Can a car BE 'over-rated'?
Discussion
Grey Ghost said:
When they were first advertised the AMV8 Vantage was supposed to be a "£60K Porsche 911 eater" and yet when the final specs were released the "all new" 4.3 V8 was a small re-working of an existing 4.2 V8, the standard 18" wheels kept failing in impact tests so potential owners were asked to pay out north of £1K for the 19" ones, the satnav and significant parts of the switch gear came from Ford and Volvo and the overall package was totally underwhelming. I placed a deposit and then had it returned when it turned out the cost of the car was to be c£88K when specced up and given enough "goodies" to be desirable, and even then the performance stats were still terrible.
As such, total over rated based on hype and press releases when first available.
Agree with all this. I remember Aston saying how there new baby would compete with the basic 911 on price and performance and it did neither.As such, total over rated based on hype and press releases when first available.
I reckon Aston would've had sales targets at a level they never achieved, the car looked good but was very underwhelming.
Going forward to now the company is in a dire situation and desperately seeking support with sales at shocking levels.
I hope the tie up with AMG is the answer.
CorvetteConvert said:
I have occasionally seen views from people saying a car (or motorcycle) is 'over rated' or 'under rated', but by definition, if enough people rate them highly, aren't we saying in effect that they are great cars and so cannot BE 'over-rated'?
Put another way, which cars FOR YOU have been over (or under) rated? In your eyes.
Depends what people are rating them against. Put another way, which cars FOR YOU have been over (or under) rated? In your eyes.
For many it is the best car ever, until they actually live with something better.
I think there are occasions were cars are deemed overrated whereas it's the driver who's at fault. I've met a couple of people who, after driving an e30 M3, have whined about the lack of torque/power yet hardly revved the engine past 5k revs. Or said the handling was mediocre yet haven't even got close to the limit, let alone pushed it. I've then taken them out as a passenger for them to then think it's a different car! I'm a thoroughly average driver, I've just lived with an e30 M3 long enough to know how to get the best from it.
The same goes for the e46 CSL. Yes, trundling around town the gearbox is flawed. Setting it up for Paddock Hill bend, the box is a joy! It's simply awesome at doing what it was designed to do. I guess the trick is knowing what you expect from a car and buying accordingly, so you're not disappointed.
The same goes for the e46 CSL. Yes, trundling around town the gearbox is flawed. Setting it up for Paddock Hill bend, the box is a joy! It's simply awesome at doing what it was designed to do. I guess the trick is knowing what you expect from a car and buying accordingly, so you're not disappointed.
furtive said:
Blanchimont said:
Dons flame suit.
MX5. Why not buy an MR2 T-Bar with a targa roof?
Having owned 2 of each I think I'm qualified to answer this question.MX5. Why not buy an MR2 T-Bar with a targa roof?
The MX5 is a small lightweight car that is easy to chuck about. A Mk2 MR2 is a lardy mid-engined GT that isn't
Hoofy said:
Googled to find it only weighs ~200kg more so hardly lardy. I don't know why people (not you) dislike the mk2 especially in later turbo format. I thought mine was fantastic (Rev 3) and unexpectedly faster and better handling than I had imagined. It only sends you into a tree backwards in the rain if you're mentally deficient. I drove mine in all weather conditions. I even had a wet lap to prove it.
Having driven both I found the MX5 to be a totally different proposition in terms of handling...much more chuckable and communicative and the MR2 does indeed feel lardy (even if it isn't particularly).MK3 MR2 vs MX5 might be a different story but I've not driven one. Like the idea of them far more than the MK2.
Anyway, for me, over rated car = E36 325/328i. Not as an everyday car; they're very refined, handle well for a mile muncher and have lovely engines. My problem with them is when they pop up on "which cheap track car should I buy" threads. I've had 2 of them and they're miles away from the sort of nimble lively car that is good on track. Sure you can make them excellent with a bit of work as many people do but that's true of literally any car. As standard they are nowhere near as lively and fun as an old French hot hatch or an MX5 for cheap track thrills and really aren't the best base to start from at all. People seem to think they're sportscars just because they're RWD and quite powerful.
