RE: BMW M4 vs. Nissan GT-R: Pic Of The Week
Discussion
vz-r_dave said:
0836whimper said:
ProBodge said:
Well the Nissan has the clear advantage here. It was designed to be a sports car and only a sports car from it's conception.
The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
OK, so what specifically is the compromise ? What is it about the GTR design that makes it inherently superior to the M4 ?The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
nickfrog said:
I don't doubt you have extensively driven both to their limit of traction and lat grip on track and on the road and that BMW will be missing out on your business but I wouldn't call the GTR a sports car, it's about 50% too heavy and large for that. I found it incredibly competent yet totally dull on the road. Not driven it on track, which is not exactly where it belongs, is it ? I would struggle to justify the added £30k for the GTR as a road car compared to the M4 after discount even with a few options.
I've not driven an M4 - and have no desire to... driven a GTR twice on track and it truly is a giant killer. Other worldly. So it's wide of the mark to say it's '50% too heavy and can't be called a sports car'. As well, a GTR doesn't belong on track!?!? Not only is at home on track, it'll play with prey like a blummin' tiger with a mouse. In reality, it's a super car but it always feels odd calling it that.vz-r_dave said:
Future classic 'M' coupe...... pff, the E90 will be the one everyone wants in the future because of it's V8.
Easy comparison: One is a future money pit 'M' coupe with a soulless engine and one of the most generic offerings BMW could come up with, and the other is a car that changed history!
Edit: Forgot the M3 has changed history, believe it's the first straight 6 to sound like a V10 due to the 'M' focused sound generator...... pathetic.
I've had an E92 V8 and the F82 trounces it on every aspect.Easy comparison: One is a future money pit 'M' coupe with a soulless engine and one of the most generic offerings BMW could come up with, and the other is a car that changed history!
Edit: Forgot the M3 has changed history, believe it's the first straight 6 to sound like a V10 due to the 'M' focused sound generator...... pathetic.
Edited by vz-r_dave on Friday 30th October 13:51
Soulless engine? Nope. The engine is a masterpiece.
Sound like a V10? Nope. To be honest I haven't noticed the sound generator. Too busy listening to the real exhaust noise!
I love the keyboard 'experts' on here...
Test drove an f82 and left me cold and no desire to upgrade from an e92 maybe it's one of those cars that's a slow burner vs the e92 which immediately excited me
Soulless engine? Nope. The engine is a masterpiece.
Sound like a V10? Nope. To be honest I haven't noticed the sound generator. Too busy listening to the real exhaust noise!
I love the keyboard 'experts' on here...
RossP said:
vz-r_dave said:
Future classic 'M' coupe...... pff, the E90 will be the one everyone wants in the future because of it's V8.
Easy comparison: One is a future money pit 'M' coupe with a soulless engine and one of the most generic offerings BMW could come up with, and the other is a car that changed history!
Edit: Forgot the M3 has changed history, believe it's the first straight 6 to sound like a V10 due to the 'M' focused sound generator...... pathetic.
I've had an E92 V8 and the F82 trounces it on every aspect.Easy comparison: One is a future money pit 'M' coupe with a soulless engine and one of the most generic offerings BMW could come up with, and the other is a car that changed history!
Edit: Forgot the M3 has changed history, believe it's the first straight 6 to sound like a V10 due to the 'M' focused sound generator...... pathetic.
Edited by vz-r_dave on Friday 30th October 13:51
Soulless engine? Nope. The engine is a masterpiece.
Sound like a V10? Nope. To be honest I haven't noticed the sound generator. Too busy listening to the real exhaust noise!
I love the keyboard 'experts' on here...
Patrick Bateman said:
LDN said:
Can't beat a light kart-like car; no doubt... but that doesn't mean the GTR is not worthy of praise and admiration. It's a super car; most super cars are heavy and boat like next to a Caterham!
It might be a super car but it ain't a supercar. 
I have owned plenty of 'fast' cars, turbos and V8s from raw TVRs to upmarket quite smooth Jags, but the GT-R I have is something else.
Running over 600BHP it is a 200mph car that gets to 0-60mph in under 3 seconds, yet in traffic it drives like a family car.
Yes they are noisy compared to the BMW, and the clonky gearshift a bit off putting at first, but it is the same clonky gearshift that gets the power to all 4 wheels and in launch control makes it just about unbeatable from standstill against any other production car at any price... so small price to pay if you value performance.
I have owned my GT-R for a year now, solid trouble free motoring with super car performance at a fraction of the price of a Ferrari, Audi or Lambo.
I like the BMW, it's a great car, but it is a tuned up family saloon and not in same league as the GT-R.
Running over 600BHP it is a 200mph car that gets to 0-60mph in under 3 seconds, yet in traffic it drives like a family car.
Yes they are noisy compared to the BMW, and the clonky gearshift a bit off putting at first, but it is the same clonky gearshift that gets the power to all 4 wheels and in launch control makes it just about unbeatable from standstill against any other production car at any price... so small price to pay if you value performance.
I have owned my GT-R for a year now, solid trouble free motoring with super car performance at a fraction of the price of a Ferrari, Audi or Lambo.
