RE: Saab 9-3: PH Carpool
Discussion
CS400 said:
As a previous owner of a stock Turbo X with only 40k miles on the clock, regularly serviced and always run on v-power, I would suggest you avoid the 2.8 AWD Turbo X. Although it is a lovely car in some respects, is a mechanical nightmare. The timing chain is a time bomb(also see Insignia VXR), which on the Saab is an engine out job, although not on the VXR. You would also have to allow for replacing the coil packs as they go after 20 minutes of spirited driving and 3 of them require a load of the engine bay internals to be removed just to replace them.
Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Sounds like you had a bit of a lemon thereBesides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
I'm at the other end of the 9-3 scale (not quite the Cavalier end!)
I've got a 2005 9-3 Vector (Sport, I think) badged as a 1.8t, so obviously a 2.0 engine
Needed a cheap car a few months back, found it for less than £700. 145k on the clock, came with a Hirsch remap I knew nothing about and it's a lovely thing. The seats are some of the best in the business, and it's a lesson in ergonomics to any other car manufacturer when you get behind the wheel. It's a good looking car, even in sub-£700 doom-blue dented fashion, as mine is, and it's practical too. Engine's plenty gutsy enough, and the economy is pretty fair at high 20's around town, and mid-30's on a run. You generally get out of it feeling refreshed, and on a 300-mile round trip to the NEC the other week, it was like I'd been in there for about 3mins.
Things that aren't so good? They've been mentioned already. The ride is figidity, which is a real shame because it's such a laid-back refined car, it deserves a silky ride to match. It's very composed on motorways, it's more the town stuff that's not much fun in it, and it is getting a bit knocky and creaky like previously mentioned.
The steering is also very light and pretty vague in feel. Our Ford S-Max is much more fun to drive, and that's an MPV! The exterior build quality is fine, but in the interior feels a bit cut-price in places, in the same way a Rover 75 does - good at the clunky doors etc, but the plastics feel cheap in places. And, on an earlier model before the facelift, the stereo is WOEFUL. And I mean woeful like it's a total shambles that it even got passed for sale like that.
I overlook all these because the things the car does well, it does very well. And if you're anally attentive to detail like me, there are lots of little engineering touches that make you appreciate the efforts the designers went to. You can almost feel them there in the car with you, getting excited about the 'nightpanel' function (which is a great idea, by the way).
I only wish Saab had got into bed with Ford, not Vauxhall, because then you'd have the underpinnings of a good car to drive, like the Mondeo, rather than a Vauxhall sprinkled with nicer looks and some clever touches. Something like a 2006 Aero petrol can be had for £1400-£1800 if you look around, which is a serious amount of car for the money, but I'd never tell anyone they're a driver's car, as they really aren't.
I've got a 2005 9-3 Vector (Sport, I think) badged as a 1.8t, so obviously a 2.0 engine
Needed a cheap car a few months back, found it for less than £700. 145k on the clock, came with a Hirsch remap I knew nothing about and it's a lovely thing. The seats are some of the best in the business, and it's a lesson in ergonomics to any other car manufacturer when you get behind the wheel. It's a good looking car, even in sub-£700 doom-blue dented fashion, as mine is, and it's practical too. Engine's plenty gutsy enough, and the economy is pretty fair at high 20's around town, and mid-30's on a run. You generally get out of it feeling refreshed, and on a 300-mile round trip to the NEC the other week, it was like I'd been in there for about 3mins.
Things that aren't so good? They've been mentioned already. The ride is figidity, which is a real shame because it's such a laid-back refined car, it deserves a silky ride to match. It's very composed on motorways, it's more the town stuff that's not much fun in it, and it is getting a bit knocky and creaky like previously mentioned.
The steering is also very light and pretty vague in feel. Our Ford S-Max is much more fun to drive, and that's an MPV! The exterior build quality is fine, but in the interior feels a bit cut-price in places, in the same way a Rover 75 does - good at the clunky doors etc, but the plastics feel cheap in places. And, on an earlier model before the facelift, the stereo is WOEFUL. And I mean woeful like it's a total shambles that it even got passed for sale like that.
I overlook all these because the things the car does well, it does very well. And if you're anally attentive to detail like me, there are lots of little engineering touches that make you appreciate the efforts the designers went to. You can almost feel them there in the car with you, getting excited about the 'nightpanel' function (which is a great idea, by the way).
