness that surrounds many of these.

One would be forgiven for misunderstanding that the UK ends at the home counties.

[SidewaysSi]

Why should a car be cheap and appeal to the masses? Plenty of manufacturers do very well with premium priced cars. And yes, I cannot afford a 3-11.

Besides, I think the 3-11 is a bargain.