How important is speed in a fun car these days?
Discussion
With ever increasing power levels, kerbs weights and more and more distancing the driving from the outside world.
How important is speed to make a car fun or not?
Does outright pace really matter for a road car, or is the sensation of speed, or even the shear fun of the drive the more important to you?
So, which cars offer the polarity of these experiences.
-Which cars, if they weren't fast would be no fun at all?
-Which cars, are fun regardless of power and would be just as much fun with less power?
And what do you prefer.
How important is speed to make a car fun or not?
Does outright pace really matter for a road car, or is the sensation of speed, or even the shear fun of the drive the more important to you?
So, which cars offer the polarity of these experiences.
-Which cars, if they weren't fast would be no fun at all?
-Which cars, are fun regardless of power and would be just as much fun with less power?
And what do you prefer.
I think we end up not enjoying what we have as we think there is something better, get a Golf R, then the R400 will come out, I read how my 350Z isnt really all that fast in the scheme of things and try to work out ways to get something faster, when in reality its as fast as I ever need to go.
You can enjoy anything and we shouldn't be playing Top Trumps with, I am tempted to sell the 350Z and get a W124 Coupe and waft for a while, different kind of fun.
You can enjoy anything and we shouldn't be playing Top Trumps with, I am tempted to sell the 350Z and get a W124 Coupe and waft for a while, different kind of fun.
For a 'fun' car, I will always find more fun in the slowest Caterham rather than the fastest AMG V12 twin-turbo barge. I like the interaction and sensations more than the outright speed per se.
But if your idea of fun is travelling with 3 others in total refinement, across distances that make Germany feel more like a country than a country, with enough herbs under your right foot to goad anything under bespoke £1m exotics, then I guess you'll see the barge as much more fun.
In terms of exotic supercars being fun, I can only guess they are, but I've never had one at my disposal to find out..
The reponse to the OP will always be first defined by what the poster defines as a 'fun car these days'.
But if your idea of fun is travelling with 3 others in total refinement, across distances that make Germany feel more like a country than a country, with enough herbs under your right foot to goad anything under bespoke £1m exotics, then I guess you'll see the barge as much more fun.
In terms of exotic supercars being fun, I can only guess they are, but I've never had one at my disposal to find out..
The reponse to the OP will always be first defined by what the poster defines as a 'fun car these days'.
Short answer - No. I once had a session driving F-Types on a the Milford proving ground. Constant high speed running around the perimeter track at c100 mph was boring. Accelerating as quickly as possible before braking hard (I made it to c130 mph, the max Jaguar permitted) fell into the category of "been there, done that". The Alpine circuit, however, was fun and tricky; I would have happily spent all the time available on it. Driving twisty roads in attractive countryside, preferably with sight lines, is much more fun than mere speed. And others get their kicks from revving noisy sports cars in tunnels.
About the 100th thread on this topic in the last month.
Let me summarise the responses:
1. Not at all (down to a point) it's all about the handling
2. Quite important, you need a blend of speed and handling
3. Massively important, I just like going really fast in straight lines and have a car built for cruising on motorways but with a 700bhp engine
1 and 2 are a matter of opinion, 3 is simply incorrect
Let me summarise the responses:
1. Not at all (down to a point) it's all about the handling
2. Quite important, you need a blend of speed and handling
3. Massively important, I just like going really fast in straight lines and have a car built for cruising on motorways but with a 700bhp engine
1 and 2 are a matter of opinion, 3 is simply incorrect
300bhp/ton said:
-Which cars, if they weren't fast would be no fun at all?
Hhmm - I don't have too much experience of fast cars, but from what I've owned I would say the Impreza Turbo - when not on boost it was a bit mundane.300bhp/ton said:
-Which cars, are fun regardless of power and would be just as much fun with less power?
This is easier to answer! Original minis, 2cv's, most old open top cars, my old Haflinger, Series Land Rovers, etc.I definitely prefer the latter - it's easier and more enjoyable driving a slow car 'fast' than having a fast car and having to drive it 'slow'.
Great question OP.
I'm searching constantly for the 'right' car. Have done hot hatches, kit cars, M3s. Also spent years trying to find the car that you could use everyday and it be great fun when the opportunity arises.
Several years ago I ended up in a 996 911 which made a reasonable fist of doing everything but I've spent the last few months trying different alternatives in the hope that one of them really excites me.
