RE: Bentley Bentayga - the designer's view: PH Blog
Sunday 29th November 2015
A rhino hide interior for your Bentley Bentayga would probably be as uncomfortable as it would be socially unacceptable, no matter how much you'd be willing to pay for the exclusivity value. And, no, better not to even tempt the target audience with ideas like that...
Sir, rhino hide for your Bentley?Saying that, they do seem to have a good supply of them at Crewe, not least in the design department. You might think they'd need 'em too, given the response to the Bentayga in the 170 comments in the thread following our drive last week. One I was lucky enough to share with Bentley's head of interior design, Darren Day. And, despite what some of the forum commentators might seem to think, he's a man of sound mind and body, not to mention excellent taste and a thorough understanding of what the people who buy 'his' cars want out of them.
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As long as it appeals to those who are willing to payBut for all the image of arty farty wafting about in roll necks and chunky glasses there is a toughness required in his game. He described as an up and coming designer within Bentley - where he's worked nearly all his professional life - how the first Flying Spur exterior design came down to him and one other proposal, literally split down the middle on a full-size clay. And his lost out. But it's all part of the game. You might put your heart, soul and every working hour into a design for months on end. All for it to fail at the (imagined) Dragon's Den board approval stage. He reckoned on a strike rate of one in 10 successes being typical, underlining the need to be thick-skinned and able to shrug and move on.
The plane home offered an interesting insight into the mindset of those folk too. The woman sat beside me clocked the Bentayga press pack I was reading and - having seen the cars out and about in Malaga the same day - wanted to know all about it. She was an interior designer, accustomed to creating homes for exactly the kind of folk who'd want a Bentayga parked outside it. And to her Darren and his colleagues had absolutely nailed it.
Bentley Bentayga - the designer's view: PH Blog
So what does the bloke who designed the Bentayga think of the PH comments thread that followed our review?
Sir, rhino hide for your Bentley?
To be honest though having swapped cards and cheery farewells after our day in the Bentayga I was slightly bracing myself when I saw an email from him land, especially given the wailing and gnashing of teeth within the forum thread. But no. This was the same cheery Darren I'd shared a car with, happy to acknowledge the response and seemingly unflustered by some of the more charged - and personal - comments therein. I did recall saying to him on the day the worst PH response you could wish for was indifference. But on reflection did wonder about being careful what you wish for.
-L.jpg "Click to enlarge")
As long as it appeals to those who are willing to pay
His ability to flit between the big picture - incorporating the Bentley 'wings' into the dash architecture for instance - and obsession with details like stitching, veneers and millimetric chrome trims around inset switchgear was fascinating too. The design of the Bentayga might not be to all - mine included - tastes. But it doesn't need to be. So long as it satisfies those of people in the market to spend upwards of a quarter of a million quid on an SUV that's all that matters.
The Bentayga is not, by any stretch, a pretty car. But then nor is the Subaru Forester I'm eagerly awaiting delivery of. It perfectly suits my needs though and, for all its defiant fugliness, I happen to think it's one of the coolest things on four wheels. Like Darren, I'm entirely happy for people to disagree with me on that score, no matter how worked up they get about it.
Whatever your price point, you can't buy taste!
Dan
Discussion
Spot-on article - the marketeers and designers have done their work and it will be interesting to see how it translates in to sales; I seem to remember the Cayenne was similarly slated when it came out and that turned in to a real success story.
Personally I do find the looks 'challenging' but if I was in the market for such a car (I'm not) then I wouldn't let that put me off - this is more about presence, interior ambience and capability, which it has in spades. When you're sitting in it or driving, the exterior appearance is less important - and come-on, it's not that ugly.
I really hope it's a success.
Personally I do find the looks 'challenging' but if I was in the market for such a car (I'm not) then I wouldn't let that put me off - this is more about presence, interior ambience and capability, which it has in spades. When you're sitting in it or driving, the exterior appearance is less important - and come-on, it's not that ugly.
I really hope it's a success.
