Inspire me.. (With a hint of a dreaded what car)
Discussion
The M3 is one of my favourite cars of all time. But my main concern is that I doubt that i'll be able to use all of the performance on offer, as there aren't many nice roads by me, and those that are have 5939542919691 Honda Jazz's doing 33mph. Although, castle coombe isn't that far away from me... 
The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
Blanchimont said:
The M3 is one of my favourite cars of all time. But my main concern is that I doubt that i'll be able to use all of the performance on offer, as there aren't many nice roads by me, and those that are have 5939542919691 Honda Jazz's doing 33mph. Although, castle coombe isn't that far away from me...
The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
I'd get the M3 and if it doesn't work out, the other options are still available and you won't have lost any money if you buy sensibly. The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
Blanchimont said:
The M3 is one of my favourite cars of all time. But my main concern is that I doubt that i'll be able to use all of the performance on offer, as there aren't many nice roads by me, and those that are have 5939542919691 Honda Jazz's doing 33mph. Although, castle coombe isn't that far away from me...
The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
We ran a manual M3 and a TTS with the dual clutch gearbox and you make a valid point around not being able to use all the M3`s performance, whereas the TTS and its power delivery mated to the dual clutch did make it nice and usable without any effort...plus it had launch control! The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
I think if I was in your position I would be edging towards the 130i as I think it arguably makes for the best package as a daily.
rb5er said:
Everyone knows what you are like, you would have an argument in an empty room, so I have no need to continue with that.
26mpg from a Focus ST..yes 100% feasible, many drivers do even better than that.
And many worse... that was my point. Sorry it was so difficult for you to grasp. Maybe you should try and re-read my original post, not just skim read it, but all of the words.26mpg from a Focus ST..yes 100% feasible, many drivers do even better than that.
300bhp/ton said:
rb5er said:
Everyone knows what you are like, you would have an argument in an empty room, so I have no need to continue with that.
26mpg from a Focus ST..yes 100% feasible, many drivers do even better than that.
And many worse... that was my point. Sorry it was so difficult for you to grasp. Maybe you should try and re-read my original post, not just skim read it, but all of the words.26mpg from a Focus ST..yes 100% feasible, many drivers do even better than that.
C70R said:
Jeez man, let it drop. You're like a dog with a bone, and it's not really contributing much to the thread...
Let what drop, RB5 is the one that keeps quoting me and saying shall he post a link up, which he hasn't. I really couldn't care less tbh.They get 26mpp+. Great. Doesn't mean everyone will, which is all I said.
Blanchimont said:
The M3 is one of my favourite cars of all time. But my main concern is that I doubt that i'll be able to use all of the performance on offer, as there aren't many nice roads by me, and those that are have 5939542919691 Honda Jazz's doing 33mph. Although, castle coombe isn't that far away from me...
The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
The problem is if you take an M3 on track it can become expensive pretty quickly, standard brakes are exposed and you'll eat a set of tyres rapidly. I would happily go back to a 130i, in fact I am considering it having bought a weekend car now. The M3 is great for its intended use i.e. family duties blended with some spirited driving. It's a compromise and not particularly cheap to run, although there are loads of indies who know the cars inside out which helps. The 130i however has enough power to make overtaking easy, a great noise, not M car running costs, is RWD, rarer than the M3 (so I'm told) and is subtle to all but those who know about them.
The ED 30 though makes a case as it's got basically a detuned S3 engine in it, whilst looking the same as a normal GTI, and being turbocharged I like the power delivery of turbo'd cars, and these are known to map to well over 300hp. So it can be quite a stealthy package, plus it's the only one that has a Dual clutch, which may be worth trying?
All offer different reasons for buying them, and I'm genuinely baffled.
There were only 1000 130i's and they are still quite under rated and undervalued IMO. The prices are firming up now and I would guess that if you find a good one it will not lose money. The equivalent Golf and Audi are quite dull in comparison. The engine in the Golf has little character, I think you'd get quite bored of one quickly. I'd say you will always find a Golf if you want to scratch that itch.
300bhp/ton said:
C70R said:
Jeez man, let it drop. You're like a dog with a bone, and it's not really contributing much to the thread...
Let what drop, RB5 is the one that keeps quoting me and saying shall he post a link up, which he hasn't. I really couldn't care less tbh.They get 26mpp+. Great. Doesn't mean everyone will, which is all I said.
Perhaps one for a separate thread?
ETA: FWIW, I average around 28-29mpg (indicated) from a 330ci with a mix of town and motorway driving. The owners' club suggests that this is high, even though I don't always drive like a pensioner.