F type V8S - great speed and power, funny in a wheel spinning oversteering way.... Got a bit bored of it fairly quickly which sound ridiculous - even to me and I'm saying it.
Grancabrio - strange combination of sporty bits and soft bits.... Didn't get on with it at all.
Elise S2 190 - a laugh but I'd really only ever use it when I was going out specifically for a drive (same kind of use as my motorbike)
GTR - very, very competent, but the fun comes from the speed and competence more than the process of driving it.
None of them excite me enough to really want one.
I've now decided that speed and fun do not correlate in any way (am actually using a Bentley GTC for a few days which is lovely and pretty quick - but not driving fun in any way)
I'm actually starting to think about classics..... Maybe it's because I'm in my 40s.
I'm searching constantly for the 'right' car. Have done hot hatches, kit cars, M3s. Also spent years trying to find the car that you could use everyday and it be great fun when the opportunity arises.
Several years ago I ended up in a 996 911 which made a reasonable fist of doing everything but I've spent the last few months trying different alternatives in the hope that one of them really excites me.
F type V8S - great speed and power, funny in a wheel spinning oversteering way.... Got a bit bored of it fairly quickly which sound ridiculous - even to me and I'm saying it.
Grancabrio - strange combination of sporty bits and soft bits.... Didn't get on with it at all.
Elise S2 190 - a laugh but I'd really only ever use it when I was going out specifically for a drive (same kind of use as my motorbike)
GTR - very, very competent, but the fun comes from the speed and competence more than the process of driving it.
None of them excite me enough to really want one.
I've now decided that speed and fun do not correlate in any way (am actually using a Bentley GTC for a few days which is lovely and pretty quick - but not driving fun in any way)
I'm actually starting to think about classics..... Maybe it's because I'm in my 40s.
I drove a Lotus Elise a few years back and an SLS shortly after. Lotus was massively more involving and fun (for me). The SLS was almost too quick to enjoy regularly. Long way of saying, you don't need loads of speed, just enough of it. One of the best drives of my life was in a rental car. Go figure.
Zod said:
Not this again!
There's another thread about how much power is too much.
We get this thread time and time again.
Indeed, and the problem is there is no answer, it's all personal opinion.There's another thread about how much power is too much.
We get this thread time and time again.
I turbocharged my old MX5 and made it substantially faster (and the perceived difference was bigger still due to the low down torque). Personally I don't think it really made the car more fun as such, apart from the "sleeper" aspect which was occasionally amusing. Point being that many people wouldn't enjoy a standard MX5 at all as it's "too slow" but probably would enjoy the faster version as they need the extra power to have fun. They're not right or wrong, they just think differently to me. The only people I truly don't get are those who almost don't care about handling at all and just want power. That really is a very different way to look at driving enjoyment which I find bizarre but again, just a difference of opinion.
Edited by T0MMY on Thursday 29th October 20:52
For me it's not speed per se but acceleration. I can never get bored of the shove in the back my Griff gives me for example but the fun also comes from other aspects eg. the driving position, the noise a car makes and being able to feel everything happening through the seat of my pants.
I've been pondering this today.
Sinking of selling my TT mk2 3.2, which I think is pretty fun and handles reasonably well (better than most people think as the name was possibly tarnished by the crap feel of the Mk1) and singing up for a lease on a 335d Xdrive GT, which is much quicker than the TT but I think it would be a bit of a boat and therefore not really that fun.
So is speed what makes a car fun, to me, yes, but only to a point.
Sinking of selling my TT mk2 3.2, which I think is pretty fun and handles reasonably well (better than most people think as the name was possibly tarnished by the crap feel of the Mk1) and singing up for a lease on a 335d Xdrive GT, which is much quicker than the TT but I think it would be a bit of a boat and therefore not really that fun.
So is speed what makes a car fun, to me, yes, but only to a point.
Within sensible bounds, there's different fun to be had from different types of car.
I think I would enjoy the new MX5, for example: fairly slow but well balanced; capable of being wrung out a bit.
For something a bit heavier, I prefer a higher power to weight ratio so that you can enjoy the rip of acceleration out of corners. I also like braking, and you get to brake more in a faster car along twisty roads
On a lot of roads I drive, I would barely have to brake in an MX5 because it wouldn't pick up enough pace between the bends on the fun bits.
I find the extremes at both ends hard to understand - supremely fast cars seem unusable to me, and slow cars bore me. People say you still get the cornering in a slow car, but constant speed cornering is pretty dull on the road given how far from the limits you are if you are driving safely and responsibly - more fun to go in slowly (as is safe) and then give it a bit of a bootful once you can see corner exit to be clear And slow cars are crap at that.
