Niche versions which outlived the base car

[jamiebae]

shakotan said:

ch108 said:

gazzarose said:

I think the Escort van carried on for a fair few years after the Escort turned into the Focus.

I remember a pal of mine had a hired Escort van on a 51 reg, must have been one of the last.

The Mk5 Astravan outlived its car variants, as did the Peugeot 305 van and 504 pickup.

The Mk6/7 Escort hatch was available up to 2001 also, there's a few on 51-plates still lingering.

Ford kept building them at Halewood to fill the gap between the launch of the Focus and the Jag X Type coming into production, ostensibly to improve the quality and way the plant operated. In theory these late Escorts should be better built than the earlier ones, but it's probably just marketing spin to persuade people to buy them when the far superior Focus was also available.

[Oakman]

A lot of recent Kia non SUV's appear to be previous generation GM bodyshells/vehicles, previous generations Astras etc. Even one of their estates looks like a 1st Gen Ford Mondeo. Plus they have a people carrier that is a Mercedes Vito/Van shell.

It makes sense I guess that massive manufacturers sell their tooling etc to upcoming companies who can't afford the immense pre production costs.

Isn't there an early 1950's British Morris still made in India today ?

[jamiebae]

Oakman said:

A lot of recent Kia non SUV's appear to be previous generation GM bodyshells/vehicles, previous generations Astras etc. Even one of their estates looks like a 1st Gen Ford Mondeo. Plus they have a people carrier that is a Mercedes Vito/Van shell.

You what?! None of the above is even close to true.

Hyundai sold an SUV which used to be a Mitsubishi until about 10 years ago, the Kia Pride was a Mazda 121 but they haven't sold anything but their own designs in Europe for at least 10 years, probably more.

[Truckosaurus]

Whilst Oakman might need a trip to SpecSavers, Kia have hired an ex-Audi designer so there could be some similarity there.

[johnpsanderson]

Agent57 said:

Wasn't the Mini supposed to be replaced by the Metro?

Surprised no-one else has picked this point up.

The OP was talking about 'niche versions' and it seems that the van/estate versions are just about the only instances where this really happens. I guess the Mini Clubman estate may have outlived the saloon Clubman too?

The instances of other companies picking up another manufacturers model aren't really in the vein I think he intended - IIRC remember Daewoo started out in the UK in the 90s with rebadged, earlier mk, Vauxhall Astras for example. Not really a continuation of what Vauxhall were doing themselves though?

But is the the Mini the only example of a car which actually completely outlived the car which replaced it, as Agent57 points out...?

I think another interesting thread would be 'cars where the 'newer' model was less advanced (e.g. the Ford Escort became less aerodynamic when it went from Mk1 to Mk2....)

[andyps]

johnpsanderson said:

Surprised no-one else has picked this point up.

The OP was talking about 'niche versions' and it seems that the van/estate versions are just about the only instances where this really happens. I guess the Mini Clubman estate may have outlived the saloon Clubman too?

The instances of other companies picking up another manufacturers model aren't really in the vein I think he intended - IIRC remember Daewoo started out in the UK in the 90s with rebadged, earlier mk, Vauxhall Astras for example. Not really a continuation of what Vauxhall were doing themselves though?

But is the the Mini the only example of a car which actually completely outlived the car which replaced it, as Agent57 points out...?

I think another interesting thread would be 'cars where the 'newer' model was less advanced (e.g. the Ford Escort became less aerodynamic when it went from Mk1 to Mk2....)

Think it was mentioned relatively early on. The other example of a car outliving its intended replacement which has also been mentioned is the 911 which outlived the 928 which was meant to replace it.

[johnpsanderson]

andyps said:

Think it was mentioned relatively early on.

Doh! 1st page, you're right. And the longevity of the 2CV a good shout too!

[anonymous-user]

johnpsanderson said:

But is the the Mini the only example of a car which actually completely outlived the car which replaced it, as Agent57 points out...?

I think the Porsche 928 was intended to replace the 911. Does that count?

[aka_kerrly]

smilo996 said:

Polo hatchback.

Never seen the Polo saloon but it was much more popular as was the three door estate.

Same seemed to happen with the Golf hatch which outsold the original and more traditional booted Golf.

You can get a 2 door Polo saloon in mk1/2/2F models.

The bready continued in production a little longer than saloons an coupes.

Regarding the Maestros, there were a few built by a company in Ledbury near the Forest of Dean,hence there are a few W,X, Y 51/52 plate Maestros in the area. All are woeful spec, no Vp or turbos

[Zombie]

Alfa SZ & RZ - based, albeit loosely, on the 75...