I like the BMW, it's a great car, but it is a tuned up family saloon and not in same league as the GT-R.
nickfrog said:
vz-r_dave said:
0836whimper said:
ProBodge said:
Well the Nissan has the clear advantage here. It was designed to be a sports car and only a sports car from it's conception.
The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
OK, so what specifically is the compromise ? What is it about the GTR design that makes it inherently superior to the M4 ?The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
It has held record lap times at the Nururgring, which has p*ssed the Germans off.
Many consider it was built more as a track day car anyway, so find your comments rather surprising.
nickfrog said:
vz-r_dave said:
0836whimper said:
ProBodge said:
Well the Nissan has the clear advantage here. It was designed to be a sports car and only a sports car from it's conception.
The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
OK, so what specifically is the compromise ? What is it about the GTR design that makes it inherently superior to the M4 ?The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
Kazutoshi Mizuno said:
In an antechamber in the old Silverstone pit building, a small man in a brown suit is leaping from foot to foot and waving his arms around. This is Kazutoshi Mizuno, the father of Nissan’s barnstorming GT-R, and he is not especially happy.
“Thinking that my car is too heavy is a mistake!” he says, clapping his hands together for emphasis. “All journalists say [affects a funny voice]: ‘GT-R is heavy, heavy, heavy - it should be lighter, lighter, lighter!’ I say, journalists need to develop a more professional level of thinking! More study! More thought! The GT-R needs to be this weight. A car with less weight does not handle. Lighter weight can be dangerous. And it will not be drivable by all customers. You have a responsibility for the customer. I have a big responsibility for the customer!”
The person who actually designed the car disagrees with you.“Thinking that my car is too heavy is a mistake!” he says, clapping his hands together for emphasis. “All journalists say [affects a funny voice]: ‘GT-R is heavy, heavy, heavy - it should be lighter, lighter, lighter!’ I say, journalists need to develop a more professional level of thinking! More study! More thought! The GT-R needs to be this weight. A car with less weight does not handle. Lighter weight can be dangerous. And it will not be drivable by all customers. You have a responsibility for the customer. I have a big responsibility for the customer!”
I'd definitely be a lot more excited about a weekend with the GTR, I probably wouldn't even turn up if it was with the M4. Find myself a bit disillusioned with BMW after owning a recent model & testing others, don't like their execution of this turbo-generation. Would love a proper go in a GTR though, shame the dealer never called back to arrange a test drive when i was in the market for buying a new car!
amusingduck said:
nickfrog said:
vz-r_dave said:
0836whimper said:
ProBodge said:
Well the Nissan has the clear advantage here. It was designed to be a sports car and only a sports car from it's conception.
The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
OK, so what specifically is the compromise ? What is it about the GTR design that makes it inherently superior to the M4 ?The BMW is a high performance adaptation of a mass produced bland rep-mobile and is therefore a compromise. Probably an excellent compromise though.
Kazutoshi Mizuno said:
In an antechamber in the old Silverstone pit building, a small man in a brown suit is leaping from foot to foot and waving his arms around. This is Kazutoshi Mizuno, the father of Nissan’s barnstorming GT-R, and he is not especially happy.
“Thinking that my car is too heavy is a mistake!” he says, clapping his hands together for emphasis. “All journalists say [affects a funny voice]: ‘GT-R is heavy, heavy, heavy - it should be lighter, lighter, lighter!’ I say, journalists need to develop a more professional level of thinking! More study! More thought! The GT-R needs to be this weight. A car with less weight does not handle. Lighter weight can be dangerous. And it will not be drivable by all customers. You have a responsibility for the customer. I have a big responsibility for the customer!”
The person who actually designed the car disagrees with you.“Thinking that my car is too heavy is a mistake!” he says, clapping his hands together for emphasis. “All journalists say [affects a funny voice]: ‘GT-R is heavy, heavy, heavy - it should be lighter, lighter, lighter!’ I say, journalists need to develop a more professional level of thinking! More study! More thought! The GT-R needs to be this weight. A car with less weight does not handle. Lighter weight can be dangerous. And it will not be drivable by all customers. You have a responsibility for the customer. I have a big responsibility for the customer!”
I'd love to own either of these cars but if I had to choose, and especially if I had to spend my own money on one, it would be the Nissan all day long, every single time. Nevermind the bonkers performance and guaranteed future (or even instant) classic status; just look at that photo - it even looks good in JRG! It seems a bit crazy to me that they can be that close in price tbh, even taking spec and likely discount on the BMW into account.
BORN2bWILD said:
So you don't even understand how quick the GT-R is around the track, I suggest you do more research.
It has held record lap times at the Nururgring, which has p*ssed the Germans off.
Many consider it was built more as a track day car anyway, so find your comments rather surprising.
I am no good at research - I tend to speak to fellow track day peddlers and share/give rides - not many use GTR on track incidentally - if you think the Nurburgring is a typical track then you may need to do some research - or better still - go there more often ! It has held record lap times at the Nururgring, which has p*ssed the Germans off.
Many consider it was built more as a track day car anyway, so find your comments rather surprising.
It really isn't a track car by most track drivers' standards. But as road car to destroy any other road going car with ease and without the need of any skill/finesse, it's quite superb. Each to their own though.
Edited by nickfrog on Thursday 12th November 21:32
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