RE: BMW M2: Review
Discussion
Guvernator said:
Ares said:
Piped in noise is wholly undetectable. Mine has it, with it deactivated there is no difference. Ditto the M4. It's an issue people love you whinge about yet most have probably never sampled it and realised what a case of Emperors New Clothes it is.
Sorry not wanting to add fuel to the fire but I've sampled the piped in noise on an M4 and it's horrid to the point that after 15 mins in it, that's all I could hear. It's one of thos once heard, you can't un-hear it type scenarios.. There was even a whole PH article on it so lots of people obviously feel the same way. What makes it even more weird is that when people finally worked out a relatively easy way turn it off, the car sounds much better so not really sure why BMW feel the need to do it tbh.giger said:
I honestly don't know what most people here are smoking. It has been reviewed by most of the worlds top motoring press on track in M DCT spec and on local roads around Laguna Sec in Manual spec. Everyone has loved the car, giving it either 4, 4.5 or 5 out of 5! That's pretty incredible. The weight has been mentioned in a number of reviews, but no one has said that it spoils the drive. The rev matching has also been mentioned, but again no one has said that it spoils the drive. No one that reviewed it has commented negatively about the synthesised sound (which many cars use).
Why the hate?!
Because it is a BMW MWhy the hate?!
Because this is Pistonheads
Because it has things like piped in noise that even if you have never heard it, you decide it wholly ruins a car.
kambites said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I just tend to think back to my XR4x4's, a 2.9 V6 and 4WD but weighed 1250kg, maybe it's just my own train of thought but I just think 1400kg plus as being a heavy car.
The BMW is a "luxury" car first and a performance car second. The Sierra was not. 
kambites said:
I could easily imagine that such systems could be droney and horrible in normal driving and unnoticeable or nice sounding thrashing a car around a track.
Mind you that's true of plenty of actual exhausts systems too.
Truth is, they are 99% undetectable on road or track. And most on the detection is in the pre-decided drivers' mind.Mind you that's true of plenty of actual exhausts systems too.
cerb4.5lee said:
kambites said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I just tend to think back to my XR4x4's, a 2.9 V6 and 4WD but weighed 1250kg, maybe it's just my own train of thought but I just think 1400kg plus as being a heavy car.
The BMW is a "luxury" car first and a performance car second. The Sierra was not. And the latest ones are still about the lightest of their contemporaries. M3/M4 Vs Competitors.
It's absolutely a performance car. It's not a sports car but it has never really claimed to be.kambites said:
Ares said:
Truth is, they are 99% undetectable on road or track. And most on the detection is in the pre-decided drivers' mind.
Then why do they install it? Ares said:
No idea. The guys on the M-power day we went on (BMW and BMW Racing Drivers) suggested it was for the US market where boise regs keep the real engine note quieter, and thus the piped in noise is more relevant. European spec means there is minimal difference.
Given the number of people who complain about it, you've got to wonder why they don't give an option to turn it off. But then you could argue that about a lot of "features" like the stupid auto-blip. Ares said:
cerb4.5lee said:
kambites said:
cerb4.5lee said:
I just tend to think back to my XR4x4's, a 2.9 V6 and 4WD but weighed 1250kg, maybe it's just my own train of thought but I just think 1400kg plus as being a heavy car.
The BMW is a "luxury" car first and a performance car second. The Sierra was not. And the latest ones are still about the lightest of their contemporaries. M3/M4 Vs Competitors.
cerb4.5lee said:
Yes I suppose they do try to be all things to all men/women and that is a very difficult thing to judge, BMW are a Luxury car maker overall and at least they do try to make some of their model variants feel a little sporty by modifying them...shame the base product is such a lard arse though!
As has been pointed out though, at worst it's the same weight as the competition and typically it's lighter, if only marginally so. kambites said:
cerb4.5lee said:
Yes I suppose they do try to be all things to all men/women and that is a very difficult thing to judge, BMW are a Luxury car maker overall and at least they do try to make some of their model variants feel a little sporty by modifying them...shame the base product is such a lard arse though!
