VW in trouble over alleged US emission test manipulations

[loose cannon]

Mr GrimNasty said:

Your problem is that you don't understand the science, and you have no sense of proportion, you're just believing/repeating propaganda factoids.

Diesel exhaust is no worse than petrol, it is different, but petrol emits far more other nasty carcinogens and makes them breathable. All modern cars are exceptionally clean, even the rigged diesel ones.

The idea of stinky diesels is just a lie, they just aren't like that these days, if you smell burning oil, it's most likely a petrol car. As I've said, I live on a main road a lot of the time, car pollution simply is not an issue.

Low emission zones don't work (proven all over the world) because car exhausts have such a small affect on air quality, although that doesn't stop the people that introduce them trying to spin them as a success, and every other zealot wanting them imposed, just like with 20mph zones - they ignore the facts and carry on.

The anti-diesel research comes from exactly the same school of partisan hogwash as the dangerous man-made climate change industry, overinflated statements of risk, no balance, no correlation, no causality, speculative numbers made up out of thin air. The climate change industry issued a diktat a short while ago to shift the narrative from melting ice caps and dwindling polar bears (because the ice and bears were refusing to obey the models) to killing your neighbours' children with your dastardly use of fossil fuels - because they thought the emotional impact would be more effective for their cause. And that is when all this demonizing diesel nonsense started. It's just a step on the road to banning petrol cars too. We are already hearing cries for a diesel for ev/hybrid scrap scheme.

Having said that, they mostly don't even claim that diesel exhaust kills people, they say it causes excess deaths - what they mean is people that are seriously ill may have died a few weeks early.

If you understood the facts/issues, you would realise the air quality that does most harm to a child is inside his/her own home, but don't let the truth get in the way of your irrational hatred, and your willingness to be a dumb pawn for the ecomentalists' master plan to control all our lives/money/resources.

Try spending all week doing mot tests then come back and state diesels don't stink and throw out loads of st, you can also tell everyone that at the end of each day that your nose wasn't full of black st,

[Escort Si-130]

For the VW fan boys

[Pan Pan Pan]

JonnyVTEC said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

Diesel engined cars only represent about one third of all the cars on UK roads. Where do you suppose the rest of the pollution you bang on about comes from?

The other 2 thirds....

The point is what proportional of that is associated with either fuel type?

Nope, the pollution does not just come from the other two thirds, it also comes from buses, taxis, trains, ships, factories, houses, people, shops, power stations, anything in fact that burns a fuel, so what proportion of the `pollution' comes from diesel engined cars in the overall scheme of things. My view would be only a tiny tiny fraction.
yet some on here have jumped up ranting about banning all diesel cars. A bit over the top for a pro motoring website wouldn't you think?
Oh I forgot planes, they burn kerosene, are we going to call for those to be banned too?

Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Saturday 3rd October 11:29

[Pan Pan Pan]

AW111 said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

No, I am saying that there seem to be some spittleflecked, naïve, idiots who seem to have developed a paranoia about diesel engined cars, who have either joined the ecof*ckwits in their quest to get rid of private cars, or are naively doing the ecof*ckwits work for them, in saying that diesel cars should be banned.
These idiots who are so short sighted, (that if they get their way and diesel engined cars do get banned) they cannot see, that once diesel engined cars are removed from the picture, the ecof*ckwits will start work on banning petrol engined cars, are these idiots going to help the ecof*ckwits in that task too?
As I have said several times before, Motoring (and those who enjoy cars, and motoring) doesn't need enemies, when it has `friends' calling for a ban on diesel cars in its midst.
Perhaps those who want diesel engined cars banned, should leave this site for good, they are certainly not Pistonheads. Perhaps they should join friends of Earth, the green party, or any other group, whose ultimate aim is to get rid of private cars regardless of what type of fuel it uses.
With the current and foreseeable future EV`s are not the answer, since in cradle to grave
emssions associated with bringing it to the point of use, electricity is the dirtiest domestic fuel available, which is why the government have imposed the highest fuel factor
on electricity, compared to all the other domestic fuels used in the UK.

Well good luck with your one man war on all who don't agree with you.

Maybe what motoring enthusiasts don't need is another of your spittle-flecked paranoid rants about how they are all out to get us, along with your shrill bleating about traitors in the PH ranks.

FFS get a grip.

And yet you say nothing about those who want to get a certain type of car banned from the roads? A bit of an odd stance from someone who (this being a forum for motoring enthusiasts) is presumably interested in cars and driving wouldn't you say?

[AW111]

Pan Pan Pan said:

They certainly don't need your sort who sees nothing wrong with banning a certain type of vehicle owing to vague and unprovable myths that only diesel cars cause pollution. There are none so blind as those who will not see.
Incidently several posters here have made the same point as me, so where do you get your one man war comment from? Is that as truthful as any other comments you have made?

More paranoia!

I have not said anything about banning diesels : you are jumping to delusions again.

Keep the hat on - it suits you

[Pesty]

Well this thread turned weird.

[Pan Pan Pan]

Ozzie Osmond said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

Oh, the irony!

Indeed, coming from someone who has seen fit to inflict over 17 thousand of their points of view on those using this site, the irony is quite rich.

