Why are people buying expensive diesels?

[AC43]

Monkeylegend said:

AC43 said:

Monkeylegend said:

ORD said:

Monkeylegend said:

You could always move to Sark, problem is they still have the internet there so we would still have to put up with your drivel

You could always just stop defending the indefensible and become a growed up.

I have this vision of you rich guys with their Porches and other exotica in London, choking away on their iphones, cursing us poor people who have no option but to drive diesel because we can't afford to run a petrol car. It gives me a smug satisfaction, wrong I know, but there you go

Well I guess my point is in London it's best to walk, use public transport or cycle if possible. If you do have to do short journeys in a car then petrol is much better than diesel. But people have been taxed into diesels and they are now spewing far more visible and invisible pollutants into my air than needed.

I'd run a diesel but only a second car and only to go on longer journeys out of town.

Believe me, when you're on a bike, having a (clogged up) city soot chucker gunning past you is pretty foul.

It's all about choice I assume you work and live? there by choice.

I live miles from London in a very small village of about 250 people, surrounded by farm fields and woodland. I have to put up with fresh air, farmyard smells and rising cocks every sunrise, but that's my choice

Yes, here out of choice since 1988 and no plans to go anywhere. Generally very happy but for the unnecessarily large number of diesels being used in zones 1 and 2 mainly because of govt tax policies.

[anonymous-user]

daemon said:

Then why keep repeating it? Repetition and expecting a different outcome is a sign of madness is it not?

Or are you trying to brow beat people into submission?

No, I am answering you as you seem quite determined to define what I mean.

daemon said:

Actually, its not. I went out to buy a big wafty petrol thing, ideally an estate and / or a cheap Jag, and i stupidly knee jerked into buying a diesel X Type, based on putting in a low ball offer and it being accepted.

Really wanted a v6 estate to replace the v6 van, and should have held out for one

We are on the same page...but on a roundabout

[AC43]

Pan Pan Pan said:

To try to separate pollution from an individual source in that mix of polluters, and then lay the blame solely on that particular source, is virtually impossible

Well yes and no. Diesels are now known to chuck out vast amounts of NOx compared to petrols and are hugely less efficient in stop start traffic than in steady state.

So the efforts of the government to tax people doing high miles out of town into diesels (which on balance is a good thing) has had an unfortunate effect on the air quality in London.

[daemon]

yonex said:

daemon said:

Wooha!

Common sense?

Retract that statement immediately.

Yes, there are two of you now who have labelled loads of people 'diesel haters' who are now in complete agreement with them. Are you in politics

Firstly, its not "loads of people", its a very small minority of people who seem to have an adverse hatred for diesels, when the rest of us can be objective.

Secondly, agreeing with one statement doesnt make me in complete agreement with their views.

I am sure I would agree with Jeremy Corbyn on today being friday, it doesnt mean i am in agreement with his left wing views.

[daemon]

yonex said:

We are on the same page...but on a roundabout

But sure it punches the day in. On a boring work conf call from home here....

[rsv696]

Monkeylegend said:

I have to put up with rising cocks every sunrise

[Monkeylegend]

AC43 said:

Monkeylegend said:

AC43 said:

Monkeylegend said:

ORD said:

Monkeylegend said:

You could always move to Sark, problem is they still have the internet there so we would still have to put up with your drivel

You could always just stop defending the indefensible and become a growed up.

I have this vision of you rich guys with their Porches and other exotica in London, choking away on their iphones, cursing us poor people who have no option but to drive diesel because we can't afford to run a petrol car. It gives me a smug satisfaction, wrong I know, but there you go

Well I guess my point is in London it's best to walk, use public transport or cycle if possible. If you do have to do short journeys in a car then petrol is much better than diesel. But people have been taxed into diesels and they are now spewing far more visible and invisible pollutants into my air than needed.

I'd run a diesel but only a second car and only to go on longer journeys out of town.

Believe me, when you're on a bike, having a (clogged up) city soot chucker gunning past you is pretty foul.

It's all about choice I assume you work and live? there by choice.

I live miles from London in a very small village of about 250 people, surrounded by farm fields and woodland. I have to put up with fresh air, farmyard smells and rising cocks every sunrise, but that's my choice

Yes, here out of choice since 1988 and no plans to go anywhere. Generally very happy but for the unnecessarily large number of diesels being used in zones 1 and 2 mainly because of govt tax policies.

Boris's new ultra low emission zone should hopefully be good for you in a couple of years. £12.50 a day for anything less than a Euro 6 spec car, which should get rid of most of the worst culprits.

[ORD]

Monkeylegend said:

Boris's new ultra low emission zone should hopefully be good for you in a couple of years. £12.50 a day for anything less than a Euro 6 spec car, which should get rid of most of the worst culprits.

More than that. You pay the normal charge and then the £12.50 on top, I think.

[SuperHangOn]

AC43 said:

Well I guess my point is in London it's best to walk, use public transport or cycle if possible.

If by London you mean right in the city I agree, otherwise definitely not.

[TameRacingDriver]

Devil2575 said:

That sentence in itself demonstrates something of a flawed way of thinking.

Consider that statement but replace the diesel car with any other form of technology and then think about how much sense it makes.

You tried one model from one manufacturer and on that basis you are going to write off every make and model that has ever and will ever be made.

I once had a car with a built in SATNAV. It was rubbish and failed to deliver my expectations, therefore I will never buy a car with one in again.

I've only owned one diesel, but I have driven plenty of others, pool cars, hire cars and the like. The same complaint could be levelled at each and every one of them. They sound awful, they have laggy power delivery, they don't rev, and they rarely ever reach their claimed figures on anything except gentle long-range driving.