I only wish Saab had got into bed with Ford, not Vauxhall, because then you'd have the underpinnings of a good car to drive, like the Mondeo, rather than a Vauxhall sprinkled with nicer looks and some clever touches. Something like a 2006 Aero petrol can be had for £1400-£1800 if you look around, which is a serious amount of car for the money, but I'd never tell anyone they're a driver's car, as they really aren't.
griffin dai said:
CS400 said:
As a previous owner of a stock Turbo X with only 40k miles on the clock, regularly serviced and always run on v-power, I would suggest you avoid the 2.8 AWD Turbo X. Although it is a lovely car in some respects, is a mechanical nightmare. The timing chain is a time bomb(also see Insignia VXR), which on the Saab is an engine out job, although not on the VXR. You would also have to allow for replacing the coil packs as they go after 20 minutes of spirited driving and 3 of them require a load of the engine bay internals to be removed just to replace them.
Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Sounds like you had a bit of a lemon thereBesides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
The dealer also said that a lot of the 9-3 Turbo X where returned to the dealers to check, when new, as the owners thought there was something wrong with the clutch but that was just how it was!
CS400 said:
As a previous owner of a stock Turbo X with only 40k miles on the clock, regularly serviced and always run on v-power, I would suggest you avoid the 2.8 AWD Turbo X. Although it is a lovely car in some respects, is a mechanical nightmare. The timing chain is a time bomb(also see Insignia VXR), which on the Saab is an engine out job, although not on the VXR. You would also have to allow for replacing the coil packs as they go after 20 minutes of spirited driving and 3 of them require a load of the engine bay internals to be removed just to replace them.
Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Thanks for that - was feeling quite tempted to sell both my cars and buy that estate - kind of the best of both, but it appears too good to be true. The 0-60 in 5.4 shown on Auto trader made it look very good!Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Great cars - I had a ttid aero sportwagon for 6 years and 90k miles - loved it, great lights, stupidly economical and faster than anyone realises (test drove a Golf GTD as a potential replacement and it was ponderous in comparison). In most ways better than the CLS Shooting Brake I replaced it with (passed the Saab to my son and still look at it with envy every day)
VolvoMariner said:
CS400 said:
As a previous owner of a stock Turbo X with only 40k miles on the clock, regularly serviced and always run on v-power, I would suggest you avoid the 2.8 AWD Turbo X. Although it is a lovely car in some respects, is a mechanical nightmare. The timing chain is a time bomb(also see Insignia VXR), which on the Saab is an engine out job, although not on the VXR. You would also have to allow for replacing the coil packs as they go after 20 minutes of spirited driving and 3 of them require a load of the engine bay internals to be removed just to replace them.
Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Thanks for that - was feeling quite tempted to sell both my cars and buy that estate - kind of the best of both, but it appears too good to be true. The 0-60 in 5.4 shown on Auto trader made it look very good!Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Not really the thing to say on a Saab thread
CS400 said:
VolvoMariner said:
CS400 said:
As a previous owner of a stock Turbo X with only 40k miles on the clock, regularly serviced and always run on v-power, I would suggest you avoid the 2.8 AWD Turbo X. Although it is a lovely car in some respects, is a mechanical nightmare. The timing chain is a time bomb(also see Insignia VXR), which on the Saab is an engine out job, although not on the VXR. You would also have to allow for replacing the coil packs as they go after 20 minutes of spirited driving and 3 of them require a load of the engine bay internals to be removed just to replace them.
Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Thanks for that - was feeling quite tempted to sell both my cars and buy that estate - kind of the best of both, but it appears too good to be true. The 0-60 in 5.4 shown on Auto trader made it look very good!Besides that, trying to drive the car requires a lot of patience as the clutch is so temperamental it will either stall, frog leap and fire you into the dashboard or slip! The AWD system isn't perfect either and if you not ultra smooth with the throttle and/or clutch it will clonk and jerk no end.
There is a certain satisfaction in getting it all right and the noise at full chat is lovely which makes you forgive the car a bit but I couldn't live with it as our main family car.
Just my 2p for what it is worth.
Not really the thing to say on a Saab thread
Kitchski said:
Things that aren't so good? They've been mentioned already. The ride is figidity, which is a real shame because it's such a laid-back refined car, it deserves a silky ride to match. It's very composed on motorways, it's more the town stuff that's not much fun in it, and it is getting a bit knocky and creaky like previously mentioned.
