RE: Eunos Cosmo 20B Type S: Spotted

RE: Eunos Cosmo 20B Type S: Spotted

Author
Discussion

andburg

7,292 posts

169 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
quotequote all
Back when the Japanese produced cars that could be deemed interesting

Be good to see one of these alongside a Subaru SVX

ikarl

3,730 posts

199 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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I'm sure I read years ago that the roof lining in these had little lights (think fibre optic) all over it....hence the name Cosmos.

I saw something similar recently on the Rolls Royce Wraith that was on tv.

Can anyone confirm?

300bhp/ton

41,030 posts

190 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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Strawman said:
300bhp/ton said:
Maybe, although I'm not sure all of these 8 speed boxes are really any quicker or more intelligent in the grand scheme of things.
They are, it used to be an auto was a second or two slower 0-60, now they are often quicker than a traditional manual set up (where available).
They might have been, but that was mostly due to gearing. With 4 gears most auto's had a stupid tall final drive vs the same car with a manual box. This has a dramatic effect on 0-60mph.

The only other issue is a torque converter zaps more power, so less whp with an auto. But this is still true of any car using a torque converter today, no matter how many gears it has.

FD3Si

857 posts

144 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
quotequote all
ikarl said:
I'm sure I read years ago that the roof lining in these had little lights (think fibre optic) all over it....hence the name Cosmos.

I saw something similar recently on the Rolls Royce Wraith that was on tv.

Can anyone confirm?
I'm going to stick my neck out and say it's nonsense, as the car is actually called a Cosmo, and the 110S Cosmo first appeared in the late 60s, when fibre optic stuff was nowhere near as developed as of late.

abarber

1,686 posts

241 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
quotequote all
Strawman said:
300bhp/ton said:
Maybe, although I'm not sure all of these 8 speed boxes are really any quicker or more intelligent in the grand scheme of things.
They are, it used to be an auto was a second or two slower 0-60, now they are often quicker than a traditional manual set up (where available).
Yup. Night and day.

Baryonyx

17,996 posts

159 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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That is so cool. The wooden strip around the dashboard looks very smart, and how plush do those seats look! Looks quite the cruiser, though the automatic 'box spoils it somewhat for me. What a curious and disappointing trend it was to have so many lovely Japanese coupes of that era equipped with those...

anonymous-user

54 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
quotequote all
300bhp/ton said:
Strawman said:
300bhp/ton said:
Maybe, although I'm not sure all of these 8 speed boxes are really any quicker or more intelligent in the grand scheme of things.
They are, it used to be an auto was a second or two slower 0-60, now they are often quicker than a traditional manual set up (where available).
They might have been, but that was mostly due to gearing. With 4 gears most auto's had a stupid tall final drive vs the same car with a manual box. This has a dramatic effect on 0-60mph.

The only other issue is a torque converter zaps more power, so less whp with an auto. But this is still true of any car using a torque converter today, no matter how many gears it has.
Having spent a lot of time in cars with 3 and 4 speed autos, and more recent 5, 6, 7 and 8 speed autos I can say they are massively improved in gearshift times. More importantly the ratio spread of modern gearboxes is miles better than the old 4 speeders, and combined with the superb control systems you are right in the engines power band at practically any road speed.

Add in the much more frequent use of TC lockup and controlled slip and to say that you are "not at all sure they are any quicker or more intelligent" suggests you have no experience of them, not even the basic understanding of how an automatic transmission works (especially the importance of ratio spread) combined and an irrational desire to make clunky 4 speed automatic gearboxes sound a lot less awful that they really are. This is without even going into the various dual clutch systems.


ETA:
http://craig.backfire.ca/pages/autos/transmissions


Edited by dme123 on Tuesday 18th August 19:49

kambites

67,575 posts

221 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
quotequote all
It's a sad day when people on PH know so little about cars that they feel the need to print this:

Article said:
Engine: 1,952cc 3-rotor wankel (equivalent to 3,904cc)

dandare

957 posts

254 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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Quite an elegant-looking car (the later one). I actually love the interior. Why do the Japanese produce so many ugly cars, when they can obviously produce something pretty?

cptsideways

13,547 posts

252 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
quotequote all
FD3Si said:
ikarl said:
I'm sure I read years ago that the roof lining in these had little lights (think fibre optic) all over it....hence the name Cosmos.

I saw something similar recently on the Rolls Royce Wraith that was on tv.

Can anyone confirm?
I'm going to stick my neck out and say it's nonsense, as the car is actually called a Cosmo, and the 110S Cosmo first appeared in the late 60s, when fibre optic stuff was nowhere near as developed as of late.
Perhaps nonsense, but your mum probably had one of these in these 60's it actually no different to whats in the Wraith (bar the 8k price tag)



Mr Tidy

22,344 posts

127 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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Back when Mazda were still brave - wonderful idea but why auto only FFS?

Maybe because the Japanese were into Play Stations and X-boxes before the rest of the world - the Subaru VX Coupe reported on here recently only came with a slushbox as did most Supra-turbos!