[Pesty]

That isn't irony and how is he inflicting. If nobody 'inflicted' the site wouldn't exist would it. PPP you are coming across a bit mental.

[Pan Pan Pan]

Pesty said:

Well this thread turned weird.

I am quite enjoying it. The twists and turns a post can take is fascinating, but one thing is sure, that no matter `what' the subject is, there will always be some who wish to take a diametrically opposed view. It is just in the nature of PH.

[MarshPhantom]

Pan Pan Pan said:

They certainly don't need your sort who sees nothing wrong with banning a certain type of vehicle owing to vague and unprovable myths that only diesel cars cause pollution. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

If you can you point me to anywhere on this thread were someone has said diesel cars are the only source of pollution, please do.

[skyrover]

Mr GrimNasty said:

Your problem is that you don't understand the science, and you have no sense of proportion, you're just believing/repeating propaganda factoids.

Diesel exhaust is no worse than petrol, it is different, but petrol emits far more other nasty carcinogens and makes them breathable. All modern cars are exceptionally clean, even the rigged diesel ones.

[Pan Pan Pan]

MarshPhantom said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

They certainly don't need your sort who sees nothing wrong with banning a certain type of vehicle owing to vague and unprovable myths that only diesel cars cause pollution. There are none so blind as those who will not see.

If you can you point me to anywhere on this thread were someone has said diesel cars are the only source of pollution, please do.

Then why, as some have posted should diesel cars specifically be banned?
The true fruitcakes on here, are the ones who think diesel cars should be banned.

Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Saturday 3rd October 12:18

[skyrover]

Pan Pan Pan said:

Then why, as some have posted should diesel cars specifically be banned?

Because they are a greater danger to public health than the equivalent petrol engined car?

Because skewed taxation has led to a huge population of the UK switching to diesel with a corresponding decline in air quality.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/calls-for-ac...

They should not be banned... but tax laws certainly need re-examined

[kambites]

I think London (and other big cities) banning pre-Euro6 diesels would be a good thing, but it needs to include all internal combustion engines not just private cars.

Of course that will only help if cars like these VWs have their Euro-6 tickets revoked.

[Pan Pan Pan]

skyrover said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

Then why, as some have posted should diesel cars specifically be banned?

Because they are a greater danger to public health than the equivalent petrol engined car?

Because skewed taxation has led to a huge population of the UK switching to diesel with a corresponding decline in air quality.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/calls-for-ac...

They should not be banned... but tax laws certainly need re-examined

How much of a greater danger to public health? bearing in mind all the other sources of pollution that have a bearing on this, and that only one third of cars on UK roads are diesel.
You need to be able to quantify and prove how much diesel cars specifically are increasing the danger to public health, but you cannot, because no one can.
Are you perhaps jealous of those who `might' have benefitted from the governments taxation of vehicles mess, and VW`s f*ck up?
Remember up till a few months ago diesel was dearer than petrol. and that the swing to diesel was the government`s (at the time) fault

Edited by Pan Pan Pan on Saturday 3rd October 12:32

[kambites]

Pan Pan Pan said:

You need to be able to quantify and prove how much diesel cars specifically are increasing the danger to public health,

That, I think, is where you're wrong. If the government decides it wants to remove diesels from city centres it needs to "proof" of anything whatsoever.

[TA14]

Pan Pan Pan said:

MarshPhantom said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

They certainly don't need your sort who sees nothing wrong with banning a certain type of vehicle

If you can you point me to anywhere on this thread were someone has said diesel cars are the only source of pollution, please do.

Then why, as some have posted should diesel cars specifically be banned?
The true fruitcakes on here, are the ones who think diesel cars should be banned.

Where are all of these quotes saying that diesel cars should be banned?

[TA14]

skyrover said:

but tax laws certainly need re-examined

This episode has highlighted the idiotic tax laws which concentraded on CO2 and those scientific advisors which advocated that approach are now saying that not only did it make non CO2 emissions worse it didn't improve the CO2 either. You are quite right, the taxation basis needs a complete overhaul. I don't see why we don't just have a flat rate per car. Fuel duty and VAT will suffice.

[Pan Pan Pan]

kambites said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

You need to be able to quantify and prove how much diesel cars specifically are increasing the danger to public health,

That, I think, is where you're wrong. If the government decides it wants to remove diesels from city centres it needs to "proof" of anything whatsoever.

I am guessing you meant the government does `not' need proof of anything whatsoever?
It will just impose a ban, whether based on fact or fiction, like the government (at the time) encouraged people to switch to diesels. which they then did.
If anyone wants to have a go about diesels, they should have a go at the government which promoted their use.

[herewego]

skyrover said:

Pan Pan Pan said:

Then why, as some have posted should diesel cars specifically be banned?

Because they are a greater danger to public health than the equivalent petrol engined car?

Because skewed taxation has led to a huge population of the UK switching to diesel with a corresponding decline in air quality.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/calls-for-ac...

They should not be banned... but tax laws certainly need re-examined

There hasn't been a decline in air quality, simply a slowdown in the expected improvement. Air quality has been improving for decades.
We just need to get the diesel emissions cleanup back on track that's all.