RE: Ferrari 360Challenge Stradale : Spotted
Discussion
RED110T said:
That sounds awesome but for sheer aural pleasure the 355 with a tubi just about pips it imo 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKUobz9iZ_g
daveco said:
RED110T said:
That sounds awesome but for sheer aural pleasure the 355 with a tubi just about pips it imo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKUobz9iZ_g
k-ink said:
A McLaren MP4 offers value at not a vastly more than 100k.
This is absolutely correct and on point.In fact, for £109,000 you could buy a 2010 Elysian motorhome which comes with a fridge and a microwave oven. http://motorhomes.autotrader.co.uk/used-motorhomes...
You can't argue with that kind of value. Right?
k all in the context of this thread.
Correct, so many car nuts don't understand why the 360CS is worth so much, hence this discussion. The Scuderia is hugely preferable to most, never mind the Speciale - and that's among people who like that sort of car.
No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
twinturban said:
Correct, so many car nuts don't understand why the 360CS is worth so much, hence this discussion. The Scuderia is hugely preferable to most, never mind the Speciale - and that's among people who like that sort of car.
No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
Let me see if I can offer an understanding. Firstly, I think the point I would make is that the correct argument is not whether people “prefer” the CS (I understand that it is incorrect to refer to it as a 360 CS, as it was simply named the Challenge Stradale with the reference to 360 dropped), but why it is as valuable as it is.No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
The Challenge Stradale is for a modern Ferrari, a car of some historical importance. It was the first car in the Ferrari range to establish the now established trend of producing a limited edition race car for the road. it started the gravy train (for Ferrari) that so many marques now ascribe too as well. In many circumstances, as performance ceases to be a relevant factor in a car's value, a car that is a “first” often that has a premium attached to it once it transitions to classic car status or something akin to that. It would appear that the CS is now seen as more of a modern classic (which is a position that neither the Scuderia or the Speciale currently enjoy) and this again adds desirability.
It is a limited series car and fewer CS’ were made than Scuderias or Speciales (production numbers aren’t really released by the factory anymore, but it is generally accepted that more Scuderia and Speciales were made). It also by some margin the rawest of the three cars – an attribute that collectors (who are responsible for the recent rise in prices) clearly value. It is also widely considered by the majority to be one of the finest sounding modern Ferraris if not the finest – again raising the desirability factor. Finally in my view, it is a Ferrari, a limited edition Ferrari, the first truly lauded type of its kind. It’s desirability is a simple function of supply and demand. Subjectively, I can completely see why a CS might not be worth the money that is being asked for this, but objectively in my opinion, it is as clear as day.
It remains to be seen if the Speciale, which is the last of the N/A V8 racecars for the road that Ferrari is likely to build will one day outstrip the CS in value, but for the time being that does not seem to the case. The 430 Scuderia has the misfortune of neither being the first or the last of its kind, and if I were a betting man I would say that in 25 years when all these cars are firmly set as classic, it will not command the same values as the CS and Speciale.
I would add that I am not convinced if the majority would prefer the looks of a Scuderia over a Stradale. They are both handsome cars with presence and big fan followings, and both are far more visually appealing than the base cars on which they were modeled.
All just my opinion in the spirit of a healthy debate. I would be foolish to claim that I am right, but that's my 2p.
When the 360CS was launched, it was lauded for what it does, not what it is. Now it joins the ranks of other Ferraris which are valuable for what it is and not what it does. How good it is, how well it was received and all the other factors which would typical dictate a residual are all redundant when it comes to certain cars and the Challenge Stradale is one of them. See also: F40, 365GTB/4, 550B, 575SA etc etc
I doubt the values will drop.
I doubt the values will drop.
twinturban said:
No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car.
Objectively, I can't think of any reason why I'd want an F40 over a 650S. They're not too dissimilar and I'm confident the 650S would rape the F40 in every test you threw at them but I'd still cut off important parts of my anatomy to drive an F40 but wouldn't to own a 650S. You just can't reason with subjective desire.
AdvocatusD said:
twinturban said:
Correct, so many car nuts don't understand why the 360CS is worth so much, hence this discussion. The Scuderia is hugely preferable to most, never mind the Speciale - and that's among people who like that sort of car.
No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
Let me see if I can offer an understanding. Firstly, I think the point I would make is that the correct argument is not whether people “prefer” the CS (I understand that it is incorrect to refer to it as a 360 CS, as it was simply named the Challenge Stradale with the reference to 360 dropped), but why it is as valuable as it is.No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
The Challenge Stradale is for a modern Ferrari, a car of some historical importance. It was the first car in the Ferrari range to establish the now established trend of producing a limited edition race car for the road. it started the gravy train (for Ferrari) that so many marques now ascribe too as well. In many circumstances, as performance ceases to be a relevant factor in a car's value, a car that is a “first” often that has a premium attached to it once it transitions to classic car status or something akin to that. It would appear that the CS is now seen as more of a modern classic (which is a position that neither the Scuderia or the Speciale currently enjoy) and this again adds desirability.
