Getting the keys to the M235 back..
Discussion
Jasandjules said:
Nope, you are working on the basis that the father would be aggressive and shout and swear at him...
Which, of course, he may well not do. And, by the time he's refused he'll either have done that or not anyway."I'm sorry, but this doesn't involve me - my daughter's asked me to look after them, and I'm not getting involved in your argument. Sorry, but goodbye. <click>"
Not much breach of the peace there, is there?
Monkeylegend said:
Personally I wouldn't give them the pleasure of holding the keys/you to ransom. I would get them deactivated but wouldn't tell them, don't mention them again, and continue your house negotiations knowing they are no longer a bargaining point.
When assuming they finally offer them back to you, I would politely tell them they can keep them as you no longer have a use for them, and haven't done for some time.
It will cost you the price of a new set, but to me it would be worth it.
Do this, but don't get them deactivated....just act like you have?When assuming they finally offer them back to you, I would politely tell them they can keep them as you no longer have a use for them, and haven't done for some time.
It will cost you the price of a new set, but to me it would be worth it.
Then if they do offer them back, you have the keys back anyway. If they don't then get the deactivated and replaced.
Grey Ghost said:
TooMany2cvs said:
get that key removed from the car's security and replaced, just the same as you would with any other lost key.
This would prevent any contact with the father. Pop into your BMW dealer and ask what the process is. May cost a few pounds but you know the other key can never be used and you can get another coded whenever you want, albeit for more pounds. I'd go and ask for the keys back.
Act politely and explain the your ex's dad that you are sorry that things don't work out between you and her and that you hope to remain friends.
If he has a decent bone in his body he'll hand them over and wish you the best.
Look at it from his point of view: whilst he appears to be acting like a bit of a dick at the moment, you should bear in mind that his daughter (she'll always be his little girl) is suffering as we all do after a break up and he's doing what he thinks is best for her.
If he still won't hand the keys over, put you hand in your pocket and buy a new set/s.
As you can afford to buy her out of the house, I'm guessing that you are not totally skint - is a couple of hundred quid really worth getting into a destructive feud over?
How a chap acts in these sort of emotionally charged situations speaks volumes about him... so conduct yourself well and move on with your life.
Act politely and explain the your ex's dad that you are sorry that things don't work out between you and her and that you hope to remain friends.
If he has a decent bone in his body he'll hand them over and wish you the best.
Look at it from his point of view: whilst he appears to be acting like a bit of a dick at the moment, you should bear in mind that his daughter (she'll always be his little girl) is suffering as we all do after a break up and he's doing what he thinks is best for her.
If he still won't hand the keys over, put you hand in your pocket and buy a new set/s.
As you can afford to buy her out of the house, I'm guessing that you are not totally skint - is a couple of hundred quid really worth getting into a destructive feud over?
How a chap acts in these sort of emotionally charged situations speaks volumes about him... so conduct yourself well and move on with your life.
shep1001 said:
If he/she won't play ball.... £120 inc coding for a new key from BMW - just replace it and drag out completing the settlement of your split, presumably she wants her cash & quick?? if so return the keys ASAP!
more like £240 for a key from BMW coded to your car.Edited by shep1001 on Monday 1st February 15:03
Jonathan, is there any possible ambiguity or potential dispute as to who owns the car? Did payments from a joint account, for example? If it's clear (i.e. could be proven beyond reasonable doubt it is your property) then there's a prima facie case of theft.
It's not blackmail (there needs to be 'menaces'). Nor should you consider the BOP suggestion for the reasoning outlined below.
The OP would likely be seen to be creating the breach since it'd be his presence at someone else's address causing the issues.
It's not blackmail (there needs to be 'menaces'). Nor should you consider the BOP suggestion for the reasoning outlined below.
Jasandjules said:
Go round and ask him politely for the keys. If he refuses, call the police and ask them to attend to prevent a breach of the peace.
The first part is sensible, the second part is terrible advice. I read somewhere you work in law, I presume it's not criminal. The OP would likely be seen to be creating the breach since it'd be his presence at someone else's address causing the issues.
You have to man up. Whatever happened in new your personal relationship does not come into this.
You have to visit him face to face. Tell him you're not there to discuss anything about the relationship-split. If he doesn't hand them over and goes off on a rant walk away. Don't drive, stay in the street.
Call the police. Tell them the situation and ask if they can help you.
Try to deal with it there and then.
You have to visit him face to face. Tell him you're not there to discuss anything about the relationship-split. If he doesn't hand them over and goes off on a rant walk away. Don't drive, stay in the street.
Call the police. Tell them the situation and ask if they can help you.
Try to deal with it there and then.
IANAL but theft requires dishonest appropriation. Willingly giving your keys to someone to look after is not dishonest appropriation on their part. Without the required intent you don't have theft. Even crossing the appropriation hurdle, you then have to prove beyond reasonable doubt intent to permanently deprive. Can't see that here.
Happy to be corrected but maybe civil remedies such as wrongful intereference are more relevant.l?
Happy to be corrected but maybe civil remedies such as wrongful intereference are more relevant.l?
I'd suggest if you go round and he refuses to hand over your keys to get straight down the dealer and get those spares removed from the cars systems so it can't be started with them.
Then get a new spare key and move on. This way you've removed any hold he might think he has over you.
It also avoids the situation of the ex turning up and taking your car with the spare keys.
Then get a new spare key and move on. This way you've removed any hold he might think he has over you.
It also avoids the situation of the ex turning up and taking your car with the spare keys.
Audidodat said:
IANAL but theft requires dishonest appropriation. Willingly giving your keys to someone to look after is not dishonest appropriation on their part. Without the required intent you don't have theft. Even crossing the appropriation hurdle, you then have to prove beyond reasonable doubt intent to permanently deprive. Can't see that here.
Happy to be corrected but maybe civil remedies such as wrongful intereference are more relevant.l?
The dishonesty is formed when he decides not to give the key back. The dishonesty doesn't need to occur at the point of appropriation or have anything to do with the original purpose and reason for which he acquired the property. Happy to be corrected but maybe civil remedies such as wrongful intereference are more relevant.l?
Permanent deprivation is more complex than simply keeping something permanently - if not most thieves would just say, 'I was going to return it'.
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