Cars you wish they'd make or had made?
Discussion
An E92 M3 CSL. Like the former CSL, a normal M3 turned up to 11. 100kgs lighter, a bit more power (20-30bhp), some trick suspension and a carbon airbox + titanium exhaust combo to really let that V8 sing. £20k over a normal M3 and you have another instant cult classic on your hands. I know they made the GTS but that was too expensive and too hardcore with no rear seats etc.
Agree with other posters about offering AMG's with a proper manual gearbox, their potential as proper M3\M5 beaters is always held back by the lazy slushboxes they were fitted with.
A modern NSX and no I'm not talking about that car they have been touting as the NSX replacement for the last few years, I am talking about a proper light weight, mid-engined rwd replacement, do whatever you can to make a 3.2 Vtec NA engine with a 9000rpm limit emissions compliant. Perhaps stick a very small hybrid power plant in it if you must but don't load it down with batteries\weight, just give it enough electric range to game the EU figures and give it a bit more low down torque but let the NA engine do all the real work.
A return of affordable Japanese performance cars, things like the Supra, Silvia, Celica, FTO, Impreza, Evo, MR2 etc. £30-£50k but with handling and performance that can embarrass cars twice the price like they used to. The GT-R was an excellent return to form but it's now too expensive approaching £80k, we need more like it but at lower price points. Don't mind if they are turbocharged but just make the engines characterful rather than the dull VAG diesel-alike power plants that seem to be suffocating the market presently.
Agree with other posters about offering AMG's with a proper manual gearbox, their potential as proper M3\M5 beaters is always held back by the lazy slushboxes they were fitted with.
A modern NSX and no I'm not talking about that car they have been touting as the NSX replacement for the last few years, I am talking about a proper light weight, mid-engined rwd replacement, do whatever you can to make a 3.2 Vtec NA engine with a 9000rpm limit emissions compliant. Perhaps stick a very small hybrid power plant in it if you must but don't load it down with batteries\weight, just give it enough electric range to game the EU figures and give it a bit more low down torque but let the NA engine do all the real work.
A return of affordable Japanese performance cars, things like the Supra, Silvia, Celica, FTO, Impreza, Evo, MR2 etc. £30-£50k but with handling and performance that can embarrass cars twice the price like they used to. The GT-R was an excellent return to form but it's now too expensive approaching £80k, we need more like it but at lower price points. Don't mind if they are turbocharged but just make the engines characterful rather than the dull VAG diesel-alike power plants that seem to be suffocating the market presently.
How about a rear drive saloon based on the GT86? 
Give it more rear room, a tow bar and roof bars and bingo - my ideal daily driver!
I can never quite work out Japanese car companies. One minute they say they're not interested in performance cars any more (such as the sad day they announced the end of the MR2), and then the next thing they're bringing out a performance car (the GT86), or even a halo car supercar (LFA).
Give it more rear room, a tow bar and roof bars and bingo - my ideal daily driver!I can never quite work out Japanese car companies. One minute they say they're not interested in performance cars any more (such as the sad day they announced the end of the MR2), and then the next thing they're bringing out a performance car (the GT86), or even a halo car supercar (LFA).
.RobM77 said:
How about a rear drive saloon based on the GT86? Give it more rear room, a tow bar and roof bars and bingo - my ideal daily driver!
I can never quite work out Japanese car companies. One minute they say they're not interested in performance cars any more (such as the sad day they announced the end of the MR2), and then the next thing they're bringing out a performance car (the GT86), or even a halo car supercar (LFA).
It wouldn't work. Let's say it adds 200kg with the heavier bodywork, slightly extended wheelbase, seats and extra safety stuff. Then add bigger brakes and wheels to cope with the added weight. Give it more rear room, a tow bar and roof bars and bingo - my ideal daily driver!I can never quite work out Japanese car companies. One minute they say they're not interested in performance cars any more (such as the sad day they announced the end of the MR2), and then the next thing they're bringing out a performance car (the GT86), or even a halo car supercar (LFA).
Do all that and you have a car that would be seriously underpowered at low to medium revs. What then? You turbocharge or supercharge that 4 cyl engine. So it's ruined!
The GT86 is on a tightrope, as I understand it. Any heavier and it would need more power and you then get into the vicious cycle of power and weight and grip/braking.
I might be wrong, but there seem to be sweet spots at around 1100kg, 1400kg and 1700kg - once you tip over 1100 you usually end up at 1400 and so on. Obviously there are cars that tell the lie of this - the Golf, for example, but the principle is right.
ORD said:
RobM77 said:
How about a rear drive saloon based on the GT86? Give it more rear room, a tow bar and roof bars and bingo - my ideal daily driver!
I can never quite work out Japanese car companies. One minute they say they're not interested in performance cars any more (such as the sad day they announced the end of the MR2), and then the next thing they're bringing out a performance car (the GT86), or even a halo car supercar (LFA).