The steering is also very light and pretty vague in feel. Our Ford S-Max is much more fun to drive, and that's an MPV!
As my current Alfa 156 is getting increasingly scratched and dented by tossers I've given up any hope of keeping it looking nice and am getting fidgety about finding something else... Saab 9-3 or 9-5 look like suitably unusual possibilities, particularly in Sportwagon spec as I would like roof rails in order to chuck a canoe on the roof without buggering about with crappy bolt-on roof bars. But I do like my twisty roads and not having to slow down to granny speed for every corner - does the above mean the Saabs would be a dead loss as a replacement for a 156?The steering is also very light and pretty vague in feel. Our Ford S-Max is much more fun to drive, and that's an MPV!
DamienB said:
As my current Alfa 156 is getting increasingly scratched and dented by tossers I've given up any hope of keeping it looking nice and am getting fidgety about finding something else... Saab 9-3 or 9-5 look like suitably unusual possibilities, particularly in Sportwagon spec as I would like roof rails in order to chuck a canoe on the roof without buggering about with crappy bolt-on roof bars. But I do like my twisty roads and not having to slow down to granny speed for every corner - does the above mean the Saabs would be a dead loss as a replacement for a 156?
It's ok for pressing on. I had a 156 V6 quite a few years back, and the 9-3 isn't any less composed than the Alfa. It's slightly less fun, but then the driving position is also slightly better so there's not much in it for me. The Saab can get down the road fairly swiftly, it's just not especially fun at doing it. The suspension is more of an issue pottering around town - once you load it up and start abusing it, it settles down.Boring suggestion, but a mk4 Mondeo would be a nicer tool than either for twisty roads. Only issue is the 2.5T would be the one I want, and they're way above the budget of the 9-3, and juicier.
Kitchski said:
It's ok for pressing on. I had a 156 V6 quite a few years back, and the 9-3 isn't any less composed than the Alfa. It's slightly less fun, but then the driving position is also slightly better so there's not much in it for me. The Saab can get down the road fairly swiftly, it's just not especially fun at doing it. The suspension is more of an issue pottering around town - once you load it up and start abusing it, it settles down.
Well that doesn't sound too bad then... guess I'll have to have a play with one.Kitchski said:
Boring suggestion, but a mk4 Mondeo would be a nicer tool than either for twisty roads. Only issue is the 2.5T would be the one I want, and they're way above the budget of the 9-3, and juicier.
The looks have just never done it for me with Mondeos. Same with the Focus, the proportions just look wrong.DamienB said:
The looks have just never done it for me with Mondeos. Same with the Focus, the proportions just look wrong.
Looks don't fuss me TBH, just a bonus if they look nice. Think the Mondeo looks nice enough, but agree about the Focus. Can't see the outside from the inside anyway!Well I had a play with a 93 1.8T saloon today just to see how they handle.
Well it's lovely in a straight line.
It was not a fan of going fast round corners. And while part of me admires the Automan-style instant 90 degree change of heading on a fairly big roundabout at a measly 30mph, the rest of me chooses life. Bloody hell... suspension seemed fine, lots of tread on the tyres (admittedly all budget names), but it just let go. Scary!
Well it's lovely in a straight line.
It was not a fan of going fast round corners. And while part of me admires the Automan-style instant 90 degree change of heading on a fairly big roundabout at a measly 30mph, the rest of me chooses life. Bloody hell... suspension seemed fine, lots of tread on the tyres (admittedly all budget names), but it just let go. Scary!
DamienB said:
Well I had a play with a 93 1.8T saloon today just to see how they handle.
Well it's lovely in a straight line.
It was not a fan of going fast round corners. And while part of me admires the Automan-style instant 90 degree change of heading on a fairly big roundabout at a measly 30mph, the rest of me chooses life. Bloody hell... suspension seemed fine, lots of tread on the tyres (admittedly all budget names), but it just let go. Scary!
That's the model I've got, never had it even close to being out of shape before! It's very planted, just no fun.Well it's lovely in a straight line.
It was not a fan of going fast round corners. And while part of me admires the Automan-style instant 90 degree change of heading on a fairly big roundabout at a measly 30mph, the rest of me chooses life. Bloody hell... suspension seemed fine, lots of tread on the tyres (admittedly all budget names), but it just let go. Scary!
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