Am I the only one that doesn't get interest in hot hatches?

[Galveston]

Sitting outside on the drive (next to some boring day-to-day stuff) I have a 205 1.6 GTi and a Clio 172 Cup, both entirely standard. The Clio was supposed to be a temporary stand-in while the 205 has yet another rebuild, but I've fallen in love and it's now a permanent member of the fleet. I wouldn't consider swapping either for the OP's TT or Jaguar saloon, or actually any of the more modern heavier breed of hot hatches which just don't interest me at all.

This thread does make me question my motives though. I'm 36, I don't need rear seats, and I could afford a much more exotic toy. But this side of a GT3 RS there isn't anything that really appeals. Both little French cars are thoroughly exciting to drive; they're light, they're nimble, they're extremely adjustable, and they both come alive and become even more rewarding when they're driven hard. There are certainly faster and more capable cars, and I've driven many of them, but I think there are very few that are more fun to punt down a typical British B-road.

[egor110]

Spot on galveston, light and nimble are what hot hatches should be not massive horse power to compensate for the extra weight they now carry.

[Simes205]

Agree too, also bias.
My little French tin only does about 700 miles a year now but everyone is memorable!
Lightweight and modified it has about 205bhp / ton!

[nickfrog]

Swift Sport is still around for very little money. Light, pointy and uncorrupted. Bigger/heavier hatches also have their place, they have effectively replaced the small saloons that are now bigger. So much so that they do saloon versions too, like the A3 saloon.

[Sump]

It's about allowing kids/adults who can'f afford a proper car to go a bit faster without a huge outlay in running costs and purchase cost.

[egor110]

Sump said:

It's about allowing kids/adults who can'f afford a proper car to go a bit faster without a huge outlay in running costs and purchase cost.

In some situations a hot hatch is going to be faster than far more expensive cars, twisty b roads or tight tracks like cadwell or brands indy i'd prefer the hot hatch however somewhere bigger like thruxton or silverstone or motorways something more exotic is going to have room to stretch it's legs.

[TheJimi]

Sump said:

It's about allowing kids/adults who can'f afford a proper car to go a bit faster without a huge outlay in running costs and purchase cost.

Ok, what's a "proper car"?

[Galveston]

Sump said:

It's about allowing kids/adults who can'f afford a proper car to go a bit faster without a huge outlay in running costs and purchase cost.

No it's not, it's just about fun. I know it's subjective but there really aren't many cars of any value that are more fun to chuck along a B-road than a good 205 GTi, 106 Rallye, Clio Cup etc.

[MrBarry123]

Sump said:

It's about allowing kids/adults who can'f afford a proper car to go a bit faster without a huge outlay in running costs and purchase cost.

I think you'd have to be ill-informed to assert that the current crop of hot-hatches are not serious pieces of machinery that could spank [probably] 95% of other cars on the road.

Either that or it's because you're jealous as you're now too fat and/or old to look cool in one.

[framerateuk]

docter fox said:

I have a 3.0 Z4 in the garage and I'm looking to buy a hot hatch as my daily... Why? Because I'm bored with a diesel focus and want a bit more fun more of the time but don't want to run the Z4 every day...

Edit to add - no kids, dogs or friends to cart about frequently

Nailed it. And that's why they're so great.

Practical, accessible performance that you can use every day.

And the really good ones give you even more back once you start to push them. They're just as good to drive as similarly priced sports cars (I'd argue better in most cases).

[heebeegeetee]

stephen300o said:

Nope, of course not. Hot hatch's roots are just those cars made cheaply, by having fwd in a tidy parcel stuck in the front.
The embarrassing cousin of the mature rwd drivers car.

Yes, they've been embarrassing rwd "drivers" cars since the Mini Cooper onwards. In fact remembering them, they were so embarrassing that they had to be banned. Then they came back and showed every one up again.

[Baryonyx]

It all depends on the hot hatch. I like them in general as they are accessible, practical cars that you can use every day and do 'everything' within reason.

However, some hot hatches give so much more back. Some are as amazing as any dedicated sports car. The 106 Rallye, for instance - the handling and feedback is just incredible. Lotus couldn't do much better with a custom built car with the engine mounted amidships and fk all in the way of interior or practicality. Peugeot managed this feat with a shopping car!

Some drivers will deride hot hatches because they don't have the snob appeal of a dedicated sports car, but they're missing a real treat. I wonder if those same snobs know I'm looking down my nose as them as I ride past on my sports bike because if they were really dedicated to performance and enjoyment they'd be on a sports bike too

[Lagerlout]

I've got some pretty powerful and rare sports cars yet my favourite car is my Fiat 500 Abarth with 300 bhp that weighs in at 900 kg. It's an absolute riot to drive, hangs on like a limpet, revs like a nutter and makes me giggle like a school kid. I'd sell all the other ones before I'd sell my Fiat..!