It wouldn't work. Let's say it adds 200kg with the heavier bodywork, slightly extended wheelbase, seats and extra safety stuff. Then add bigger brakes and wheels to cope with the added weight. Give it more rear room, a tow bar and roof bars and bingo - my ideal daily driver!I can never quite work out Japanese car companies. One minute they say they're not interested in performance cars any more (such as the sad day they announced the end of the MR2), and then the next thing they're bringing out a performance car (the GT86), or even a halo car supercar (LFA).
Do all that and you have a car that would be seriously underpowered at low to medium revs. What then? You turbocharge or supercharge that 4 cyl engine. So it's ruined!
The GT86 is on a tightrope, as I understand it. Any heavier and it would need more power and you then get into the vicious cycle of power and weight and grip/braking.
I might be wrong, but there seem to be sweet spots at around 1100kg, 1400kg and 1700kg - once you tip over 1100 you usually end up at 1400 and so on. Obviously there are cars that tell the lie of this - the Golf, for example, but the principle is right.
Although 200bhp and 1400kg would be fine for me if I just used it on the road (cue 20 page argument telling me I'm wrong! 
).chris7676 said:
MR2 mk4 with the same engine as GT86, similarly good styling and around 1000kg.
Please!
The engine in the GT86 is rubbish and I'm not talking about power, it's just not characterful enough. Get Yamaha to work their magic on it like they did with the BEAMS engined MR2's and it might work.Please!
Mid engined, RWD, compact dimensions, manual and a free revving 250bhp-ish NA engine and I'm right there with you. Give it a targa top too and you'd have to fight me for it.
In fact it sounds like a Japanese competitor to the Lotus Elise except better built, with a more characterful engine and cheaper.
glazbagun said:
I always thought an Elise V6 would be pretty cool but they've already made that with the new Exige.
There is a convertible Exige V6 now (the convertible version of the coupé version of the Elise), which I have to say makes as much sense as a Porsche Cayman convertible. RobM77 said:
All good points Although 200bhp and 1400kg would be fine for me if I just used it on the road (cue 20 page argument telling me I'm wrong! ).
You should be the new Captain Slow on Top Gear. I am always saying that many sports cars are too fast to be used enjoyably on the road, and I am always advocating lower p/w ratios and a focus on keeping weight down rather than increasing power...BUT even I would say that 200bhp/1400kg is too low for a NA petrol 4-cyl engine in a "sporty" car. A family hack, sure, but then you might want it TC just for ease of use. Revving the nuts of a 4 cyl engine isnt much fun. Although 200bhp and 1400kg would be fine for me if I just used it on the road (cue 20 page argument telling me I'm wrong! ).glazbagun said:
I always thought an Elise V6 would be pretty cool but they've already made that with the new Exige.
Yes but the Exige V6 has moved "upmarket" and is therefore too expensive now. I think there is room for a slightly more powerful, more practical Elise type car. A new MR2 could do it as the Japanese could introduce the economies of scale to make a £30k Elise competitor.chris7676 said:
MR2 mk4 with the same engine as GT86, similarly good styling and around 1000kg.
Please!
Which, I think, would make it the first ever mid engined japanese road car (not counting the Nissan R390!) to have a longitudinally mounted engine and gearbox. It might make for some packaging issues in a car the size of a MR2!Please!
There are so many, but the first is a car that was made, just never sold in the UK.
1) Ford Sierra XR8.
2) Capri with either the 2.9 Cosworth V6 from the Scorpio (which I believe has been done) or the Cosworth turbo out of the Sierra (probably also been done).
3) Manual gearboxes in Sporting Jags (like 3 litre XE and all F-types) and AMG Mercs.
4) Keep N/A straight 6 petrols in BMWs (very biased as I have a couple)!
5) Replacement models for all the good Japanese sports cars, like Silvia Turbo, Supra, etc.
6) An RWD quick hatch a bit smaller than Focus/Golf size, kind of a modern MKII Escort.
7) A new Z4 with a Coupe model so it has a proper roof! (And no 4-pots or turbos)!
8) That Lancia concept car, especially if it had updated Integrale-type running gear!
There are probably more, but on a high note at least there is now one that they have made after 50+ years production, RHD V8 Mustang with a manual 6 speed! Thank you Ford!
1) Ford Sierra XR8.
2) Capri with either the 2.9 Cosworth V6 from the Scorpio (which I believe has been done) or the Cosworth turbo out of the Sierra (probably also been done).
3) Manual gearboxes in Sporting Jags (like 3 litre XE and all F-types) and AMG Mercs.
4) Keep N/A straight 6 petrols in BMWs (very biased as I have a couple)!
5) Replacement models for all the good Japanese sports cars, like Silvia Turbo, Supra, etc.
6) An RWD quick hatch a bit smaller than Focus/Golf size, kind of a modern MKII Escort.
7) A new Z4 with a Coupe model so it has a proper roof! (And no 4-pots or turbos)!
8) That Lancia concept car, especially if it had updated Integrale-type running gear!
There are probably more, but on a high note at least there is now one that they have made after 50+ years production, RHD V8 Mustang with a manual 6 speed! Thank you Ford!
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