sorry me again - still looking for car advice

[danlightbulb]

Hi all,

I still can't decide on what to go for. Those who remember my previous threads know I've been round the houses a bit.

I currently have a 2003 Ford Mondeo TDCi hatchback. I want something with some power (200bhp or thereabouts) that will still be practical for family duties, and it must get high 20's / low 30's MPG on combined cycle.

I drove a £2200 2001 E39 530i sport (saloon) a few weeks back and really loved the car, but the saloon boot, whilst large, would just be too impractical as I have kids and bikes to transport. Easy answer - a 530i sport touring! Problem - very hard to find. Closest on AT is a 525i sport. I don't want the SE as it doesn't look as nice as the sport spec. There is one on PH for sale for £3600 which seems high. I'd like more than one to choose from to ensure getting good value. A couple of poor condition ones on ebay.

Ive looked also at the ST220 estate. Fast yes, good space yes, but its more expensive than the E39 5 series (circa 5 to 6k for a good one albeit in a newer reg) and at the end of the day its still a mondeo which I have now. The Mondeo is supposed to be a large car right? I don't feel that my car is particularly large really? Is it just because I've owned it for 9 years and am used to it?

Looked at Volvo V70 and to be honest they look like a hearse. V50 looks nicer IMO, but reviews say its small? 5 cyl T5 turbo engine gets good power though and reasonable MPG.

Saab 9-5 estate. Fast yes, good space yes, look ok, but they are 4 cyl turbos. I really wanted a six, for that extra refinement, not a small block thrasher.

Audi's are out - the ones that are out there in my price range seem overpriced and way underspecced compared to mondeo's or BMWs.

This is so hard, and I think the problem is just not enough choice as highlighted in the limited brands/models that actually look any good.

[MikeTFSI]

Have you considered a mk4 Mondeo with the 2.5T 5 cylinder Volvo engine? My brother in law had one for a while, cracking value motor as no one wants big petrol 'non premium' brands. I think he paid under £3k for a 2008 ex police vehicle.

I get the desire for a big engine, but I would really consider going 4 cylinder turbo, much more options open up especially around the 200bhp mark. Most are refined enough, they don't sound that special though.

How about a Saab 9-3? They did a 2.8 six pot and a 2.0t that are cheap as chips now, if you can find a nice one.

I think Renault did a 2.0t laguna for a while too, that was around 200bhp. Citroën did a v6 c5/c6 too if I recall right.

I know you discounted Audis on cost, but there is also the Audi A4 3.0 quattro (b6 so getting on a bit now) that can be had quite cheaply.

Edited by MikeTFSI on Sunday 11th October 16:19

[jontbone]

Mercedes E Class?
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2015...

[jontbone]

What's your budget? Maximum Mileage/age? Sounds like it needs to be practical, petrol and ideally a six. The Skoda Superb was available with a petrol six, or how about a Passat 2.8 4motion estate?


Maybe a C class?
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2015...

[Willy Nilly]

200hp needs about 40 litres an hour. You probably going to have to mince around with a Mondeo sized, 200hp car to get anything starting with a 3 on you mpg readout, which defeats the object of having a more powerful car.

[HustleRussell]

danlightbulb said:

Saab 9-5 estate. Fast yes, good space yes, look ok, but they are 4 cyl turbos. I really wanted a six, for that extra refinement, not a small block thrasher.

Thar speaks a man who has never driven a Saab.

For me? 5-series. That's what I did. They're not 'sporty', no- but they manage to be very good well-rounded driver's cars anyway.

[danlightbulb]

MikeTFSI said:

Have you considered a mk4 Mondeo with the 2.5T 5 cylinder Volvo engine? My brother in law had one for a while, cracking value motor as no one wants big petrol 'non premium' brands. I think he paid under £3k for a 2008 ex police vehicle.

I get the desire for a big engine, but I would really consider going 4 cylinder turbo, much more options open up especially around the 200bhp mark. Most are refined enough, they don't sound that special though.

Ive been focused on the older cars with the sixes really, and I already have a Mondeo. To be fair the Mondeo has been a great car all round, and maybe I should consider one again. It just wouldn't be that special, more like just another run of the mill car.

jontbone said:

What's your budget? Maximum Mileage/age? Sounds like it needs to be practical, petrol and ideally a six. The Skoda Superb was available with a petrol six, or how about a Passat 2.8 4motion estate?

Previously I was planning on having a loan to finance it. I decided that was a bad idea, so now I'm saving for it. A budget of 3k would be what I was looking at originally, but as I'm now saving for it, I could save for a few months more for 4k or a few months more for 5k. Practical yes - 200bhp is what I'd like having owned a slow diesel for the last 9 years. Only because I want something nice. A six just has that special feeling doesn't it over a standard 4 cyl. I'm not overly keen on the older Volkswagens, Skodas or Mercs really. BMW's just look the business, and the fast Fords have a bit more something about them than other marques.

Willy Nilly said:

200hp needs about 40 litres an hour. You probably going to have to mince around with a Mondeo sized, 200hp car to get anything starting with a 3 on you mpg readout, which defeats the object of having a more powerful car.