Edited by C70R on Tuesday 24th November 10:23
Ah.. that mysterious Pistonheads desirable feature: rarity 
Seriously though, the OP's description seems to point towards a 130i or 330i. If you can live with the drive by wire throttle lag (the only flaw I can think of, unless you're a anti-BMW snob), both are extremely good all round cars. Both will average 30mpg+ quite easily if you drive out of town (more on the motorway) and both handle beautifully and come with a subtle but lovely straight six soundtrack and a gorgeous engine with a wide spread of torque and a good reliability record. The choice between the 130i and the 330i will largely be down to how much space you need and what your impression of the looks is. Everyone's individual, but most people conclude that the 3 series looks better proportioned and gives much more space than the slight size increase over the 1 would seem to suggest, which once you factor in the cost of each car new explains the 130i's relative rarity compared to the 330i.
Seriously though, the OP's description seems to point towards a 130i or 330i. If you can live with the drive by wire throttle lag (the only flaw I can think of, unless you're a anti-BMW snob), both are extremely good all round cars. Both will average 30mpg+ quite easily if you drive out of town (more on the motorway) and both handle beautifully and come with a subtle but lovely straight six soundtrack and a gorgeous engine with a wide spread of torque and a good reliability record. The choice between the 130i and the 330i will largely be down to how much space you need and what your impression of the looks is. Everyone's individual, but most people conclude that the 3 series looks better proportioned and gives much more space than the slight size increase over the 1 would seem to suggest, which once you factor in the cost of each car new explains the 130i's relative rarity compared to the 330i.
boobles said:
People are deluded if they think any petrol car over lets say a 2.0 will achieve 30mpg or close in the real world!
Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
Long term average for our 2.3 litre 250bhp Saab 9-5 Aero is a smidge over 29mpg, it gets high thirties on a motorway run. Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
I will admit that the 130i is becoming a better proposition. Is it worth getting a facelift (I believe these had oil temp gauges?) over a non?
And as I've owned 2 cars (1 N/A with no power, and 1 turbo'd car) is all the power at the top end, or do they have useable torque too? (I understand that dropping a gear or two will make the progress quicker, I'm just curious about where the torque is)
And as I've owned 2 cars (1 N/A with no power, and 1 turbo'd car) is all the power at the top end, or do they have useable torque too? (I understand that dropping a gear or two will make the progress quicker, I'm just curious about where the torque is)
Blanchimont said:
And as I've owned 2 cars (1 N/A with no power, and 1 turbo'd car) is all the power at the top end, or do they have useable torque too? (I understand that dropping a gear or two will make the progress quicker, I'm just curious about where the torque is)
This is a more complex question and really depends on your experience and your view point.Most European and Japanese cars tend to favour higher specific output. This means most engines are more revvy, so they always perform better at higher rpm.
The 130i is no exception, it is a n/a unit with moderate specific output. To get the most from the engine, you will need to work it.
On the flip side, 3.0 litres of displacement means it is a fairly large engine by European standards. So it will have more low end grunt than any n/a 2.0 litre engine.
This is why I say it depends on your experience. If you've never driven a relatively powerful car before, then the 130i will feel lively at low rpm and certainly quicker than the majority of cars on the road. This is simply down to it's displacement. So it will be highly usable and tractable.
But if you open it up, you'll find it has a lot more to offer too.
boobles said:
People are deluded if they think any petrol car over lets say a 2.0 will achieve 30mpg or close in the real world!
Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
Self-certified 'wimp' here, it would seem. Averaging 28-29mpg in a 330ci, based on a couple of thousand town and motorway miles.Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
Civic Type R (FN2)?
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/h...
Seems very tidy at that price.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/h...
Seems very tidy at that price.
C70R said:
boobles said:
People are deluded if they think any petrol car over lets say a 2.0 will achieve 30mpg or close in the real world!
Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
Self-certified 'wimp' here, it would seem. Averaging 28-29mpg in a 330ci, based on a couple of thousand town and motorway miles.Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
And that's just the stuff that has a direct affect on a real figure, let alone the numerous claims online that are either lies or massive calculation failures.
I'm of course not saying yours are, but its amazing how much bad data is out there.
For the record, in something like my Roadster I've recorded a low of 38mpg and a high of 67mpg. That's a huge difference, not just in numbers, but percentage too. But claiming either as a Mode average would be pretty stupid. And that's the crux of it, just because one person gets something, doesn't mean you will. So if you are basing your car purchase partly on mpg claims, then you need to consider how 'realistic' it is to achieve them.
Edited by 300bhp/ton on Tuesday 24th November 13:30
C70R said:
boobles said:
People are deluded if they think any petrol car over lets say a 2.0 will achieve 30mpg or close in the real world!
Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
Self-certified 'wimp' here, it would seem. Averaging 28-29mpg in a 330ci, based on a couple of thousand town and motorway miles.Unless you drive like a complete wimp or only do motorway driving, then I don't believe some of these quotes. Sorry.
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