How Can / Will VW fix all those dodgy engines?
Discussion
ChrisRS6 said:
Who cares!!
Everyone who works for the Volkswagen Group and its suppliers and other associated companies. Volkswagen going to the wall would have a very bad effect on a lot of people who don't deserve it, whatever you think about a few arrogant people at the top. We all work, or have worked, for tossers at some point.LotusOmega375D said:
What if an owner doesn't want VW to change anything on their car? Would that present a problem?
Revoke some legal approval that's required to renew tax/MOT?Even if that can be done, I'd bet owners would have a problem with their car now being less powerful/driveable/economical.
And I'm sure most owners don't give a damn about the emissions, only the emissions category and that's just because of the tax.
va1o said:
I've heard rumours for some it will just be a simple software update and for others (1.6 TDI) more complex component changes will be needed
Müller also confirmed that technicians are close to revealing a technical solution to the defeat devices that were employed on cars fitted with the EA189 diesel engine. He confirmed that some cars will require only a software upgrade, whereas others will also require hardware modifications. Unconfirmed reports suggest that the biggest changes will be required on 1.6-litre versions of the engine, although VW has declined to comment. The first recalls of cars affected by the scandal are due to start in January, with VW hoping to have fixed all affected vehicles by the end of next year.CRA2Y said:
Advice from CAB:
"Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
Fitness for purpose."Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
The purpose of this car is to act as a passenger vehicle, powered by diesel fuel, and to meet the road safety requirements of the territory where it was sold. Has it stopped working? Does it work less well than before? Have any of the safety systems stopped working? Would it pass an MoT test?
If the answers to the above are no, no, no and yes, you're going to struggle to claim that it's unfit for purpose.
Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
battered said:
CRA2Y said:
Advice from CAB:
"Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
Fitness for purpose."Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
The purpose of this car is to act as a passenger vehicle, powered by diesel fuel, and to meet the road safety requirements of the territory where it was sold. Has it stopped working? Does it work less well than before? Have any of the safety systems stopped working? Would it pass an MoT test?
If the answers to the above are no, no, no and yes, you're going to struggle to claim that it's unfit for purpose.
Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
As for increased depreciation, nearly every car manufacturer has been hit by a scandal at one time or another. Buy a BMW and it probably won't still be on your driveway tomorrow morning. Buy a Toyota and it will set off at 100mph of its own volition and kill you. Ford has had a similar runaway car scandal along with refusal to fix faulty Ecoboost engines and GM has got off lightly with its ignition fault issue. People have short memories on the whole and it's too early to tell if values of cars will be hit in the long term. Most people are on finance deals anyway. If a guaranteed future value is part of the deal, you've no reason to worry. If there's no guaranteed future value, I don't see how you can have something to sue over.
Blakewater said:
battered said:
CRA2Y said:
Advice from CAB:
"Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
Fitness for purpose."Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
The purpose of this car is to act as a passenger vehicle, powered by diesel fuel, and to meet the road safety requirements of the territory where it was sold. Has it stopped working? Does it work less well than before? Have any of the safety systems stopped working? Would it pass an MoT test?
If the answers to the above are no, no, no and yes, you're going to struggle to claim that it's unfit for purpose.
Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
As for increased depreciation, nearly every car manufacturer has been hit by a scandal at one time or another. Buy a BMW and it probably won't still be on your driveway tomorrow morning. Buy a Toyota and it will set off at 100mph of its own volition and kill you. Ford has had a similar runaway car scandal along with refusal to fix faulty Ecoboost engines and GM has got off lightly with its ignition fault issue. People have short memories on the whole and it's too early to tell if values of cars will be hit in the long term. Most people are on finance deals anyway. If a guaranteed future value is part of the deal, you've no reason to worry. If there's no guaranteed future value, I don't see how you can have something to sue over.
battered said:
CRA2Y said:
Advice from CAB:
"Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
Fitness for purpose."Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979, goods should be of a satisfactory quality, fit for purpose and as described. My rights have been breached because the item you sold me is faulty. I would like a repair/replacement/part-refund."
What'll it be?
The purpose of this car is to act as a passenger vehicle, powered by diesel fuel, and to meet the road safety requirements of the territory where it was sold. Has it stopped working? Does it work less well than before? Have any of the safety systems stopped working? Would it pass an MoT test?
If the answers to the above are no, no, no and yes, you're going to struggle to claim that it's unfit for purpose.
Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
Plenty of wild speculation & drivel on the other thread:, is another necessary?:-
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
battered said:
Fitness for purpose.
The purpose of this car is to act as a passenger vehicle, powered by diesel fuel, and to meet the road safety requirements of the territory where it was sold. Has it stopped working? Does it work less well than before? Have any of the safety systems stopped working? Would it pass an MoT test?
If the answers to the above are no, no, no and yes, you're going to struggle to claim that it's unfit for purpose.
Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
Interesting chatting to the MiL the other day who recently retired from running a (non-VAG) car dealership in Australia. Way the law works there is you can claim a FULL refund for anything sold to you and mis represented. No quibbles, haggles, proof, opportunity to fix, or anything, if its mis-sold the customers laughing.The purpose of this car is to act as a passenger vehicle, powered by diesel fuel, and to meet the road safety requirements of the territory where it was sold. Has it stopped working? Does it work less well than before? Have any of the safety systems stopped working? Would it pass an MoT test?
If the answers to the above are no, no, no and yes, you're going to struggle to claim that it's unfit for purpose.
Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
In practice if it's anything like here with most VAG diesel product leased/PCP'd etc through 3rd party finance it's not as clear cut as that.
battered said:
If the answers to the above are no, no, no and yes, you're going to struggle to claim that it's unfit for purpose.
Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
^^ This is precisely the point.Over to you, in what way does it fail to meet your user requirements? What's changed since a month ago?
The "solution" is going to be VW recall in which the many owners will decide not to participate. Why not? Because their car is working fine and they can't be bothered.
Exactly. Owners will be well advised to ignore the recall: their cars will continue to function exactly as they do now, they will have the performance and fuel economy that they have now, and there is no come-back on the owners at all. Taxation for owners, passing MOTs, things like that are not affected in any way. In the UK at least. Might well be different in the USA, especially in California, but that's not our problem here.
Lowtimer said:
Exactly. Owners will be well advised to ignore the recall: their cars will continue to function exactly as they do now, they will have the performance and fuel economy that they have now, and there is no come-back on the owners at all. Taxation for owners, passing MOTs, things like that are not affected in any way. In the UK at least. Might well be different in the USA, especially in California, but that's not our problem here.
and as already been discussed a billion times already..........If your engine blows up "Sorry Sir you didn't have the recall"
But we don't yet know what they are going to do because guess what????? VW havn't a f
king clue what to do yet either.All they are interested in right now is offering up scape goats and stalling for time.
mcford said:
So all of these are going to be affected by the 'fix'? Or are they just going to remove the offending code, keeping all of these intact and ignore the original requirements that the engines had to meet to allow the cars to be sold?
No one (outside VAG) knows exactly what happening, but there would be no point at all in doing the above.This article suggests that the fix will use SCR with urea treatment. We know some of the cars were already equipped with this, albeit with a small tank, so it's likely the rectification work will vary according to model.
Edited by Mr2Mike on Thursday 8th October 12:45
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