VW in trouble over alleged US emission test manipulations
Discussion
AJB said:
Fastdruid said:
MPG drives CO2 and reducing NOx typicaly involves worsening MPG. So if you are cheating NOx you are cheating the VED bands and Company car BIK etc.
Yes, hence me saying that they were possibly cheating the government by cheating the test (by putting cars into lower VED and company car BIK bands), but not cheating customers.funkyrobot said:
The end result is a cheat of the customer though. Customer buys car because it's very low tax and they feel good about themselves. If the car shouldn't be in that bracket, they have cheated the system, but they have also cheated the end user. The customer may not have bought that make of car if a competitor had something similar.
Why do you keep saying the same thing over and over and over again???I don't feel cheated
Willhire89 said:
funkyrobot said:
The end result is a cheat of the customer though. Customer buys car because it's very low tax and they feel good about themselves. If the car shouldn't be in that bracket, they have cheated the system, but they have also cheated the end user. The customer may not have bought that make of car if a competitor had something similar.
Why do you keep saying the same thing over and over and over again???I don't feel cheated
Of course that's very selfish and I should be concerned about all the kittens that will die every time I start the engine.
Sheepshanks said:
I agree they've cheated the system, but I feel good about that, as the system is stupid. Buying a VW means you've got one over on the eco-mentalists as you're paying lower tax and getting better performance and MPG than you ought to.
Of course that's very selfish and I should be concerned about all thekittenschildren that will die every time I start the engine.
FTFY.Of course that's very selfish and I should be concerned about all the
Actually - kudos to the VW engineers as they were set a challenge to balance the best they could get in 99.99982% of usage and to satisfy a test in an artificial environment the rest of the time.
Like all good engineers they found a clever solution.
As an actual owner I don't feel cheated but then I'm also not a keyboard warrior who wants to post the same stuff every bloody page of the thread
Like all good engineers they found a clever solution.
As an actual owner I don't feel cheated but then I'm also not a keyboard warrior who wants to post the same stuff every bloody page of the thread
Sheepshanks said:
Willhire89 said:
Like all good engineers they found a clever solution.
I agree with the rest of what you wrote - but not that. They either weren't capable or couldn't be bothered to engineer a clever solution - so they just cheated.
Willhire89 said:
Actually - kudos to the VW engineers as they were set a challenge to balance the best they could get in 99.99982% of usage and to satisfy a test in an artificial environment the rest of the time.
Like all good engineers they found a clever solution.
As an actual owner I don't feel cheated but then I'm also not a keyboard warrior who wants to post the same stuff every bloody page of the thread
I'm glad there's someone else that just can't be bothered to gives a fLike all good engineers they found a clever solution.
As an actual owner I don't feel cheated but then I'm also not a keyboard warrior who wants to post the same stuff every bloody page of the thread
k.All these outraged people might like to turn their attention to the rewriting of the earth's global temperature record to show a warming trend linked to CO2 that doesn't actually exist, because that particular fraud is costing lives and money right here & now.
And is the reason this fiasco happened in the first place.
Mr GrimNasty said:
I'm glad there's someone else that just can't be bothered to gives a fk.
All these outraged people might like to turn their attention to the rewriting of the earth's global temperature record to show a warming trend linked to CO2 that doesn't actually exist, because that particular fraud is costing lives and money right here & now.
And is the reason this fiasco happened in the first place.
You are missing the point. No car manufacturer really gives a flying fk.All these outraged people might like to turn their attention to the rewriting of the earth's global temperature record to show a warming trend linked to CO2 that doesn't actually exist, because that particular fraud is costing lives and money right here & now.
And is the reason this fiasco happened in the first place.
k about the environment. They want sales.This is about lying to their buyers and profiting from misleading the public.
It had f
k all to do with the environment!Mr GrimNasty said:
I'm glad there's someone else that just can't be bothered to gives a fk.
All these outraged people might like to turn their attention to the rewriting of the earth's global temperature record to show a warming trend linked to CO2 that doesn't actually exist, because that particular fraud is costing lives and money right here & now.
And is the reason this fiasco happened in the first place.
So, everyone outraged are green party members who are annoyed because of the environment?k.All these outraged people might like to turn their attention to the rewriting of the earth's global temperature record to show a warming trend linked to CO2 that doesn't actually exist, because that particular fraud is costing lives and money right here & now.
And is the reason this fiasco happened in the first place.
Doubt it.
Some people are cheesed off because a manufacturer that some aspire to (wow) have cheated the competition. VW couldn't meet the regs, so they cheated.
As for someone commenting above about me repeating myself, I have done this because some people do not seem to understand who VW have cheated. Rules and regs were put in place to control certain elements of the market. VW couldn't develop anything that met these regs. Therefore, they shouldn't have been able to sell certain vehicles in certain markets. However, by cheating, they were able to sell a product. The end user who bought the car wouldn't have been able to buy it if VW had been honest.
Mr GrimNasty said:
I'm glad there's someone else that just can't be bothered to gives a fk.
All these outraged people might like to turn their attention to the rewriting of the earth's global temperature record to show a warming trend linked to CO2 that doesn't actually exist, because that particular fraud is costing lives and money right here & now.
And is the reason this fiasco happened in the first place.
Can I have some of what you are on?k.All these outraged people might like to turn their attention to the rewriting of the earth's global temperature record to show a warming trend linked to CO2 that doesn't actually exist, because that particular fraud is costing lives and money right here & now.
And is the reason this fiasco happened in the first place.
To those defending VAG - think of your favourite sport. Think of your favourite team/sports star. They lose a big title to someone revealed to be a cheat.
Is that acceptable?
If not, then why should it be acceptable - and in some cases applauded - in this instance.
VAG - the Lance Armstrong of the automotive industry.
Is that acceptable?
If not, then why should it be acceptable - and in some cases applauded - in this instance.
VAG - the Lance Armstrong of the automotive industry.
funkyrobot said:
However, by cheating, they were able to sell a product. The end user who bought the car wouldn't have been able to buy it if VW had been honest.
So that's a good thing for the consumer, isn't it? They were able to choose to buy a VW where, if VW hadn't cheated, they wouldn't have been able to.VW could easily meet the tests. It just would have impacted performance and fuel and Ad Blue consumption. So again, by cheating, they benefited the consumer by providing cars that did better MPG and used little Ad Blue.
Sheepshanks said:
funkyrobot said:
However, by cheating, they were able to sell a product. The end user who bought the car wouldn't have been able to buy it if VW had been honest.
So that's a good thing for the consumer, isn't it? They were able to choose to buy a VW where, if VW hadn't cheated, they wouldn't have been able to.VW could easily meet the tests. It just would have impacted performance and fuel and Ad Blue consumption. So again, by cheating, they benefited the consumer by providing cars that did better MPG and used little Ad Blue.
Hope they get the book, authors notes and publishers notes chucked at them from a great height....
FFS!!!!!!
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