Still they did it whereas MB never released any model of C111 although I believe they did build a 3-rotor wankel - maybe potential warranty costs put them off!

Look forward to seeing where Mazda go next with their wankel......(sorry, couldn't resist)!

Edited by Mr Tidy on Tuesday 18th August 22:08

havoc

30,072 posts

235 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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I really like that...and I can't believe I'd never heard of it before...

Cheers PH...made my evening! thumbup

Whiters

364 posts

239 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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I love this! Only knew of the existence of these after seeing one parked regularly parked by the Morris Dancers pub near Southport when I go and see the folks. Still there I believe. Never remembered to drive past slowly enough to try and read the badges as I had no idea what it was. Assumed it was Lexus variant or Nissan of some description until some fierce internet research finally unearthed the right pic.

Autobox is a bit of a shame as the only option but does seem more of a GT.

itcaptainslow

3,703 posts

136 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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cocopop said:
LittleEnus said:
FD3Si said:
Thanks for that video, wowsers!
One more full of rotary goodness...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2Oliq1znfk
Holy sheet, that sounds savage!

Always wished I could have seen the 787B run at Le Mans, one of the best sounding race cars IMO and of the like I doubt we'll ever see again.

SamGad

131 posts

165 months

Tuesday 18th August 2015
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cocopop said:
One more full of rotary goodness...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2Oliq1znfk
Good god, the noise when they start it!
I need a rotary at some point...

BricktopST205

900 posts

134 months

Wednesday 19th August 2015
quotequote all
Mr Tidy said:
Back when Mazda were still brave - wonderful idea but why auto only FFS?

Maybe because the Japanese were into Play Stations and X-boxes before the rest of the world - the Subaru VX Coupe reported on here recently only came with a slushbox as did most Supra-turbos!

Still they did it whereas MB never released any model of C111 although I believe they did build a 3-rotor wankel - maybe potential warranty costs put them off!

Look forward to seeing where Mazda go next with their wankel......(sorry, couldn't resist)!

Edited by Mr Tidy on Tuesday 18th August 22:08
If you have ever been to Japan you would see why auto's are so popular. This car was more like Toyota's LS400 or Honda's Legend rather than a GT type car so at the time the auto made the most sense.

gareth_r

5,728 posts

237 months

Wednesday 19th August 2015
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The Cosmo is similar in concept to the Soarer TT, which did have a manual option.

Very few manual Soarers were sold.

anonymous-user

54 months

Wednesday 19th August 2015
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BricktopST205 said:
If you have ever been to Japan you would see why auto's are so popular. This car was more like Toyota's LS400 or Honda's Legend rather than a GT type car so at the time the auto made the most sense.
For me it's not that fact it's an automatic that would put me off as such, it's the fact it's a 4 speed automatic and all the penalties that entails. I imagine an engine like that could be a phenomenal match for a modern 8 speed dual clutch gearbox with rev matching though, with enough ratios and sufficient intelligence in the software to get around any low end weakness in the power band. A rotary would probably be a good match for a CVT gearbox too, if you could put up with the inevitable hoover sound.

300bhp/ton

41,030 posts

190 months

Wednesday 19th August 2015
quotequote all
dme123 said:
Having spent a lot of time in cars with 3 and 4 speed autos, and more recent 5, 6, 7 and 8 speed autos I can say they are massively improved in gearshift times.
Do you have any stats? I'm not saying they absolutely aren't, but I would be surprised if there was much difference in the actual shifting speed. Of course this is comparing like for like, i.e. torque converter autos with torque converter autos'. Not to Nematic sequentials or DSG boxes.


dme123 said:
More importantly the ratio spread of modern gearboxes is miles better than the old 4 speeders, and combined with the superb control systems you are right in the engines power band at practically any road speed.
Which was exactly my point when I mention final drive ratios. With 4 gears you get very limited choice if you want any sort of high speed cruising ability and mpg. This means a tall final drive, taller than the manual version in most cases. But with more gears on an auto, you can drop the final drive to something more suitable.

dme123 said:
Add in the much more frequent use of TC lockup and controlled slip and to say that you are "not at all sure they are any quicker or more intelligent" suggests you have no experience of them, not even the basic understanding of how an automatic transmission works (especially the importance of ratio spread) combined and an irrational desire to make clunky 4 speed automatic gearboxes sound a lot less awful that they really are. This is without even going into the various dual clutch systems.


ETA:
http://craig.backfire.ca/pages/autos/transmissions


Edited by dme123 on Tuesday 18th August 19:49
I'm reasonably well versed thanks, hence having mentioned most of your points already.

samoht

5,717 posts

146 months

Wednesday 19th August 2015
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One of these was up for sale when I was looking for my RX-7 a couple of years back. I love the styling, really smooth, strong surfacing like a modern Audi, but combined with balanced FR proportions.

Stuck to plan A cos I wanted a sports car not a cruiser.