Delta integrale has been mentioned hasn't it? But the last of them weren't built by lancia...

Alfa gt I think this may have outlived the 156 on which it's based.

Merc G wagon has to be worth a mention?

[Zombie]

jamiebae said:

shakotan said:

ch108 said:

gazzarose said:

I think the Escort van carried on for a fair few years after the Escort turned into the Focus.

I remember a pal of mine had a hired Escort van on a 51 reg, must have been one of the last.

The Mk5 Astravan outlived its car variants, as did the Peugeot 305 van and 504 pickup.

The Mk6/7 Escort hatch was available up to 2001 also, there's a few on 51-plates still lingering.

Ford kept building them at Halewood to fill the gap between the launch of the Focus and the Jag X Type coming into production, ostensibly to improve the quality and way the plant operated. In theory these late Escorts should be better built than the earlier ones, but it's probably just marketing spin to persuade people to buy them when the far superior Focus was also available.

Escort cosworth? Or did the mk4/5 soldier on for longer?

[jamiebae]

Zombie said:

jamiebae said:

shakotan said:

ch108 said:

gazzarose said:

I think the Escort van carried on for a fair few years after the Escort turned into the Focus.

I remember a pal of mine had a hired Escort van on a 51 reg, must have been one of the last.

The Mk5 Astravan outlived its car variants, as did the Peugeot 305 van and 504 pickup.

The Mk6/7 Escort hatch was available up to 2001 also, there's a few on 51-plates still lingering.

Ford kept building them at Halewood to fill the gap between the launch of the Focus and the Jag X Type coming into production, ostensibly to improve the quality and way the plant operated. In theory these late Escorts should be better built than the earlier ones, but it's probably just marketing spin to persuade people to buy them when the far superior Focus was also available.

Escort cosworth? Or did the mk4/5 soldier on for longer?

This was just the dreary 1.6 petrol and 1.8 derv models, the Cosworth was long gone by then sadly.

[MarshPhantom]

aka_kerrly said:

You can get a 2 door Polo saloon in mk1/2/2F models.

The bready continued in production a little longer than saloons an coupes.

Regarding the Maestros, there were a few built by a company in Ledbury near the Forest of Dean,hence there are a few W,X, Y 51/52 plate Maestros in the area. All are woeful spec, no Vp or turbos

I seem to remember seeing some for sale "new" for about £3.5k

[egoold]

I am sure the C5 Audi A6 allroad was in production for a year after the new C6 Audi A6 had been launched. Remember seeing an old style allroad in an Audi showroom next to the newer version A6

[DiscoColin]

DrSteveBrule said:

johnpsanderson said:

But is the the Mini the only example of a car which actually completely outlived the car which replaced it, as Agent57 points out...?

I think the Porsche 928 was intended to replace the 911. Does that count?

I'd have to say a guarded yes to that one. The more interesting thing about this was that the 928 was in production in essentially the same form for 18 years, overlapping 4 generations of the 911 that it was intended to replace...

Edited by DiscoColin on Thursday 11th February 18:39

[ch108]

I think the mk1 Megane coupe and the cabriolet were sold alongside the mk2 model. (The one with the funny rear end).

[Earl of Petrol]

Somebody's already brought up the Viva HA thing, and I think Renault did the Campus idea with the R5 when the original Clio went on sale. Hillman Hunters were sold in Iran long after it expired here. And there's the Hindustan Ambassador sold in India until recently (or still going on?) which is a 50s Morris Oxford. I think we've gone off the original 'niche' models subject a bit here....
And you could still buy the Alfsud 105 ti Green Cloverleaf for a couple of years after the launch of the 33 I know because I did, praise the Lord! Where are you now A263UCA?

[jamiebae]

Earl of Petrol said:

And you could still buy the Alfsud 105 ti Green Cloverleaf for a couple of years after the launch of the 33 I know because I did, praise the Lord! Where are you now A263UCA?

Bean cans I'm afraid. It was written off in 1988 and recorded as scrapped in 2001 (so I guess it was repaired post write-off).

[Fastchas]

I seem to remember the Maestro van going on for a while after the car was ended... (or maybe it just felt like it did, hanging around like a bad smell...)

[anonymous-user]

Mk1 Golf Cabrio has been mentioned but actually the tin-top Mk1 lived on until 2009. They were still being produced in South Africa and while renamed Citi Golf, essentially they were Mk1s. That's a 36 year production run!

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/final-v...