Edited by Lagerlout on Wednesday 10th February 00:11

[Bibbs]

Joratk said:

I just can't get turned on by any form of hot hatch at all.

Totally agree.

I keep seeing posts about the Golf and Focus, I can't get excited about them at all.

It's just a hatchback. Usually means small engine and FWD dynamics even if a few top trim level ones have 4WD systems.

I've had one hatchback in my car history (Citroen AX GT) and I'd not go back.

[Bibbs]

Hudson said:

Let me put it this way. Imagine you are a petrolhead, but only have room for one car. You need to chuck the shopping in it and occasionally the girlfriend/wife/kids. Do you:

A- get a hot hatch to get all of the benefits of a practical hatchback with the extra performance for when you are out on your own and fancy a hoon
B- get a base model hatchback, safe in the knowledge that you could get a second hand M3 for that sort of money
Bonus PH answer - sack the wife and kids off and get a Caterham

C- Not get a hatchback.

In your example, I'd get the "second hand M3" (I wouldn't get a BMW, but you know what I mean).

[BricktopST205]

Hot hatches do not really interest me in the slightest. They are too fast for the roads. I have powerful cars (Over 600HP between my daily and weekender) but it's the little warm hatches that interest me more. Very similar to what was available in the 80's but in a modern shell. Things like the Swift Sport, Lupo Gti, 500 Abarth etc. People always say having too much power for the road and they are correct in the sense that the road is too full to thoroughly enjoy that power. Yet you can rev the pants off these little warm hatches, have the sense of speed, look down at the speedo and you are still doing 60mph not 120+!

Really would love to get a Lupo GTi into the fleet to replace the missus Ignis Sport when the mileage gets a bit high but prices on those are starting to creep up so might just get a current gen swift sport by then. Ideally I would love a Corolla GTi (My favourite 80's hot hatch) but I just do not have the space and I think the other half would leave me if I had 3 cars on the go plus hers!

Edited by BricktopST205 on Wednesday 10th February 02:27

[powerstroke]

TheJimi said:

Sump said:

It's about allowing kids/adults who can'f afford a proper car to go a bit faster without a huge outlay in running costs and purchase cost.

Ok, what's a "proper car"?

A simple RWD with a V8 , nothing wrong with a tiny light simple cheaper car that drives the front wheels and has a revy engine either but they haven't made them since the 90s now they are heavy ,understeer and a loaded up with junk like abs and ESP ...

[Devil2575]

Bibbs said:

Hudson said:

Let me put it this way. Imagine you are a petrolhead, but only have room for one car. You need to chuck the shopping in it and occasionally the girlfriend/wife/kids. Do you:

A- get a hot hatch to get all of the benefits of a practical hatchback with the extra performance for when you are out on your own and fancy a hoon
B- get a base model hatchback, safe in the knowledge that you could get a second hand M3 for that sort of money
Bonus PH answer - sack the wife and kids off and get a Caterham

C- Not get a hatchback.

In your example, I'd get the "second hand M3" (I wouldn't get a BMW, but you know what I mean).

How would you buy a 2nd hand M3?

There are none. Everyone who would buy a new M3 is buying a 2nd hand Porsche because why would you buy a new car when you could get a better one 2nd hand for the same money?

Joking aside, can you not see how a 2nd hand M3 does not do the same job as a hatchback? Can you fold the rear seats down and load up at B&Q in an M3. Tip run?
I had a 3 series saloon and it wasn't half as practical as my wifes Focus hatch. Running costs were also an order of magnitude higher, and that was just a 330i not an M3. You might be able to afford to buy an M3 rather than a Golf GTI but you might not want the significantly higher running costs.

[nickfrog]

E

Bibbs said:

Joratk said:

I just can't get turned on by any form of hot hatch at all.

Totally agree.

I keep seeing posts about the Golf and Focus, I can't get excited about them at all.

It's just a hatchback. Usually means small engine and FWD dynamics even if a few top trim level ones have 4WD systems.

I've had one hatchback in my car history (Citroen AX GT) and I'd not go back.

See my earlier post about a 3L RWD hatch. They are available for little money new.

[GreenArrow]

Its horses for courses. Personally I don't get cars like Audi TTs which aren't really sports cars, but don't have adequate room for four people, but each to their own.

Love a good hot hatch....just the right size and performance for a range of Uk roads, they normally go well on typical windy, bumpy British A and B Roads and are comfortable enough to sit on the motorway at 80. Plus, you can get a decent amount in the book, fold down the rear seats for transporting bulky stuff and you can carry two decent sized people In the back. I sat in the back of our 205 GTI many times and it had more leg room than our Audi A3.

Plus, newer hot hatches like Leon Cupras and Meganes are now sorted enough to scare proper quick cars like M3s on track days....

As a swiss army knife sort of car, whats not to like?