T0MMY said:
Hoofy said:
Googled to find it only weighs ~200kg more so hardly lardy. I don't know why people (not you) dislike the mk2 especially in later turbo format. I thought mine was fantastic (Rev 3) and unexpectedly faster and better handling than I had imagined. It only sends you into a tree backwards in the rain if you're mentally deficient. I drove mine in all weather conditions. I even had a wet lap to prove it.
Having driven both I found the MX5 to be a totally different proposition in terms of handling...much more chuckable and communicative and the MR2 does indeed feel lardy (even if it isn't particularly).Over-rated or under-rated is subjective
The motoring media tend to "over-rate" Fords, VAG cars and BMWs and under-rate Jap and far east cars, that's my honest opinion. I am not sure if it is because the former spend more money on advertising and the mags don't want to upset them. If you look at reliability surveys and owner satisfaction, Japs and far east cars rule, the germans less so. That would suggest the former are under-rated, the latter over-rated.
The motoring media tend to "over-rate" Fords, VAG cars and BMWs and under-rate Jap and far east cars, that's my honest opinion. I am not sure if it is because the former spend more money on advertising and the mags don't want to upset them. If you look at reliability surveys and owner satisfaction, Japs and far east cars rule, the germans less so. That would suggest the former are under-rated, the latter over-rated.
That was it. I knew the style sounded familiar.dbdb said:
There are plenty of over hyped and over rated cars - and lots of underrated, overlooked cars too. It is consequence of the power of marketing and branding.
Absolutely. It applies to clothes, electrical goods, even housing areas to an extent. Most people aren't interested in seeking out the hidden gems, they just want "the best" because then they know their money has been well spent. As a result you get clustering around the current favourite brands. Live in this suburb rather than that, drive a German car, ensure your clothes have the right labels, wera a Rolex. That way you'll fit in with your set of friends without having to put in the effort required to seek out actual quality.battered said:
Absolutely. It applies to clothes, electrical goods, even housing areas to an extent. Most people aren't interested in seeking out the hidden gems, they just want "the best" because then they know their money has been well spent. As a result you get clustering around the current favourite brands. Live in this suburb rather than that, drive a German car, ensure your clothes have the right labels, wera a Rolex. That way you'll fit in with your set of friends without having to put in the effort required to seek out actual quality.
Oh well, sounds like you are realising the errors of your ways. Things can only get better now. Over-rated:-
(1) Every VW I have ever driven. Basically slightly worse than the equivalent Ford but more expensive.
(2) AM V8. Nice sound and fairly pretty. That's it. Absurdly far short of the competition at the price.
(3) Every Audi I have ever driven. Terrible, just terrible. Much worse than Ford and VW and more expensive. (I havent driven the R8.)
Under-rated:-
(1) Fords. Generally lumped together with other non-premium cars but are better to drive than most of the premium cars, let alone the non-premium.
(2) Mazda 3. A genuinely enjoyable and very practical hatchback. I found it streets ahead of most of the competition.
(1) Every VW I have ever driven. Basically slightly worse than the equivalent Ford but more expensive.
(2) AM V8. Nice sound and fairly pretty. That's it. Absurdly far short of the competition at the price.
(3) Every Audi I have ever driven. Terrible, just terrible. Much worse than Ford and VW and more expensive. (I havent driven the R8.)
Under-rated:-
(1) Fords. Generally lumped together with other non-premium cars but are better to drive than most of the premium cars, let alone the non-premium.
(2) Mazda 3. A genuinely enjoyable and very practical hatchback. I found it streets ahead of most of the competition.
ORD said:
Under-rated:-
(1) Fords. Generally lumped together with other non-premium cars but are better to drive than most of the premium cars, let alone the non-premium.