It is a limited series car and fewer CS’ were made than Scuderias or Speciales (production numbers aren’t really released by the factory anymore, but it is generally accepted that more Scuderia and Speciales were made). It also by some margin the rawest of the three cars – an attribute that collectors (who are responsible for the recent rise in prices) clearly value. It is also widely considered by the majority to be one of the finest sounding modern Ferraris if not the finest – again raising the desirability factor. Finally in my view, it is a Ferrari, a limited edition Ferrari, the first truly lauded type of its kind. It’s desirability is a simple function of supply and demand. Subjectively, I can completely see why a CS might not be worth the money that is being asked for this, but objectively in my opinion, it is as clear as day.
It remains to be seen if the Speciale, which is the last of the N/A V8 racecars for the road that Ferrari is likely to build will one day outstrip the CS in value, but for the time being that does not seem to the case. The 430 Scuderia has the misfortune of neither being the first or the last of its kind, and if I were a betting man I would say that in 25 years when all these cars are firmly set as classic, it will not command the same values as the CS and Speciale.
I would add that I am not convinced if the majority would prefer the looks of a Scuderia over a Stradale. They are both handsome cars with presence and big fan followings, and both are far more visually appealing than the base cars on which they were modeled.
All just my opinion in the spirit of a healthy debate. I would be foolish to claim that I am right, but that's my 2p.
twinturban said:
Correct, so many car nuts don't understand why the 360CS is worth so much, hence this discussion. The Scuderia is hugely preferable to most, never mind the Speciale - and that's among people who like that sort of car.
No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
Yes and 'so many car nuts' also seem to like Nissan Skylines, doesn't make em right...... No-one has managed to articulate a plausible reason for preferring the 360CS nor why it could possibly be worth more than a 430 Scuderia which is simply a better version of the same sort of car. If you happen to prefer the looks of the 360 then fair enough but you'd be in a small minority in that respect.
The Strad just rocks. You either get it or you don't, but one thing's for sure, it's only going to become more and more collectable....
I wrote a detailed response down but deleted it for the benefit for those three very easily upset people that 'get' the 360CS.
Being based on a 360, it is one of the least desirable Ferraris for me. Probably best to leave it at that.
The CS is just one of many absurdly over-priced Ferraris being sold by audacious dealers and being bought by 'collectors' simply interested in financial gain. I think a few here are confusing the greatness of the capital appreciation with the greatness of the car.
When a CS is worth more than a Scuderia that's an indicator of the madness in the market, not the greatness of the CS. Once the bubble has burst we'll see what they're really worth.
Being based on a 360, it is one of the least desirable Ferraris for me. Probably best to leave it at that.
The CS is just one of many absurdly over-priced Ferraris being sold by audacious dealers and being bought by 'collectors' simply interested in financial gain. I think a few here are confusing the greatness of the capital appreciation with the greatness of the car.
When a CS is worth more than a Scuderia that's an indicator of the madness in the market, not the greatness of the CS. Once the bubble has burst we'll see what they're really worth.
twinturban said:
I wrote a detailed response down but deleted it for the benefit for those three very easily upset people that 'get' the 360CS.
Being based on a 360, it is one of the least desirable Ferraris for me. Probably best to leave it at that.
The CS is just one of many absurdly over-priced Ferraris being sold by audacious dealers and being bought by 'collectors' simply interested in financial gain. I think a few here are confusing the greatness of the capital appreciation with the greatness of the car.
When a CS is worth more than a Scuderia that's an indicator of the madness in the market, not the greatness of the CS. Once the bubble has burst we'll see what they're really worth.
I look forward to digging this thread out in a few years time and quoting you : )Being based on a 360, it is one of the least desirable Ferraris for me. Probably best to leave it at that.
The CS is just one of many absurdly over-priced Ferraris being sold by audacious dealers and being bought by 'collectors' simply interested in financial gain. I think a few here are confusing the greatness of the capital appreciation with the greatness of the car.
When a CS is worth more than a Scuderia that's an indicator of the madness in the market, not the greatness of the CS. Once the bubble has burst we'll see what they're really worth.
In the meantime I'll be enjoying my CS, both the driving experience and the capital appreciation. Certainly not feeling upset
Rock n roll
Edited by RED110T on Thursday 4th February 20:07
cat with a hat said:
RED110T said:
Yes and 'so many car nuts' also seem to like Nissan Skylines, doesn't make em right......
The Strad just rocks. You either get it or you don't, but one thing's for sure, it's only going to become more and more collectable....
HAThe Strad just rocks. You either get it or you don't, but one thing's for sure, it's only going to become more and more collectable....
Do you own a 360 cs by any chance?
RED110T said:
cat with a hat said:
RED110T said:
Yes and 'so many car nuts' also seem to like Nissan Skylines, doesn't make em right......
The Strad just rocks. You either get it or you don't, but one thing's for sure, it's only going to become more and more collectable....
HAThe Strad just rocks. You either get it or you don't, but one thing's for sure, it's only going to become more and more collectable....
Do you own a 360 cs by any chance?
twinturban said:
I wrote a detailed response down but deleted it for the benefit for those three very easily upset people that 'get' the 360CS.
Sorry, that is a really weak response. With respect, people who respond with generalities to specific points tend not to have much behind them. I'm sure you're not that sort, so please do let us have a clear and objective understanding of why you think you're right?Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff