UK Head of Tesla.... Impressive

[DonkeyApple]

loose cannon said:

DonkeyApple said:

The point is very simple. If you live the lifestyle where you are renting a room in a house then why would you be concerning yourself as to where to park your £80k EV?

You would very obviously be prioritising somewhat more important developmental aspects of your life before even contemplating wasting money you don't have on cars you don't need!!!

EVs are very clearly for people who mostly have driveways and spare cash as minimum sensible requirements.

No you couldn't wait to tell everyone how you thought I was a peasant and how you were more superior !
Why the Hounslow quote then ?
Point of this topic was were is the reasonably priced car with ice range performance and freedom the bottom line is there isn't one currently untI'll there is then most people won't get one

er because you seemed to be claiming that living like a Romainian transient worker was the norm and then seemed to be of the view that such people would be in the market for premium cars which is what EVs are due to the cost of the battery packs. If you seemed to think that was a personal insult aimed at you then that's your issue, not mine.

EVs aren't cheap so they aren't for people who need cheap. BMWs aren't cheap but they still sell them. Plenty of households have off street parking and plenty of those have more than one car and very clearly plenty of them could afford a basic EV.

If you don't have the money or facilities to own an EV you'd have to be a bit daft to go and buy one!!!

[walm]

loose cannon said:

Point of this topic was were is the reasonably priced car with ice range performance and freedom the bottom line is there isn't one currently untI'll there is then most people won't get one

No absolutely not.
You keep suggesting that 350 miles is the required range despite the rather obvious evidence that such a range is utterly unnecessary for the vast vast majority of the motoring public.

Except for your 5 mates living in a flat together who need to drive for 5 hours non-stop every day obviously.
And since they can't cope - it will never catch on...

There's going to be a £35k Tesla in 2017 with a 200 mile range and as long as it doesn't look like an abomination like the i3 it will sell like hot cakes.

[Ares]

kambites said:

Ares said:

Only the lucky have electricity at home? Where do you live...????

Oh, I have a nice double garage to keep both cars warm and dry and, if they were electric, charged (although admittedly it's currently full of bits of wood which are slowly turning into fitted wardrobes). A significant proportion of the UK's population park on the public road, though.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 13th October 11:47

Probably not those in the target market though!

....and a guy up the road has one of the Mitsu mini-SUV plug-in EVs. He parks on the road and has a cable going across the footpath (with a step shield over it) for the few hours, once per 10days he has to charge it.

[walm]

DonkeyApple said:

If you don't have the money or facilities to own an EV you'd have to be a bit daft to go and buy one!!!

Until it can fly, runs on my garbage and doesn't need roads it will never catch on.

[Ares]

kambites said:

Impasse said:

Domiciles with a driveway are in the minority

It's hard to get solid data, but reading between the lines of the last census I'm fairly certain that isn't true. It probably is true in large cities, but probably not across the UK as a whole.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 13th October 12:02

And most of the city dwellers are in apartment blocks where the inclusion of EV points will be a necessity within 5 mins. Already is with some planning authorities.

[walm]

Ares said:

A guy up the road has one of the Mitsu mini-SUV plug-in EVs. He parks on the road and has a cable going across the footpath (with a step shield over it) for the few hours, once per 10days he has to charge it.

My colleague charges his G-Gizz via a cable from his front door in a terrace. On street parking only. No probs at all.

[DonkeyApple]

walm said:

loose cannon said:

Point of this topic was were is the reasonably priced car with ice range performance and freedom the bottom line is there isn't one currently untI'll there is then most people won't get one

No absolutely not.
You keep suggesting that 350 miles is the required range despite the rather obvious evidence that such a range is utterly unnecessary for the vast vast majority of the motoring public.

Except for your 5 mates living in a flat together who need to drive for 5 hours non-stop every day obviously.
And since they can't cope - it will never catch on...

There's going to be a £35k Tesla in 2017 with a 200 mile range and as long as it doesn't look like an abomination like the i3 it will sell like hot cakes.

Average car commute round trip in the UK is less than 9 miles a day. The vast majority of car commuters could actually commute with a clapped out GWiz.

[Ares]

ewenm said:

Ares said:

kambites said:

RobM77 said:

And incidentally, surely loose cannon's point is only relevant for a drive of much over 200 miles? Unlike with a petrol or diesel car, with a Tesla your home is effectively the filling station, so in his example you'd come home, plug the car in and wake up with another 250 miles showing on the range?

Assuming one has somewhere convenient to charge it at home, yes.

Only the lucky have electricity at home? Where do you live...???? Even up here in the North we have electricity at almost every home.

....and if you've nowhere to park it, how do you manage with a current car.

Granted, some very low cost houses may have a parking space half a mile away, but they're not really target market for a £60k Exec saloon

So up there in the north, you must have noticed lots and lots of terraced houses with no off-street parking. What's the home-charging solution for them? I'm pretty sure extension cables trailed across the pavement is not acceptable. I'm pro-EV but there are significant issues with home-charging for a sizeable chunk of the population (including me!).

See previous comment. Target market (few terraced houses have £60k+ cars outside them as it is) ...and my neighbour with the Mitsu thing.

[loose cannon]

DonkeyApple said:

The point is very simple. If you live the lifestyle where you are renting a room in a house then why would you be concerning yourself as to where to park your £80k EV?

You would very obviously be prioritising somewhat more important developmental aspects of your life before even contemplating wasting money you don't have on cars you don't need!!!

EVs are very clearly for people who mostly have driveways and spare cash as minimum sensible requirements.

So nobody should have a car unless you can afford your own house ?
And one should always move next to your employment so you don't have to commute miles and miles
Sounds very reasonable doesn't it

[DonkeyApple]

loose cannon said:

DonkeyApple said:

The point is very simple. If you live the lifestyle where you are renting a room in a house then why would you be concerning yourself as to where to park your £80k EV?

You would very obviously be prioritising somewhat more important developmental aspects of your life before even contemplating wasting money you don't have on cars you don't need!!!

EVs are very clearly for people who mostly have driveways and spare cash as minimum sensible requirements.

So nobody should have a car unless you can afford your own house ?
And one should always move next to your employment so you don't have to commute miles and miles
Sounds very reasonable doesn't it

If an EV doesn't suit your needs or means or you just don't like them then the obvious solution would be an ICE would it not?

Until battery tech advances to the point that the power packs are dirt cheap then the EV simply isn't a logical option for many.

Frothing that people who very clearly have no use for an EV can't use an EV is plain daft.

[ewenm]

Ares said:

See previous comment. Target market (few terraced houses have £60k+ cars outside them as it is) ...and my neighbour with the Mitsu thing.

I was thinking future mainstream uptake. A cable once every 10 days would be fine, but if it's lots of cables to lots of cars then it's not so fine (imagine the personal injury lawyers rubbing their hands with glee). I live in Bath - a relatively wealthy city yet still lots and lots of on-street parking and rarely in the same place every time.

It's a tricky problem to resolve for mainstream usage of EVs. It's not impossible but the early-adopter cable-across-the-pavement solution isn't going to work. For me, this is where government need to invest in their "green" future - induction charging in the road? Kerbside charging points?

[kambites]

Yeah for the foreseeable future, I think EVs are going to be pretty much only for the half of the population who have either a drive, a garage or a dedicated private parking space.

Realistically I don't think we're going to see them hit more than 25-30% market share in the next twenty years for that very reason. Beyond that time-frame, I think we can reasonably expect to see either something else come along to pick up the market share that has nowhere to charge them, or mass roll-out of some sort of road-side charging points.

Edited by kambites on Tuesday 13th October 13:28

[Ares]

ewenm said:

Ares said:

See previous comment. Target market (few terraced houses have £60k+ cars outside them as it is) ...and my neighbour with the Mitsu thing.

I was thinking future mainstream uptake. A cable once every 10 days would be fine, but if it's lots of cables to lots of cars then it's not so fine (imagine the personal injury lawyers rubbing their hands with glee). I live in Bath - a relatively wealthy city yet still lots and lots of on-street parking and rarely in the same place every time.

It's a tricky problem to resolve for mainstream usage of EVs. It's not impossible but the early-adopter cable-across-the-pavement solution isn't going to work. For me, this is where government need to invest in their "green" future - induction charging in the road? Kerbside charging points?

But in a few years time, the infrastructure will be light years ahead. There are already hundred of kerb side charging points. Plus loads in supermarkets, NCP car parks, Private car parks. Most apartment blocks....and the EV is still embryonic in public uptake.

I have zero doubt that the infrastructure will keep ahead of the EV purchasing market.

[ewenm]

kambites said:

Yeah for the foreseeable future, I think EVs are going to be pretty much only for the half of the population who have either a drive or a garage.

I'd definitely consider one if I had parking with access to a power supply.

[feef]

Can anyone confirm who provides the power to the supercharger points? Many here seem to assume that Tesla is providing free charging, I suspect it's the land/property owner where the supercharger is sited that's paying for the power, and Tesla simply supply the charging hardware

Tesla drivers get 'free' charging and the provider of the charging point gets some free business from the driver while they stop for 20 minutes

[Ares]

kambites said:

Yeah for the foreseeable future, I think EVs are going to be pretty much only for the half of the population who have either a drive, a garage or a dedicated private parking space.

Musk must be devastated at that thought. *Only* 23,000,000 potential target customers in the UK......

[J4CKO]

So, are we saying looks like all the wealthy people will have an EV if they have off road parking and IC cars will just be for the less well off in flats and stuff ?

[Ares]

feef said:

Can anyone confirm who provides the power to the supercharger points? Many here seem to assume that Tesla is providing free charging, I suspect it's the land/property owner where the supercharger is sited that's paying for the power, and Tesla simply supply the charging hardware

Tesla drivers get 'free' charging and the provider of the charging point gets some free business from the driver while they stop for 20 minutes

Even smarter smart charging if so....and if its not that position at the moment, it soon will be.

Notwithstanding, the power will be dirt cheap as it is stored and only accessed at the cheapest cost.

[otolith]

J4CKO said:

So, are we saying looks like all the wealthy people will have an EV if they have off road parking and IC cars will just be for the less well off in flats and stuff ?

I think that's a plausible outcome.

[SteveSteveson]

The issue is that EVs have subsidies, and ICE cars are getting taxed more and more. Once again the government supports the "haves" and says "let them eat cake" (or, you should buy an EV/hybrid) when people say it is giving subsidies to the well off.