RE: Porsche 991 facelift
Discussion
Mermaid said:
kambites said:
fatboy b said:
Also why would anyone want to spend that sort of money on a new car that looks the same as it did 20-30+ years ago 
Because for many people, the main reason for buying a car is not the looks. 
Personally, I've always found the watercooled 911s to be thoroughly ugly cars - the wheelbase is too short and the proportions of the rear are all wrong. The older cars had the same issues but the whole design was much more delicate which made it work better to my eye. I'd still buy one if I needed a 2+2 though.
kambites said:
Oh of course it's important but I was answering the question of why anyone would buy a car that looked like it's predecessor and the answer is "because looks aren't the only thing that's important".
The Cayenne sells on its driving dynamics, looks have got better though. 
GroundEffect said:
Will this kill the 'Turbo' model? Or will they still have it but just have a level above in terms of.performance to differentiate?
I doubt they'd kill it as such as it is somewhat legendary, either hybrid or they could even twincharge? Would be good to have something mechanically different.
Edited by Gompo on Tuesday 21st July 19:37
I thought the 997.1 looked a bit meatier than the 997.2. But I couldn't get my head around buying a Gen 1 because of the engine worries. So then started looking at 997.2s. But the 991 looks so great, I got a second hand one of those instead 2 months ago. It looks bloomin' marvellous and now there's the Gen 2! But it looks nigh on identical and they are clamping on turbos. Hopefully this won't be a bad thing then for the value of mine?
Somebody filmed the facelifted cars (with sound!). Claims the one in the first video sounded like a flat-six turbo and the second one "very quiet, like a 4-cylinder". Possible mule with a 981.2 although I doubt it. Maybe a turbo-six plugin hybrid?
http://youtu.be/1hMcy_kM90U
http://youtu.be/lWKYrvApEpU
http://youtu.be/1hMcy_kM90U
http://youtu.be/lWKYrvApEpU
EricE said:
significantly larger pcm screen, interesting.
Hope that 407 PS figure for the standard Carrera 2 is true. 480 for the C2S, 380 for the next Cayman S. Not to mention the much higher torque — these new turbo engines should be very quick.
I cannot imagine that the gen2 C2S will have more power than the current GT3, the traditional gen 2 increase is the C2 moved just under the old C2S and the C2S just under the old power pack equipped C2S.Hope that 407 PS figure for the standard Carrera 2 is true. 480 for the C2S, 380 for the next Cayman S. Not to mention the much higher torque — these new turbo engines should be very quick.
Around 380 and 425 would be my guess, with corresponding torque outputs, unless they are going to go banzai and move the Turbo/S up to 640+ a 480hp C2/4S would be far to close in performance to the halo models.
I am a big Porsche enthusiast, however I don't think this looks good at all!
The exhaust pipe design seems to be adapted from the 1998 Audi TT!
(This should probably emphasize that the GTS something between carrera S and the GT3, creating in my opinion a not quiet successful design mixture between the two)
No Porsche 911 has ever featured vertical bars on the engine lid deck /lid grille. In my opinion the design looks overdone and ugly. These type of grilles Porsche had on their cars in the early 60s, but never ever on a 911. So is this really going back to the roots, in terms of design for the 911, I don't think so.
On the front bumper those wired bulges, over the intakes where the LED strips are located, also look a bit unsuccessfully adapted from the 2015 Audi TT.
However abandoning the naturally aspirated 3,8 liter engines, what a shame. This is going to be a bigger step for Porsche than to stop producing air cooled engines. First comes the turbo charging with 3 liter engines in the 991.2, then with the 992 come the smaller 4 cylinder engines, from the 2016 boxter, in the 911. I can see where this is going.
The tail lights have stickers on and probably will look something like the Macan or 918, but I truely don't think that is going to cut it, in terms of over all design!
The exhaust pipe design seems to be adapted from the 1998 Audi TT!
(This should probably emphasize that the GTS something between carrera S and the GT3, creating in my opinion a not quiet successful design mixture between the two)
No Porsche 911 has ever featured vertical bars on the engine lid deck /lid grille. In my opinion the design looks overdone and ugly. These type of grilles Porsche had on their cars in the early 60s, but never ever on a 911. So is this really going back to the roots, in terms of design for the 911, I don't think so.
On the front bumper those wired bulges, over the intakes where the LED strips are located, also look a bit unsuccessfully adapted from the 2015 Audi TT.
However abandoning the naturally aspirated 3,8 liter engines, what a shame. This is going to be a bigger step for Porsche than to stop producing air cooled engines. First comes the turbo charging with 3 liter engines in the 991.2, then with the 992 come the smaller 4 cylinder engines, from the 2016 boxter, in the 911. I can see where this is going.
The tail lights have stickers on and probably will look something like the Macan or 918, but I truely don't think that is going to cut it, in terms of over all design!
Benjoe2001 said:
This is going to be a bigger step for Porsche than to stop producing air cooled engines.
Whilst I agree that n/a is preferable, I think we'll find that the car will deliver the goods and I do agree on the styling those vents just look wrong.
I know Porsche has a turbo history... however discontinuing all those popular naturally aspirated engines is a big step for the brand i guess and certainly will have an impact on the community. Especially in 3 years time when we most likely get a small 4 cylinder turbo engine in a 911. For me at least this sounds wrong! Lets wait and see if Porsche can still sell their 911s with 4 cylinder turbos for 130-160k Euros or if this breaks the 911 spirit.
I would imagine that they could in the future do a hybrid 4 pot turbo (half a 918 engine if you like) 450hp from a F4 turbo with hybrid would be quite an interesting thing, electric power to give you the low down instant pick up and some torque fill with a boosted flat 4 taking over or combining for max attack.
Who knows.
Who knows.
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