Sorry I'm not quite following you here. Are you saying that having 200bhp and an mpg in the low 30's are not compatible goals? Or are you saying it can be done if I sacrifice the premium element (eg the Mondeo)? Isn't the Mondeo a big car in itself, as I'm struggling to find one with more practical space than it really.

[Willy Nilly]

danlightbulb said:

Willy Nilly said:

200hp needs about 40 litres an hour. You probably going to have to mince around with a Mondeo sized, 200hp car to get anything starting with a 3 on you mpg readout, which defeats the object of having a more powerful car.

Sorry I'm not quite following you here. Are you saying that having 200bhp and an mpg in the low 30's are not compatible goals? Or are you saying it can be done if I sacrifice the premium element (eg the Mondeo)? Isn't the Mondeo a big car in itself, as I'm struggling to find one with more practical space than it really.

You want 200hp, which suggests you want to drive it a bit quick. I inform you that 200hp needs about 40 litres/hr to make the point that you get power from fuel and more power = more fuel.

You also need/want a relatively big car, so I put it to you that 30mpg is going to be a struggle in a 200hp mondeo sized car. You might get it on a run, but not regularly and if you did you would need to hypermile everywhere, which defeats the object of a powerfull car. I could get my old 1.4 litre, 89hp Civic down to low 30's.

If you need a biggish car and want 30mpg, you will probably need to: buy a diesel, drive a petrol very carefully or accept that 30mpg is a little optimistic.

[confused_buyer]

If you need 30mpg+ forget a 530i. I'm sure someone will be along in a moment and say they do 47mpg all day long but in the real world I'm sorry but they don't. It is very easy to get them sub-20mpg (particularly an auto) with a few cold starts and a bit of town/general use.

They *will* do 30mpg+ but only at about 65mph for 11 hours with no headwind.

Nice cars, but all getting old now, and I'd only really recommend one to someone who knows their cars and in particular knows how to use a spanner - otherwise they can easily be ruinous.

OP, you have a small budget and it seems particular requirements. Dismissing cars just on the looks or minor spec differences (e.g. SE v Sport) is ridiculous and a fine way to buy a pup. Those choices are the luxury of the new car buyer. Buy on condition, history, mileage and how it drives.

[danlightbulb]

Ah I see. I understand that I'll get low mpg if I'm flooring it everywhere. I won't drive like that though normally. I'll drive very sedately normally. I want to own a nice powerful motor but I don't intend to floor it everywhere like an 18 year old in a renault 5 gt turbo.

My 30mpg requirement is for normal sedate driving.

confused_buyer said:

OP, you have a small budget and it seems particular requirements. Dismissing cars just on the looks or minor spec differences (e.g. SE v Sport) is ridiculous and a fine way to buy a pup. Those choices are the luxury of the new car buyer. Buy on condition, history, mileage and how it drives.

On that basis I'd keep my Mondeo. It passed its last MOT needing a £40 repair. I do want to change my car for something better, but if I can't get what I want I may as well not bother. I don't want to change my car for the sake of changing my car. I want to change my car so I have something that I'll enjoy owning, and that there is power there when I want it. A car that I'll be motivated to go out and clean. A car that I can be motivated to pop the bonnet and do a bit of cleaning and tidying up. Like I did when I was 20.

Edited by danlightbulb on Sunday 11th October 20:13

[confused_buyer]

danlightbulb said:

Ah I see. I understand that I'll get low mpg if I'm flooring it everywhere. I won't drive like that though normally. I'll drive very sedately normally. I want to own a nice powerful motor but I don't intend to floor it everywhere like an 18 year old in a renault 5 gt turbo.

My 30mpg requirement is for normal sedate driving.

If you want over 30mpg out of a 530i you'll need to only drive it downhill and keep the engine plumbed into your central heating system so it never gets cold!

All of the cars you have listed struggle to 30mpg in real world driving, some to 25mpg. Honest, they do, particularly if there is more than just you in it with the possible exception of a V50 T5 manual but they'll still do 22mpg driven enthusiastically.

[danlightbulb]

This is what I mean:




I want to own something I can be proud of! I can't do anything with that first engine. Its not good to look at. Its cramped. I won't care about it at all. The BMW 6 though! Wow its lovely. I'll clean it. I'll care about it.

Edited by danlightbulb on Sunday 11th October 20:31

[Willy Nilly]

danlightbulb said:

I want to own something I can be proud of! I can't do anything with that first engine. Its not good to look at.

You haven't got enough money though, just keep the car you have and look after it. At your price point you are quite likely to get a nail that will need a load of money spending on it.

It's no big deal not being able to afford a particular car or type of car, it is a bit silly to buy something you can't really afford though. Besides, as you drive around very few people care about what you are driving.

[Mikeyjae]

Saab 9-3 Aero 2.0 Turbo will give you 35 to 38 mpg on a run and mid 20's around town. 210bhp standard, 260 with a stage 1 remap.