These. Every time I've driven a Ford (with the exception of the Fusion which was dire) since the launch of the first Mondeo I have always been impressed , Mk 4 Fiesta onwards, all Models of Focus and Mondeo, S-max. All have been great drives and well put together. I remember getting one of the first MK1 Focuses on the road as a hire car (1.8LX) and being blown away by just how far it moved the game on from the then Astra, Golf, Escort. The Motoring press always rave about them so it's shame that 7 components that let them down (for most) are Blue, Oval and can be found on the Front, Back, Wheels and Steering Wheel. (1) Fords. Generally lumped together with other non-premium cars but are better to drive than most of the premium cars, let alone the non-premium.
ORD said:
Over-rated:-
(1) Every VW I have ever driven. Basically slightly worse than the equivalent Ford but more expensive.
(2) AM V8. Nice sound and fairly pretty. That's it. Absurdly far short of the competition at the price.
(3) Every Audi I have ever driven. Terrible, just terrible. Much worse than Ford and VW and more expensive. (I havent driven the R8.)
Under-rated:-
(1) Fords. Generally lumped together with other non-premium cars but are better to drive than most of the premium cars, let alone the non-premium.
(2) Mazda 3. A genuinely enjoyable and very practical hatchback. I found it streets ahead of most of the competition.
(1) Every VW I have ever driven. Basically slightly worse than the equivalent Ford but more expensive.
(2) AM V8. Nice sound and fairly pretty. That's it. Absurdly far short of the competition at the price.
(3) Every Audi I have ever driven. Terrible, just terrible. Much worse than Ford and VW and more expensive. (I havent driven the R8.)
Under-rated:-
(1) Fords. Generally lumped together with other non-premium cars but are better to drive than most of the premium cars, let alone the non-premium.
(2) Mazda 3. A genuinely enjoyable and very practical hatchback. I found it streets ahead of most of the competition.
The General Public said:
It hasn't got a German badge and will have rusted away in a year.
Over rated - Porsche 911 (997 carrera). Went for a nice long drive of a friends car for a couple of hours and it was just so incredibly dull. It handled well and went well, but my god a sports car is supposed to excite you and this didnt. I wouldnt knock anyone that like's them though as if you wanted a daily driver with ability im sure they tick the box. However as a car to jump into to blow away the cobwebs and feel special ,,er no.
Under-rated - AM V8 vantage! people that dont get excited about sinking into the cockpit of one of the most beautiful production cars and firing up the nascar sounding V8 really can't be petrol heads. The handling was terrific and the noise of that engine bouncing off the walls made me cackle with glee. Emotion on another level , but a great drive too. If the fact that the early 4.3 cars are not sub 5 secs to 60 , well who the hell cares?, its plenty quick for the real world and makes you feel special like few others cars out there.
Under-rated - AM V8 vantage! people that dont get excited about sinking into the cockpit of one of the most beautiful production cars and firing up the nascar sounding V8 really can't be petrol heads. The handling was terrific and the noise of that engine bouncing off the walls made me cackle with glee. Emotion on another level , but a great drive too. If the fact that the early 4.3 cars are not sub 5 secs to 60 , well who the hell cares?, its plenty quick for the real world and makes you feel special like few others cars out there.
jl34 said:
Over rated - Porsche 911 (997 carrera). Went for a nice long drive of a friends car for a couple of hours and it was just so incredibly dull. It handled well and went well, but my god a sports car is supposed to excite you and this didnt. I wouldnt knock anyone that like's them though as if you wanted a daily driver with ability im sure they tick the box. However as a car to jump into to blow away the cobwebs and feel special ,,er no.
