Small 4wd or tough 2wd advice please
Discussion
coppice said:
Looking around at market and with budget less than 10k I am quite drawn to Jimny - small but tough as old boots (I've read) and go anywhere.
Has to be a Panda 4x4 with a bike engine...https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQPNw7R2Zq0
coppice said:
Excellent - thanks to all for their thoughts . Three queries re Jimny - I assume servicing costs are low? MPG - got to be mid 30s plus - and all petrol I think ? If we bought a 20k mile one it should be ok for 8-10k a year until 100k ish with tlc ?
Only dodgy thing ive heard is to do with the 3 spoke alloys. Aparently they can develop a pretty scary "death wobble" fault on older examples. 5spoke / steels are the best choice. Also they are meant to be a bit s
t on road compared to the SX4 and other "soft roaders".Ignis is another similar vehicle but I know they have the opposite issues to the Jimny with there Diffs not being up to proper offroad work. I think the terios, new fiat panda 4x4 & SX4 have the same issue. Not sure on the exact cause but my friend says its inheirent to vehicles with automatic non-electric diffs.
(^This is all 2nd hand information from my friend who does some offroading with a local club in his discovery^)
Im in pretty much the same boat as you, although Im looking for a year round vehicle that wont bore me to death (for a 3rd of your budget). Ive been recommended a Forester by numerous folks on here so that seems a good shout.
I had a bog standard Jimny (MY03) and it was so reliable. Would leave it for weeks at a time, it would fire up, take complete abuse, go across the fields in all weather and take on some pretty tough terrain. Just flew through MOTs and never bother to take it anywhere to service, just changed the oils and filters myself.
Just don't have one for the sole purpose of driving on the road, they are pretty terrible at that!
Just don't have one for the sole purpose of driving on the road, they are pretty terrible at that!
Daihatsu Terios Mk. 2 is (I believe) the smallest vehicle available in the UK with locking diffs?
The early mark 1's look horrible but the later ones I actually kinda like the look of.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/d...
The early mark 1's look horrible but the later ones I actually kinda like the look of.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/d...
Ryvita said:
Daihatsu Terios Mk. 2 is (I believe) the smallest vehicle available in the UK with locking diffs?
The early mark 1's look horrible but the later ones I actually kinda like the look of.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/d...
I recall Clarkson doing pretty well with one when they went 'fox hunting' with the Terios as the fox....The early mark 1's look horrible but the later ones I actually kinda like the look of.
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/d...
billzeebub said:
Subaru Forester
They are damn good if you want something that size. (Original request was for small 4x4) Full disclosure - I have a Forester STI. 
e.g. http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2015...
- Get a 2.0 not a 2.5 for peace of mind.
- The non-turbos have a low range box, the turbos don't.
- Cam belt and oil service history is essential.
- Common faults are failure of self-leveling rear suspension, check for a butt-dragging stance or nasty noises from rear.
- They came from factory with Yokohama Geolander tyres which are good off-road but terrible on. Other tyres will improve on-road behaviour.
- They have decent ground clearance but quite long overhangs.
- Towing limit is 1.5 tonnes braked if that's relevant.
Jimnys are cheap and great off road but terrible on it (had a couple as company cars when I sold Suzukis). Why not a Suzuki Grand Vitara? Just as good off-road, just a lot better on it and a bit more space. I would probably avoid the later (Renault?) diesel for the sake of reliability though. The earlier two-tone ones with the PSA HDi diesel are alright as far as I know though but maybe petrol is better suited to the use it will get (short journeys etc)? Mitsubishi Shogun (Pinin)? A small version of the Shogun but not sure when they stopped making them. May bought one for the last TG challenge. Should be tough and reliable too. Likewise, is there much wrong with a Toyota RAV4? Toyotas are tough and reliable and have a better AWD system than a CRV by all accounts. Lastly, how about an XJ Cherokee. My 2001 Grand Cherokee wasn't super reliable but apparently these are better in that respect and good off road and on.
The invisible car for the shortlist is a Suzuki 2009+ Grand Vitara, in either 3 or 5 door. They were vastly updated in 2008, with full time 4x4 with torque vectoring ABS doodads, quieter cabins, locking centre diff, and electronic transfer-box/low ratio gearbox.
They were superseded in 2014/15 by the new Vitara which is very different so current prices are reasonable.