It doesn't offend me in the way it does some PH'ers and I never had the knee-jerk "kill it with fire" reaction that many on here with no real opinion of their own have expressed. But it is just dull, really really dull, in the flesh as well as in images. It's just lazy design even with all of "Darren's" attention to detail and clever design touches. There is probably a model or sketch somewhere that actually looks good, creative even, maybe daring and in some way moves Bentley's design language forward not back. This is not it.
"Design me an SUV with a Continental front, a flare over the rear wheel-arch and that weird bustle at the back that we've adopted as our design signature" seems to have been the conversation with the CEO (but with a German accent and the veiled threat of being fired or sent to SEAT if it doesn't come out well).
Why not make it the next generation, the new face of Bentley? Tidy up some of the dull details of the Continental range and the weirdness of the Mulsanne headlights and make it innovative while retaining all the "Bentleyness" that Darren is proud to have included on Bentayga (and what a name! It's like they used Boggle to come up with it).
I think we all know it's hard to make an SUV look nice in production form (certainly easier as a concept but it rarely translates) and they are often better two or three generation on (Cayenne One was a pig IMO, two is better and Macan better still) but this is such a collection of Bentley design cliches that you just know that somewhere there's a model, even a full size one (that a VW committee rejected) that is really what this car should have looked like.
"Design me an SUV with a Continental front, a flare over the rear wheel-arch and that weird bustle at the back that we've adopted as our design signature" seems to have been the conversation with the CEO (but with a German accent and the veiled threat of being fired or sent to SEAT if it doesn't come out well).
Why not make it the next generation, the new face of Bentley? Tidy up some of the dull details of the Continental range and the weirdness of the Mulsanne headlights and make it innovative while retaining all the "Bentleyness" that Darren is proud to have included on Bentayga (and what a name! It's like they used Boggle to come up with it).
I think we all know it's hard to make an SUV look nice in production form (certainly easier as a concept but it rarely translates) and they are often better two or three generation on (Cayenne One was a pig IMO, two is better and Macan better still) but this is such a collection of Bentley design cliches that you just know that somewhere there's a model, even a full size one (that a VW committee rejected) that is really what this car should have looked like.
The rest of the car seems to be done so well (just look at some of the interior shots) that it shouldn't really matter, it still delivers on being the most luxurious & most expensive SUV on the market. I really like the rest of the car and will certainly look at it come replacement time despite the looks, especially if they depreciate like Conti GTs after a year or two! But the exterior design is definitely a bit of a disappointment, it's not terrible and I can't imagine it will lose all that many sales, but it's not going to get them many either - however as there is so much more to the car than it's exterior design, I'm sure they will be OK.
It is for people well versed and highly dependent on self and over indulgence as a daily fix.
The F-Pace, is at least a reasonably good looking car.
This is not even remotely beautiful therefore it is purchased by people who need other people to tell them how their houses should look and what to put in it because if left to their own devices their homes would be abhorent.
Essex, Marbella, Cheshire and Premier League car parks.
The F-Pace, is at least a reasonably good looking car.
This is not even remotely beautiful therefore it is purchased by people who need other people to tell them how their houses should look and what to put in it because if left to their own devices their homes would be abhorent.
Essex, Marbella, Cheshire and Premier League car parks.
I have no idea what this car looks like inside, nor what goes on at Bentley, but who has the ultimate say of what an car looks like by the time it reaches production?
It's romantic to think that a designers conjure up the most thrilling things they can muster and bingo - job done. But I can imagine that in many cases multiple stuffy suits, accountants, marketeers etc. get their oar in and after multiple rounds of committee meetings something is "agreed" and the designers reluctantly trudge back to their PCs to produce the required compromise. And between then and the motorshows and press days they work hard on a narrative to convince journalists that their design is truly and uncompromisingly awesome. This narrative is maintained through a few model years until facelift mark 2 is released which is apparently 150% better than the original(crap) model.