I think I would enjoy the new MX5, for example: fairly slow but well balanced; capable of being wrung out a bit.
For something a bit heavier, I prefer a higher power to weight ratio so that you can enjoy the rip of acceleration out of corners. I also like braking, and you get to brake more in a faster car along twisty roads
On a lot of roads I drive, I would barely have to brake in an MX5 because it wouldn't pick up enough pace between the bends on the fun bits. I find the extremes at both ends hard to understand - supremely fast cars seem unusable to me, and slow cars bore me. People say you still get the cornering in a slow car, but constant speed cornering is pretty dull on the road given how far from the limits you are if you are driving safely and responsibly - more fun to go in slowly (as is safe) and then give it a bit of a bootful once you can see corner exit to be clear
And slow cars are crap at that. Good question OP. IMO a bit different from the too much power scenario, there is the obvious choices like GT86 and mx5 which would say are fun and not a lot of power.
I suppose you would be hard fushed to say a hot hatch or M3/M4 wouldnt be fun in the right circumstances (m/way, racetrack etc.)
however i would say the funnest car i have driven was my old toyota aygo (you can laugh i know)however with the skinny tyres wee engine and the fact you could practically pick it up and put it in your pocket, it was a great wee car for revving the head off of and chucking round corners/ roundabouts. obviously this would go for any similar car (old ford Ka skode citigo etc.)
not fast by any means i deffo good fun for messing about at low speeds
I suppose you would be hard fushed to say a hot hatch or M3/M4 wouldnt be fun in the right circumstances (m/way, racetrack etc.)
however i would say the funnest car i have driven was my old toyota aygo (you can laugh i know)however with the skinny tyres wee engine and the fact you could practically pick it up and put it in your pocket, it was a great wee car for revving the head off of and chucking round corners/ roundabouts. obviously this would go for any similar car (old ford Ka skode citigo etc.)
not fast by any means i deffo good fun for messing about at low speeds
ORD said:
Within sensible bounds, there's different fun to be had from different types of car.
I think I would enjoy the new MX5, for example: fairly slow but well balanced; capable of being wrung out a bit.
For something a bit heavier, I prefer a higher power to weight ratio so that you can enjoy the rip of acceleration out of corners. I also like braking, and you get to brake more in a faster car along twisty roads On a lot of roads I drive, I would barely have to brake in an MX5 because it wouldn't pick up enough pace between the bends on the fun bits.
I find the extremes at both ends hard to understand - supremely fast cars seem unusable to me, and slow cars bore me. People say you still get the cornering in a slow car, but constant speed cornering is pretty dull on the road given how far from the limits you are if you are driving safely and responsibly - more fun to go in slowly (as is safe) and then give it a bit of a bootful once you can see corner exit to be clear And slow cars are crap at that.
Original Mini, 145 section tyres, 39 bhp, bit of left foot braking. Massive oversteer. 20mph. Bloody brilliant I think I would enjoy the new MX5, for example: fairly slow but well balanced; capable of being wrung out a bit.
For something a bit heavier, I prefer a higher power to weight ratio so that you can enjoy the rip of acceleration out of corners. I also like braking, and you get to brake more in a faster car along twisty roads
On a lot of roads I drive, I would barely have to brake in an MX5 because it wouldn't pick up enough pace between the bends on the fun bits. I find the extremes at both ends hard to understand - supremely fast cars seem unusable to me, and slow cars bore me. People say you still get the cornering in a slow car, but constant speed cornering is pretty dull on the road given how far from the limits you are if you are driving safely and responsibly - more fun to go in slowly (as is safe) and then give it a bit of a bootful once you can see corner exit to be clear
And slow cars are crap at that. I seem to remember getting ridiculously, crazily sideways in a 1-litre Nova saloon more than anything ever since. It was a s
t car but somehow good fun. Low grip and modest power is a great combination. Until you need to overtake someone. Then you will wish you were in something a bit quicker.
I reckon as long as you can overtake someone comfortably, any more speed is superfluous on the road. Especially if it makes a nice noise, and handles.
t car but somehow good fun. Low grip and modest power is a great combination. Until you need to overtake someone. Then you will wish you were in something a bit quicker.I reckon as long as you can overtake someone comfortably, any more speed is superfluous on the road. Especially if it makes a nice noise, and handles.
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