2010 GV models now go for around £8K. The petrol engines have the best reliability with cam-chain 2.4 litre engines, (168HP and no DPF, or dual-mass flywheel) get around 30 mpg (UK) but the downside is £280 p.a. VED. Diesels seem to generate endless miscellaneous ECU and DPF errors, but are slightly more fuel efficient, and more expensive to service.
The upside is that the cars are very capable all-day road cruisers, and if you don't need more than 8" of ground clearance (Jimny is 7.4") they handle farm tracks and dirt trails extremely well.
The UK specs are SZ3, SZ4 and SZ5, the mid-range SZ4's have cruise and most of the creature comforts you'll need. They also are much more versatile as a daily driver than the Jimny, but not as cheap to run. Cabins are easy to live with, and noise levels (post 2008) much lower than the older models.
They tend to come with SUV All-weather tyres like Bridgestone Dueler (sic) but cheap-skate city slickers usually replace them with Kwik-fit ditch-finders. Wheel size was 17"-18" on later models (Sz4 & SZ5) so tyres are not cheap.
Disclaimer: I live in the sticks and am on my third GV since 2001 and find the things almost unstoppable in winter. Last main dealer annual service was £300, I get 32mpg from the 2.4 petrol. My insurance fully comp is £232 with AXa/Swiftcover.
Cabin is nice enough for long drives to Amsterdam and Brugges for the weekend.
I have run Jimny's, they are cute, cheap, but suffer as daily drivers from low power, cramped cabins, ride quality from 1969 and motorway emphysema. Lovely otherwise. But then so was Twiggy.
They were superseded in 2014/15 by the new Vitara which is very different so current prices are reasonable.
2010 GV models now go for around £8K. The petrol engines have the best reliability with cam-chain 2.4 litre engines, (168HP and no DPF, or dual-mass flywheel) get around 30 mpg (UK) but the downside is £280 p.a. VED. Diesels seem to generate endless miscellaneous ECU and DPF errors, but are slightly more fuel efficient, and more expensive to service.
The upside is that the cars are very capable all-day road cruisers, and if you don't need more than 8" of ground clearance (Jimny is 7.4") they handle farm tracks and dirt trails extremely well.
The UK specs are SZ3, SZ4 and SZ5, the mid-range SZ4's have cruise and most of the creature comforts you'll need. They also are much more versatile as a daily driver than the Jimny, but not as cheap to run. Cabins are easy to live with, and noise levels (post 2008) much lower than the older models.
They tend to come with SUV All-weather tyres like Bridgestone Dueler (sic) but cheap-skate city slickers usually replace them with Kwik-fit ditch-finders. Wheel size was 17"-18" on later models (Sz4 & SZ5) so tyres are not cheap.
Disclaimer: I live in the sticks and am on my third GV since 2001 and find the things almost unstoppable in winter. Last main dealer annual service was £300, I get 32mpg from the 2.4 petrol. My insurance fully comp is £232 with AXa/Swiftcover.
Cabin is nice enough for long drives to Amsterdam and Brugges for the weekend.
I have run Jimny's, they are cute, cheap, but suffer as daily drivers from low power, cramped cabins, ride quality from 1969 and motorway emphysema. Lovely otherwise. But then so was Twiggy.
Edited by Slushbox on Thursday 26th November 18:40
white_goodman said:
Jimnys are cheap and great off road but terrible on it (had a couple as company cars when I sold Suzukis). Why not a Suzuki Grand Vitara? Just as good off-road, just a lot better on it and a bit more space. I would probably avoid the later (Renault?) diesel for the sake of reliability though.
Yes, the Suzuki Fora are awash with tales of Renault-derived diesely diseases. The RAV4 is debatable. They are (mine was) deathly boring to drive, and lack the full-time 4x4 of the post 2008 GVs. RAV4 is kind of like the Q*shq*i, but less interesting. They only come in beige, no matter what colour you buy. They had less than 7" of ground clearance, last time I looked.
My neighbours here in Hickville all run Subarus. There's a 12 year old Forester parked next to my GV, owned by an ex-cop. Says it hasn't let him down since he bought it, apart from the new clutch, oh, and the time the gearbox jammed in reverse. He does love it, despite the small amounts of paint starting to show through the rust.
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