[Edited to correct multiple crimes against good spelling]
It's romantic to think that a designers conjure up the most thrilling things they can muster and bingo - job done. But I can imagine that in many cases multiple stuffy suits, accountants, marketeers etc. get their oar in and after multiple rounds of committee meetings something is "agreed" and the designers reluctantly trudge back to their PCs to produce the required compromise. And between then and the motorshows and press days they work hard on a narrative to convince journalists that their design is truly and uncompromisingly awesome. This narrative is maintained through a few model years until facelift mark 2 is released which is apparently 150% better than the original(crap) model.
[Edited to correct multiple crimes against good spelling]
Edited by JuniorD on Wednesday 25th November 14:59
I'm inclined to think most people not liking it aren't the target market anyway.
It's like when BMWs find some new weird niche to fill (X6). I tend to go "Well, it's not for me, but I'm sure they know better than me/whingers on the forum what their customers want".
To me, it looks exactly like you'd expect a Bentley SUV to look, for better or for worse. It's going to sell to the same people that buy the Mulsanne or whatever.
It's like when BMWs find some new weird niche to fill (X6). I tend to go "Well, it's not for me, but I'm sure they know better than me/whingers on the forum what their customers want".
To me, it looks exactly like you'd expect a Bentley SUV to look, for better or for worse. It's going to sell to the same people that buy the Mulsanne or whatever.
I think most of the criticism was directed at the exterior appearance. It is simply very dull, with no redeeming features. The interior is what this market expects - evidence of conspicuous consumption - and Mr Day has certainly appeared to have delivered what is required in this respect. And the interior look and feel probably matters more to prospective owners than the exterior, or the phony off road features.
Edited by oldtimer2 on Wednesday 25th November 11:35
You only have to look at some of the creations that certain sectors of society will buy to understand that this designer understands his target audience. Take a good look at some of the bling paintjobs during supercar season in London. Expensive car, made to look flash with bespoke paint, driven by someone who probably couldn't get said supercar round Silverstone in less than 10 minutes without crashing it. It's all about their perception of image (showing off), and 'look at ME' syndrome. The same mentality drives sales of vanity registrations in six figures.
Personally, there's no way I'd purchase anything like that - I prefer to be a little more low key. It suits me nicely if people don't look, especially when I arrive at a client site and don't want to be perceived as charging too much -even if some folks would say that's exactly what I do
Personally, there's no way I'd purchase anything like that - I prefer to be a little more low key. It suits me nicely if people don't look, especially when I arrive at a client site and don't want to be perceived as charging too much -even if some folks would say that's exactly what I do
Article said:
So what does the bloke who designed the Bentayga think of the PH comments thread that followed our review?
I'm still waiting - as far as I can tell the headline question is not addressed anywhere in the article itself. Is this part 1 of a 2-parter????(ETA: I feel like I'm giving Dan Trent a lot of heat these days, but really Dan - sometimes you don't help yourself
)
te.. This car categorically shows how little taste the top earners really have. What happened to you Bentley??? Did this guy really 'design' a brick shape with a conti front end? I think stylistically & in terms of image this Bentley owes a massive debt to the Jeep Grand Wagoneer (SJ) of 1984-91).
While the Brooks Stevens designed 1963 SJ Wagoneer had the originality & distinction of preceding the Range Rover as the world's first luxury "Off-Roader" this vehicle is, as to be expected,entirely derivative.
In design terms it smacks of the "Committee" approach taken to design by the German manufacturers today - full of the unwieldiness which comes from the compromises implicit in accommodating senior management's risk aversion.
As a vehicle of low efficiency, older technology and high maintenance/systems support - it is definitely a "marketer's" product rather than an engineer's - not that this will matter a jot to the prospective purchasers.
While the Brooks Stevens designed 1963 SJ Wagoneer had the originality & distinction of preceding the Range Rover as the world's first luxury "Off-Roader" this vehicle is, as to be expected,entirely derivative.
In design terms it smacks of the "Committee" approach taken to design by the German manufacturers today - full of the unwieldiness which comes from the compromises implicit in accommodating senior management's risk aversion.
As a vehicle of low efficiency, older technology and high maintenance/systems support - it is definitely a "marketer's" product rather than an engineer's - not that this will matter a jot to the prospective purchasers.
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