The problem I had was people trying to claim they could get 60 MPG from the aforementioned Skoda vRS, while at the same time, telling me they were slaying Civic Type-R's with all of the torques they have! So when my MPGs were in the 30's from said driving style or town driving, I was obviously fairly disappointed (I didn't know any better at that time).

With a petrol engine, especially one with a bit of power, I don't generally expect anything other than fairly poor fuel economy, so I am not disappointed.

The only way I would ever buy another diesel car is if there were no alternatives.

[AB]

rsv696 said:

Monkeylegend said:

I have to put up with rising cocks every sunrise

I too tend to log on and read PH in the morning.

You're not alone.

[Granfondo]

TameRacingDriver said:

I've only owned one diesel, but I have driven plenty of others, pool cars, hire cars and the like. The same complaint could be levelled at each and every one of them. They sound awful, they have laggy power delivery, they don't rev, and they rarely ever reach their claimed figures on anything except gentle long-range driving.

The problem I had was people trying to claim they could get 60 MPG from the aforementioned Skoda vRS, while at the same time, telling me they were slaying Civic Type-R's with all of the torques they have! So when my MPGs were in the 30's from said driving style or town driving, I was obviously fairly disappointed (I didn't know any better at that time).

With a petrol engine, especially one with a bit of power, I don't generally expect anything other than fairly poor fuel economy, so I am not disappointed.

The only way I would ever buy another diesel car is if there were no alternatives.

That's why our latest car is diesel but to be honest in a 4x4 workhorse it's fine for the job.

[Monkeylegend]

ORD said:

Monkeylegend said:

Boris's new ultra low emission zone should hopefully be good for you in a couple of years. £12.50 a day for anything less than a Euro 6 spec car, which should get rid of most of the worst culprits.

More than that. You pay the normal charge and then the £12.50 on top, I think.

Yes, £11.50 plus £12.50 that should keep a few diesel drivers out.

[Monkeylegend]

AB said:

rsv696 said:

Monkeylegend said:

I have to put up with rising cocks every sunrise

I too tend to log on and read PH in the morning.

You're not alone.

At my age a rising cock at anytime is a bonus.

[AB]

Monkeylegend said:

At my age a rising cock at anytime is a bonus.

At the age of 16 I wouldn't have agreed with you. Takes me back to my GCSE English Language exam. Everyone else was outside discussing the questions and I was making excuses as to why I wanted to stay at my desk and reflect on the last 2 hours.

Anyway, well off topic!

[AC43]

Monkeylegend said:

AC43 said:

Monkeylegend said:

AC43 said:

Monkeylegend said:

ORD said:

Monkeylegend said:

You could always move to Sark, problem is they still have the internet there so we would still have to put up with your drivel

You could always just stop defending the indefensible and become a growed up.

I have this vision of you rich guys with their Porches and other exotica in London, choking away on their iphones, cursing us poor people who have no option but to drive diesel because we can't afford to run a petrol car. It gives me a smug satisfaction, wrong I know, but there you go

Well I guess my point is in London it's best to walk, use public transport or cycle if possible. If you do have to do short journeys in a car then petrol is much better than diesel. But people have been taxed into diesels and they are now spewing far more visible and invisible pollutants into my air than needed.

I'd run a diesel but only a second car and only to go on longer journeys out of town.

Believe me, when you're on a bike, having a (clogged up) city soot chucker gunning past you is pretty foul.

It's all about choice I assume you work and live? there by choice.

I live miles from London in a very small village of about 250 people, surrounded by farm fields and woodland. I have to put up with fresh air, farmyard smells and rising cocks every sunrise, but that's my choice

Yes, here out of choice since 1988 and no plans to go anywhere. Generally very happy but for the unnecessarily large number of diesels being used in zones 1 and 2 mainly because of govt tax policies.

Boris's new ultra low emission zone should hopefully be good for you in a couple of years. £12.50 a day for anything less than a Euro 6 spec car, which should get rid of most of the worst culprits.

Yes. And interestingly my 5.0 V8 petrol is not affected but diesels are. Says it all, really.

[AC43]

SuperHangOn said:

AC43 said:

Well I guess my point is in London it's best to walk, use public transport or cycle if possible.

If by London you mean right in the city I agree, otherwise definitely not.

I live in Zone 2 and travel into Zone 1. Have had commutes ranging from 7 to just shy of 10 miles. Driving's OK if your employer pays the congestion charge and provides parking (mine used to so I'd sometimes drive in). The trouble is that a 45 minute drive into the centre can easily become a 90 minute schlepp on the way back when a water main has burst or whatever.

I can use various combinations of tubes/overground/walking for commuting and it's far more predictable.

Or cycle for the most predictability of all.

I usually cycle to the football. Although tonight I'm going to Wembley so it's walk/beer/tube/football then the same in reverse.

Bar one trip to the sticks (no train station, grrrr) I simply haven't used my car all week. Don't need it.

[ZX10R NIN]

ORD said:

More than that. You pay the normal charge and then the £12.50 on top, I think.

Only if your diesel isn't euro 4 compliant which means most diesels will just pay the normal charge.

[waremark]

ZX10R NIN said:

ORD said:

More than that. You pay the normal charge and then the £12.50 on top, I think.

Only if your diesel isn't euro 4 compliant which means most diesels will just pay the normal charge.

I thought Euro 6 compliant.

[All that jazz]

Guy in the Ford forum has just announced he's bought a brand new Focus ST diesel... to do "no more than 5000 miles a year" in.