As has been pointed out though, at worst it's the same weight as the competition and typically it's lighter, if only marginally so. Ares said:
I genuinely find that difficult to believe. I did an M-Power day, some of the M4s and M3s had it turned off, others left untouched (ditto the M6/M5s. Most of us couldn't tell any difference, road and track. The only three that claimed they could were those that had been citing it is as a 'ruinous' addition before driving.....and 2 of the 3 guessed the wrong cars anyway!!
Dan Trent on this very site did the mod on the M4 long termer and stated in no uncertain terms that it was much improved when turned off. I've heard an M4 with and without the mod, I'm not an audiophile or claim I have super sensitive hearing either but I certainly heard a difference. With the noise system on it sounds fake to me, plain and simple. Maybe you and the people on the track day need hearing tests? That's as much my prerogative to claim as you stating that people who can hear a difference are basically lying or talking rubbish.
kambites said:
Ares said:
No idea. The guys on the M-power day we went on (BMW and BMW Racing Drivers) suggested it was for the US market where boise regs keep the real engine note quieter, and thus the piped in noise is more relevant. European spec means there is minimal difference.
Given the number of people who complain about it, you've got to wonder why they don't give an option to turn it off. But then you could argue that about a lot of "features" like the stupid auto-blip. 
Guvernator said:
Ares said:
I genuinely find that difficult to believe. I did an M-Power day, some of the M4s and M3s had it turned off, others left untouched (ditto the M6/M5s. Most of us couldn't tell any difference, road and track. The only three that claimed they could were those that had been citing it is as a 'ruinous' addition before driving.....and 2 of the 3 guessed the wrong cars anyway!!
Dan Trent on this very site did the mod on the M4 long termer and stated in no uncertain terms that it was much improved when turned off. I've heard an M4 with and without the mod, I'm not an audiophile or claim I have super sensitive hearing either but I certainly heard a difference. With the noise system on it sounds fake to me, plain and simple. Maybe you and the people on the track day need hearing tests? That's as much my prerogative to claim as you stating that people who can hear a difference are basically lying or talking rubbish.
As for hearings test of those on the M Power day.... My hearing is A1 (or it was as of last October) and two of the others were Andy Priaulx and Alexander Sims.
Guvernator said:
Seeing as everyone seems to be at it, I'm wondering if there is some noise legislation due to come in that we are unaware of which might necessitate a need for the noise generators. It certainly seems to be an area of focus for a lot of manufacturers now.
See my comment about the US above!Ares said:
Sometimes that auto-blip is great though. Changing down in an RS6 and getting that blip and it's crackles is awesome
Agreed, which is why you should be able to turn it on and off. It's purely a software feature, it would cost them no more than the profit on a handful of cars to implement a stand-alone option to turn it off. Since they aren't doing so, one has to imagine that less than a handful of customers actually want that option. Same with the fake sound thing, I suppose; if the market demanded a menu option to turn it off, they'd have developed one.
I suspect the after-market will increasingly start to cater for this sort of thing.
Edited by kambites on Monday 22 February 14:56
Guvernator said:
Dan Trent on this very site did the mod on the M4 long termer and stated in no uncertain terms that it was much improved when turned off. I've heard an M4 with and without the mod, I'm not an audiophile or claim I have super sensitive hearing either but I certainly heard a difference. With the noise system on it sounds fake to me, plain and simple.
Maybe you and the people on the track day need hearing tests? That's as much my prerogative to claim as you stating that people who can hear a difference are basically lying or talking rubbish.
Unless you or Dan did the sound test double blind then it's a pointless test, if you knew when you were in a carvwith it on or off your judgment is totally skewed.Maybe you and the people on the track day need hearing tests? That's as much my prerogative to claim as you stating that people who can hear a difference are basically lying or talking rubbish.
Fwiw the M135i ive got sounds pretty good from the cabin, I didn't know it had noise pumped in until a month or so after i got it.
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