Under-rated - AM V8 vantage! people that dont get excited about sinking into the cockpit of one of the most beautiful production cars and firing up the nascar sounding V8 really can't be petrol heads. The handling was terrific and the noise of that engine bouncing off the walls made me cackle with glee. Emotion on another level , but a great drive too. If the fact that the early 4.3 cars are not sub 5 secs to 60 , well who the hell cares?, its plenty quick for the real world and makes you feel special like few others cars out there.
In my view, the 4.3 cars are woeful and the 4.7 are barely any better. 997 is infinitely better in all respects except looks (and so I bought one Under-rated - AM V8 vantage! people that dont get excited about sinking into the cockpit of one of the most beautiful production cars and firing up the nascar sounding V8 really can't be petrol heads. The handling was terrific and the noise of that engine bouncing off the walls made me cackle with glee. Emotion on another level , but a great drive too. If the fact that the early 4.3 cars are not sub 5 secs to 60 , well who the hell cares?, its plenty quick for the real world and makes you feel special like few others cars out there.
) It is a world better to drive than the Aston, but you seem to be one of these people who equates looking and sounding "sporty" with being "special", rather than being into handling. Nothing wrong with that, but hardly a basis on which to call the 911 over-rated or dull. The AM is far more suited to being a daily driver, as it struggles to cope when pushed, whereas the 911 becomes more and more fun the harder you drive it.Crown for most overrated car goes to 135i IMO.
Mini (any Mini) is high on the list as well.
I'd also have to add 911s (that awful sound...) to the list.
For most underrated - Mazda 6 MPS. What a cracking car for the money. AWD turbo fun without the Impreza/Evo hooligan legacy.
Speaking of legacy - Subaru Legacy 3.0 Spec B.
Mini (any Mini) is high on the list as well.
I'd also have to add 911s (that awful sound...) to the list.
For most underrated - Mazda 6 MPS. What a cracking car for the money. AWD turbo fun without the Impreza/Evo hooligan legacy.
Speaking of legacy - Subaru Legacy 3.0 Spec B.
Edited by Bladedancer on Monday 7th September 14:51
I dont see how an F40 can be over or underated. I have never driven one but in all my years its the only car I have ever seen stop traffic in a town center and have people in the town stop a stair all at once. (It was summer 1994 ands I lived in St albans an worked on a market stall, whole town stopped to look as it crawled by spitting flames).
There were only 1300 or there about built, it was the first 200mph car the first to use carbon alot a rareity for a Ferrari in that it used a Turbo, It looked like no other car, it cost as much as an Island (now a 3 bed semi in the southeast). So not under or overrate more polarising.
Over rated, Veyron, it has non of the wow the Mc F1 had or had, sure it was super fast (so is an SSC Aero Ultima etc). It achived its huge speed with a huge engin an turbos it seemed less cleaver less elegant. I think in reality it is proably a very clever car and made as elegant as possible given the laws of physics it has to over come. But it the sort of car that gets into top 100 lists because 12 year old boys vote for it because it dose 250mph in the top trumps pack.
As an aisde when I saw then F40 at the time I was not a huge fan I loved the XJ220 a car that is very underated givne it has a fantasic ring lap and top trumps stats an looks fast going slow.
There were only 1300 or there about built, it was the first 200mph car the first to use carbon alot a rareity for a Ferrari in that it used a Turbo, It looked like no other car, it cost as much as an Island (now a 3 bed semi in the southeast). So not under or overrate more polarising.
Over rated, Veyron, it has non of the wow the Mc F1 had or had, sure it was super fast (so is an SSC Aero Ultima etc). It achived its huge speed with a huge engin an turbos it seemed less cleaver less elegant. I think in reality it is proably a very clever car and made as elegant as possible given the laws of physics it has to over come. But it the sort of car that gets into top 100 lists because 12 year old boys vote for it because it dose 250mph in the top trumps pack.
As an aisde when I saw then F40 at the time I was not a huge fan I loved the XJ220 a car that is very underated givne it has a fantasic ring lap and top trumps stats an looks fast going slow.
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