I have 1 and like you OP I will be changing soon to another Saloon/Estate/Big hatch. Iv narrowed it down to either a ST220 (2007 one of the last ones). Mondeo 2.5T or 2.0 Eco. Mazda 6, Volvo V50, ALfa 159 another Saab 9-3. Trouble I have found is the size of car I want with a petrol engine is as rare as hens teeth. Diesel seems to have been the norm in that size car. I have 7 cars on my hit list with a few others on the maybe rader but until I see that classified that makes me go I want then Ill stick with my Saab rather then buy on impulse.

[danlightbulb]

Willy Nilly said:

You haven't got enough money though, just keep the car you have and look after it. At your price point you are quite likely to get a nail that will need a load of money spending on it.

It's no big deal not being able to afford a particular car or type of car, it is a bit silly to buy something you can't really afford though. Besides, as you drive around very few people care about what you are driving.

How much do I need then? I'll keep saving if that's what it takes to get the type of car I want.

I don't care what other people think about the car I drive. I want a car that I'll be proud to own. Me. Not anyone else. Couldn't care less.

[CrgT16]

I wouldn't be put off for some comments. The price range you have is OK if you accept what you can get... Finding a very good example of say a 530 can be a bit difficult but I would keep looking, I. The meantime save your money until that car that you want, with the spec that you want becomes available... It will. Get the one you really want otherwise you always will regret it.. If you want a 530i M Sport... Wait until you find the one for you, better to search a bit longer (saving in the process) than rush in and buy the wrong one..

[danj3000]

Willy Nilly said:

You haven't got enough money though, just keep the car you have and look after it. At your price point you are quite likely to get a nail that will need a load of money spending on it.

It's no big deal not being able to afford a particular car or type of car, it is a bit silly to buy something you can't really afford though. Besides, as you drive around very few people care about what you are driving.

Nonsense. So you're saying £3-5k is not enough to get a car that you'll have a bit of interest in, enjoy driving and it fulfil some practical duties?

OP, would an E46 Touring be a little small for your use compared to the E39? If you're handy with a spanner then that will certainly save a bit of money as invariably a few bits and pieces will need doing but the BMW's are nicely engineered so good to work on.

I can vouch for the M54 6 pot, very nice motor and certainly adds a little more interest compared to most other engines.

[danlightbulb]

CrgT16 said:

I wouldn't be put off for some comments. The price range you have is OK if you accept what you can get... Finding a very good example of say a 530 can be a bit difficult but I would keep looking, I. The meantime save your money until that car that you want, with the spec that you want becomes available... It will. Get the one you really want otherwise you always will regret it.. If you want a 530i M Sport... Wait until you find the one for you, better to search a bit longer (saving in the process) than rush in and buy the wrong one..

Thanks. Yes I'm definitely not rushing in to anything. Problem is that a car like the 530i, which I do really admire, well there is nothing similar in a newer car is there. If I had 10k I don't think I'd be able to get anything any nicer looking or better performing, would I? If I had a reason to save more I would, but putting 10k in AT I'm just not impressed with anything thats available.

danj3000 said:

OP, would an E46 Touring be a little small for your use compared to the E39? If you're handy with a spanner then that will certainly save a bit of money as invariably a few bits and pieces will need doing but the BMW's are nicely engineered so good to work on.

I can vouch for the M54 6 pot, very nice motor and certainly adds a little more interest compared to most other engines.

E46 could be an option, I haven't looked at one in the flesh yet. How does it compare in size to the Mondeo hatchback? I take it the Mondeo estate would be bigger (its bigger than most other cars anyway), but I don't necessarily need the biggest estate possible just to carry kids stuff, flatpack furniture and bikes.

The spannering is something I'm keen to do, within reason. I've done my own brake discs before now, and simple stuff like intakes, audio as well (subs and speakers replaced in my old Astra when I was 20 lol). I take one look in my Mondeo TDCi engine bay and I'm put off going anywhere near it. No experience getting underneath cars.

Edited by danlightbulb on Sunday 11th October 21:09

[confused_buyer]

danlightbulb said:

I want to own something I can be proud of! I can't do anything with that first engine. Its not good to look at. Its cramped. I won't care about it at all. The BMW 6 though! Wow its lovely. I'll clean it. I'll care about it.

If you mean you can actually work on it then it is more a goer. If you can look at that BMW engine and be confident you can renew the cooling system, maybe replace the cam and crank sensors, the front pusher fan etc. and all the bits which commonly go then I think you'll be safer on your budget.

I'm not trying to be too negative but this forum and others is full of people who buy a £3.5k BMW and then are hit for £3k's worth of bills to keep it going in the first 6 months. You might not, of course. All I'm saying is be realistic and accept that an older, more complicated car will need more TLC and expense lavished on it to keep it going.

You can be lucky with an old Beemer but my goodness they can bite when they want to - even the apparently mint ones.

[danlightbulb]

^^ absolutely, I totally understand that.

But again, I'm struggling to see what better car I could get even if I had 10k to spend? Any car I buy could need repairs.

I'm sure I could replace a cooling system, as long as no special tools were needed and it all comes out easily. If I need ramps or special tools then I'd be put off.